Help WoW Factor???

[RonT]

Ok I have the right gear now outside of Good Monitors.....But my setup dosent have the WOW factor. "Board with Meters"

I visited the D8B a while ago and decided not to get it. But I was thinking if I used it as a digital patchbay would that but good enough for the "Big" Mixer with Meter WoW factor???

I run my externals into a patchbay then patch into a rosetta 800 from there I go into Digi 003 then out of