Login / Register
 
Recording/monitoring chain balance
New Reply
Subscribe
Lemonsqueezer
Thread Starter
#1
3rd January 2009
Old 3rd January 2009
  #1
Lives for gear
 
Lemonsqueezer's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,483

Thread Starter
Lemonsqueezer is offline
Recording/monitoring chain balance

This is fundamentally a question of how a budget would get split up, or for some the next step in upgrading the signal path (most bang for your bucks).

A commercial studio would have spent a lot on the construction of the studio and room treatments. I am fortunate that I have access to facilities like these, albeit not high end but beggars can't be choosers.

I am thinking in the context of my home set up. Which will be used for mixing and some recording; vocals, some acoustic instruments and some electric guitar (including re-amping). I have a 002 rack but won't be upgrading to Protools HD. But I don't wish to use anything else other than Protools. I have Mackie HR824's on Auralex supports (best upgrade I made so far). I also have a Focusrite Trakmaster Pro, SE Electronics 2200a mic, Senneheiser HD421 II and a SE Electronics Reflexion filter.

I plan to get some stands and get my speakers in a perfect equilateral triangle with out having to move back a few feet as I currently do.

So what should get priority?

Room treatment? Microphones? Pre amps? a/d d/a converters?

Can you place them in order of priority?

Is there any consensus on this?

#2
3rd January 2009
Old 3rd January 2009
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: Simi Valley, CA
Posts: 535

chrysb93065 is offline
Maybe a bit more info is needed. Are you tracking in the control room (is it a one-room facility)? If so, then room treatment is absolutely next. If you have a separate tracking room, then STILL treat the control room, as you mentioned tracking was secondary. Your mixing environment will be critical to clean mixes. Everything you listed is definitely functional, although mostly 'pro-sumer' level. However, very professional results can be obtained with what you have.
Lemonsqueezer
Thread Starter
#3
3rd January 2009
Old 3rd January 2009
  #3
Lives for gear
 
Lemonsqueezer's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,483

Thread Starter
Lemonsqueezer is offline
I have access to other facilities for tracking and sometimes mixing. But occasionally I will have someone round at home to do a vocal overdub or an acoustic guitar part, that kinda thing. This is a one room affair. So i usually track though headphones (Sennheiser HD-25-1's) and then check it back through monitors after the take.

I also write electronic music, mainly downbeat IDM and minimal. And I also do the odd bit of live recording.
Lemonsqueezer
Thread Starter
#4
6th January 2009
Old 6th January 2009
  #4
Lives for gear
 
Lemonsqueezer's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,483

Thread Starter
Lemonsqueezer is offline
#5
6th January 2009
Old 6th January 2009
  #5
Gear Guru
 
tINY's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2004
Location: Orygun
Posts: 12,105

tINY is offline

adequate monitors and acoustic treatment are going to be paramount....

What's the room like? That will drive a lot of your acoustic needs.




-tINY

#6
6th January 2009
Old 6th January 2009
  #6
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,075

Kiwiburger is offline
Sometimes the best thing is to simpy throw together what you have, and buy the minimum gear necessary to get started. Then, you can work on assessing the weakest link in the chain. Otherwise you can suffer from the 'paralysis of analysis' and forever be dreaming of the next big purchase that will complete your studio ...

Make a mix - see what it sounds like. It should become obvious what is letting you down the most. Quite often its very boring basic stuff. It might be tempting to think that a new preamp or converter will solve the problem, but rarely is that the real problem.

Getting back to your title question ... monitoring is critical, because nothing affects a performance more than bad monitoring ... or nothing coaxes out the best possible performance more than excellent monitoring. I'm a huge fan of investing in analog zero latency headphone monitoring (as opposed to the near-zero digital options that are marketing features of every interface these days. Near zero is not Zero latency - therefore these should All be marketed as Combe-Filter monitoring ... think about it).

When you track vocals, or guitars (esp Bass), bone conduction and acoustic leakage is a big part of what the performer hears while tracking. If you send them a phasey delayed dry sound, this can be disturbing. Disturbing the talent is not a good thing. Not even subconsciously.

A simple mixer can give you zero latency monitoring. Whether you want some reverb in the monitor mix is highly debateable - but it's all about keeping the talent happy (and in tune and in time). This can be done with software, if you know how to set up a blend of analog dry sound and digital wet sound (which can afford to be a little delayed).

Everything else matters - it's just a question of priorities. Nobody will know exactly which brick wall you are going to hit next, except for you when you hit it.

FWIW.
Lemonsqueezer
Thread Starter
#7
6th January 2009
Old 6th January 2009
  #7
Lives for gear
 
Lemonsqueezer's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,483

Thread Starter
Lemonsqueezer is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by tINY View Post

adequate monitors and acoustic treatment are going to be paramount....

What's the room like? That will drive a lot of your acoustic needs.
I have pretty much decided that working on the monitoring is the best thing I can do to begin with as it will aid all other decisions.

This is going to include speaker stands, a cheap omni test mic and as much DIY treatment as I can manage within the my own set of constraints.
Lemonsqueezer
Thread Starter
#8
6th January 2009
Old 6th January 2009
  #8
Lives for gear
 
Lemonsqueezer's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,483

Thread Starter
Lemonsqueezer is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwiburger View Post
Getting back to your title question ... monitoring is critical, because nothing affects a performance more than bad monitoring ... or nothing coaxes out the best possible performance more than excellent monitoring. I'm a huge fan of investing in analog zero latency headphone monitoring (as opposed to the near-zero digital options that are marketing features of every interface these days. Near zero is not Zero latency - therefore these should All be marketed as Combe-Filter monitoring ... think about it).
I think I understand you. In my set up I get about 5ms latency when I select the option in Protools. Now for sending a guide track to the vocalist for their overdub this is all OK until I give them some of themselves via the DAW.....as they go through 2 steps of conversion.

So for example I could go through a Mackie 1642 VLZPRO that I have and avoid this. For me there are some downsides to this option, but these probably would be quite small. The preamps in the 002 might be better than the Mackie. The direct outs on the Mackie are post fader and EQ, it does have an option for tapping off the inserts but I have found this option to be a poor mechanical connection.

For me with what I equipment I have then it would seem the monitoring options on my Trakmaster PRO would be the best way to implement latency free monitoring and preserve the signal chain. Though of course then I can't use the 002 preamps for this task, but then hey why did I get the Trakmaster. I guess it then becomes difficult to set up reverb with this option....but the verb can come from the DAW and the latency would be irrelevant and could even be compensated for by reducing the pre delay, but I would imagine that this is not necessary.

Thanks for provoking me to think about this aspect. An oversight on my part.

I'll go wire it up later thumbsup
#9
6th January 2009
Old 6th January 2009
  #9
Gear Guru
 
tINY's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2004
Location: Orygun
Posts: 12,105

tINY is offline


The interfaces with digital cue mixers built in are as latency free as any analog mixer.

A delay in effects is probably not an issue if it's less than 15-20ms. But that much on the dry signal can cause problems.




-tINY

New Reply Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook  Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter  Submit Thread to LinkedIn LinkedIn  Submit Thread to Google+ Google+ 
 
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
jimcroisdale / Live Sound
16
Lefran├žais / So much gear, so little time!
1
Brian Middleton / So much gear, so little time!
19

Forum Jump

SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.