Saturation plugins.. Where have you been my whole life!

[DP40oz]

So i finally bought PSP MixSaturator2 and jesus! This is what ive been missing in every mix ive done ITB. Basically using the Charles Dye method of putting just a touch of them on almost every track and the mix bus has completely brought my mixes to a new level.

I never could understand why my mixes sounded too real. It was like watching a sitcom rather then film. For years ive struggled with my reverbs and delays being too present. I couldnt get why the singer always sounded just too up front and not record like. How are these plugins not talked about all the time. I own all the UAD stuff, the Waves SSL plugs and no matter how good they sounded i never could get "That" sound. Now my mixes gel and i can be way more creative without the fear that a hall reverb is gonna sound completely huge and fake, everything just sounds right now. Ive been mixing professionally for years and this has to be one of the biggest realizations ive ever had. Just had to post this because it seems like nobody talks about the power of these plugins enough. Needless to say i will be getting the URS Saturation plug ASAP.

[AMIEL]

Well that will be maybe one of the first steps of discovering the new level of mixing...
wait until you get use to the saturation plug ins..and then you will see...mmm but the vibe and dimension of my mixes can be better...then..the tonal balance is not right, then the low end, the stereo image.

Now if you already nailed that...awesome---
Try other ways to gel a mix...inter bus auxs---

and maybe later you will say...mmm i think this saturation is not the one I am really looking for...but this is what make mixing a fun art.

anyway is great that you discover something that feels like a new source of knowledge and technique for your mixes..
Try URS and Massey Saturators and tape

[piotr]

Originally Posted by DP40oz

So i finally bought PSP MixSaturator2 and jesus! This is what ive been missing in every mix ive done ITB. Basically using the Charles Dye method of putting just a touch of them on almost every track and the mix bus has completely brought my mixes to a new level.

I never could understand why my mixes sounded too real. It was like watching a sitcom rather then film. For years ive struggled with my reverbs and delays being too present. I couldnt get why the singer always sounded just too up front and not record like. How are these plugins not talked about all the time. I own all the UAD stuff, the Waves SSL plugs and no matter how good they sounded i never could get "That" sound. Now my mixes gel and i can be way more creative without the fear that a hall reverb is gonna sound completely huge and fake, everything just sounds right now. Ive been mixing professionally for years and this has to be one of the biggest realizations ive ever had. Just had to post this because it seems like nobody talks about the power of these plugins enough. Needless to say i will be getting the URS Saturation plug ASAP.

Sounds interesting.
So you got the PSP MixPack, right? It doesn't seem that you can just buy this saturation plugin alone?... How is the CPU usage on it? The Vintage Warmer is a CPU hog, I like what it does, but it really eats CPU for lunch.
I wonder if this is the case with all the PSP plugins...
p.

[Mr.HOLMES]

Later you will find out your mix is getting more 3 D with real saturation hardware like SPL Charisma or a tape recorder.

Sometimes it is the thing a mix needs other times like claisical stuff it is better to go without saturation.

later you will find out that you can recreate a real space with reverb and delays on the lead vox ... and you will gel your mix with this too.

congratulations on this topic it is very interesting listen to the beatles you find a lot of saturation in these mixes near to distortion even on the lead vox.

[Kiwiburger]

There is a world of saturation effects to explore - in some ways I think PC VST freebies have the leap on most of the commercial stuff, because there are hackers out there who make plugs just for the joy of sound, rather than as a commercial venture with an expensive brand name partner sucking all the profits out ... but I digress.

PSP MixSaturator is a good one. Voxengo has some nice stuff - even the free TubeAmp. But don't ignore some of the more experimental projects, which are typically non-commercial freebies. I find they have less hassels attached - no dongles for a start - and they all have unique flavours.

There are many types of distortion, and one that doesn't get modelled much is crossover distortion. It's inherent in many analog circuits (not everything is Class A all the way through) and it can inject some realismn into boring digital tracks.

The more I listen to vintage tracks I love, the more saturation I hear - and when you consider the circuit paths that were involved, it's not surprising. And each circuit in the chain was adding hairs to the hairs that the previous circuit added ...

I'm not convinced that digital distortion can withstand the compounded layers of distortion that analog could ... that's why I try to track as much real analog filth as I can to start with.

I think we've become too obsessed with sterile clean sound - it's hard habit to break - but I think it's gone too far.

Bring back the dirt!

[engmix]

Originally Posted by Kiwiburger

I think we've become too obsessed with sterile clean sound - it's hard habit to break - but I think it's gone too far.

Bring back the dirt!

i recently was mixing a record where there was a couple of tracks with a fair bit of noise. i decided to clean it up out of a knee jerk reaction, and found after the fact, that the mix lost some character. i put the noise back in, and bingo.

[virtualsamana]

Originally Posted by Kiwiburger

PSP MixSaturator is a good one. Voxengo has some nice stuff - even the free TubeAmp. But don't ignore some of the more experimental projects, which are typically non-commercial freebies. I

Can you specify some of you fav freebies? Ferox and Tesla are both free and pretty good. Do you have others in mind?

Also can you set up an aux with saturation plugs or do you have to use it inline? I seem to recall Charles Dye using one on almost every track.

[sahiaman]

This is something I've been kicking around alot in my head. A while ago I started using a vcr as a tape machine to inject flavor into sterile tracks. But getting a plugin to do that would be great. I'll have to look into the psp stuff.

[DeadPoet]

I discovered Tessla two weeks ago and really love it.


Herwig

[alkor]

early reflections can do wonders

bit late, but who cares :d

[Washington]

Originally Posted by DP40oz

Basically using the Charles Dye method of putting just a touch of them on almost every track and the mix bus has completely brought my mixes to a new level.

To the OP: "like watching a sitcom rather than a film"... brillant! That's exactly what I wanna get rid of...

At the tone of your post, I guess your time has become more precious than ever but...Could you be so kind as to elaborate a little on your method? I got the plug, but I hardly ever could make it anything but harsh (and to Piotr, it's serious CPU hog on PPC macs) and I use it only for "audible" in-your-face purposes. It seems to me that you found the holy grail, or at least the one I'm after (a subtle use to gel and get that "magic"), so I couldn't resist but ask. Thanx in advance.

[DP40oz]

Originally Posted by Washington

To the OP: "like watching a sitcom rather than a film"... brillant! That's exactly what I wanna get rid of...

At the tone of your post, I guess your time has become more precious than ever but...Could you be so kind as to elaborate a little on your method? I got the plug, but I hardly ever could make it anything but harsh (and to Piotr, it's serious CPU hog on PPC macs) and I use it only for "audible" in-your-face purposes. It seems to me that you found the holy grail, or at least the one I'm after (a subtle use to gel and get that "magic"), so I couldn't resist but ask. Thanx in advance.

Hey see this is what confused me with saturation plugins at first. People were always refering to these plugins as ways to "distort, dirty up, add grit" which I guess they do but thats misleading. Seeing what Charles Dye has done with them made me realize that you're using them more as a starting point not as an effect so to speak. Think of it as if i were mixing on a huge console with tons of outboard gear and effects, everything would be adding its own character to the sound so by the end of the mix the tracks would be coloured like crazy, which mixing ITB doesnt give you.

So for me ive put the saturation plugin in one of the valve settings on every channel in the first insert to start, including the mix buss. Usually just a little bit of saturation but thats totally up to you and the kinda music you're doing. Then just mix from there. Sometimes i'll add tape saturation on things. All in all just using it as if i were using a real board and real gear. Use the plugin in circumstances where the tracks would be going through Valves, tubes, tape but since you're ITB they're not. Its crazy how big of a difference this has made for me. Even my clients are booking more mix sessions because they can't believe how "radio" sounding their tracks are getting.

As far as PSP MixSaturator2 being a CPU hog. I use a quad core Q6600 processor and I just finished a mix with 48 tracks in which I used it on all 48 tracks, the mix buss and on some group busses and fx channels. Plus my normal mixing plugs, reverbs, delays, Waves SSL, Waves Ren series and Waves Vintage series and 3 instances of Drumagog and i was still flying with tons of CPU left. Gotta love Quad core baby.

[Washington]

Thank you!

[sahiaman]

Anyone had a chance to check out this plugin by Crysonic? Its called nXtasy. nXtasy V2 Analog Harmonic Saturation Audio DSP Plug-in :: Crysonic - Professional Audio Plugins VST AU RTAS

I'm about to demo it and wanted to see if anyone has any opinions on it. Its only $44 right now.

[Methlab]

I have my saturator of choice, but Kiwi...give me some of your freebies. The one I like a lot is called Distroyer I think. It's free and does some nice work.

[spinedoc]

Yeah mixing with a litle saturation plug on most channels seems to help my stuff as well. In this months SOS there is an article about this guy in Britain, I cannot remeber his name, who is supposedly the most busy mixer producer over there. He says he is now into using overdrive plugs on most of his channels for this effect as well. PSP mixsaturator is a swiss army knife of saturators and has a small cpu hit on my dual core. To me saturation by Nebula API preamps have a more defined,puncy effect but the cpu hit is around 20%, but the sound is great.

[Washington]

Ok, ok... I must admit the psp mix saturator is actually quite easy on the CPU... It's in fact PSP easyverb that is a HUGE hog, but it nonethelss one of the best plate (and amb) around. For something like $50, if I remember well. Ooops, drifting...

[theblue1]

Originally Posted by DP40oz

So i finally bought PSP MixSaturator2 and jesus! This is what ive been missing in every mix ive done ITB. Basically using the Charles Dye method of putting just a touch of them on almost every track and the mix bus has completely brought my mixes to a new level.

I never could understand why my mixes sounded too real. It was like watching a sitcom rather then film. For years ive struggled with my reverbs and delays being too present. I couldnt get why the singer always sounded just too up front and not record like. How are these plugins not talked about all the time. I own all the UAD stuff, the Waves SSL plugs and no matter how good they sounded i never could get "That" sound. Now my mixes gel and i can be way more creative without the fear that a hall reverb is gonna sound completely huge and fake, everything just sounds right now. Ive been mixing professionally for years and this has to be one of the biggest realizations ive ever had. Just had to post this because it seems like nobody talks about the power of these plugins enough. Needless to say i will be getting the URS Saturation plug ASAP.

My pick for Analogy of the Month.


The video/film contrast has been explored but the sit com angle brings a new dimension to the comparison. Nice.

My mixes are too much like Hollywood Squares.

[tombuur]

Interesting thread. I too will have a look into this.

I know the PSP Vintage Warmer is used by a lot of people. So what's the difference between this and the Mixpack2? Or should I say, can you achieve these saturations effects with Vintage Warmer alone?

[Washington]

Most probably, but it would be a bit of overkill regarding the original purpose of the plug, rather intended to be used as a "master tape", and for sure a multiband compressor / limiter more than just a saturation device.

Besides, the saturator has 7 different algorythms, among which I found one to be of the color of the VW1, and another resembling more the VW2. These are tape emulations only, which I found sometimes desirable for vocals, but my (fresh) experience is that when instantiating one plug on top of each track, the tube distortion seem to fit better since tape od does not pile quite as nicely (not-so-logical, but YMMV...).

Reporting further of my thorough testing of today, I must say this leads to a totally different result than setting a VW on the 2 bus. Past the first "bells and whistle" effect you experience with the VW, I've not been such a fan of the result. It's always had a taste of "imitation" to me, and I rather use it for effect only by now (particularly the VW1, of which the distortion I find much more "chewy" on extreme settings.

+1 on the brillant metaphor about sitcom and cinema. The trick is now to remember that movies can look good but still be quite lame...

[JP11]

Too real!?

[DP40oz]

Ive really found the biggest difference in my mixes when using these plugs are how my effects blend so much better. Maybe im crazy but I always felt using reverbs and delays ITB stood out too much. It seemed like if i pushed my verbs and delays on tracks they sounded way too wet and if i back off, everything was too in your face and dry. Something about the saturation really lets me push my effects and get much better blends without it being so finicky. Also drums benefit hugely when just adding a touch. I end up needing a lot less compression and can maintain more of the original sound without them sounding boring and under processed.

Haha BTW nice pics. How bout a Married with Children vs. Saving Private Ryan pic comparison, then you'll see what i mean.

[JP11]

I know what you mean . I'm just goofing around...but I don't think TV video is very real (plus, real ain't necessarily a bad thing).

[Jonboy79]

Originally Posted by theblue1

My pick for Analogy of the Month.


The video/film contrast has been explored but the sit com angle brings a new dimension to the comparison. Nice.

My mixes are too much like Hollywood Squares.

Then my mixes are probably more like public access tv.

[Osumosan]

Originally Posted by engmix

i recently was mixing a record where there was a couple of tracks with a fair bit of noise. i decided to clean it up out of a knee jerk reaction, and found after the fact, that the mix lost some character. i put the noise back in, and bingo.

When you clean up noise, you are also cutting out a lot of the actual musical content. Most notably, air. I've found that no matter how good a noise reduction plug is, it always takes some of the realism away with it. I only use it if I've cranked the pres on a noisy ribbon for example and the noise gets in the way, and I'll only cut it enough to push it back to where it doesn't "stick out."

[Washington]

Agree with that, 100db reduction on gates is usually more a choke effect than anything (which can make sense though)... but sometimes 3db is just what you need to get the listener's attention to stay focused, just like too clean a sound makes a take artificial and sterile... I only mention that because just like with saturation, it seems we're always at the risk of using the "automatic recipe" on everything.

[Stepwise Sound]

you have to be careful with PSP warmer (and surely some of the others) adding distortion to your tracks. and i don't mean "distortion" in a good way -- it doesn't seem to like all tracks equally.

i wouldn't just throw it on everything -- listen closely and see if it's fits and doesn't tear up the track.

[beubbo]

Originally Posted by DP40oz

So i finally bought PSP MixSaturator2 and jesus! This is what ive been missing in every mix ive done ITB. Basically using the Charles Dye method of putting just a touch of them on almost every track and the mix bus has completely brought my mixes to a new level.
.

Hi,

Are you still enthusiastic about how your mixes sound with PSP Mixsaturator2 on all your mixer channels/2bus after 3 months of using it ?

If yes, how do you set it generally ? Are you just playing with the "Saturation" knob using one of the 3 Valve's algos without enabling "Warmth" & "Softness" ?

Thanks.
B.

[Washington]

To be frank, a bit less so... things have settled, sort of. It's wonderful on some material less so with other things you would believe it would have worked on.

Anyway... "it's not a magic trick" is REALLY getting old, but it applies here just like everywhere. Still, what a GOOD sat plug does when it's appropriate is yet irreplaceable in this digital world.

[Benmrx]

I know it's not the newest plug on the block, but I've been getting into McDSP's AC1 plug more and more. I made a few presets for myself.

Channel Input
Aux Return
Buss Master
2Buss

Basically putting AC1 on every track. I mean, every track including EFX returns, busses, etc, and doing this before I even bring up a fader. I've been trying to setup PT more as a traditional mixer lately with self-imposed limitations. Using the same EQ on nearly all tracks, with something like 4 mono and 2 stereo aux sends for each track all going to the same reverb, delay, efx, etc. Just like your auxes would be on an analog board.

I'm thinking now about going in and making a few more AC1 presets for things like "broken aux sends or returns", where the stereo image is off a bit, or one side is distorting more than the other.

It's actually been pretty fun, and mixing has become both quicker and easier. What turned out as a fun little time killer/experiment is sort of turning into a new way of mixing.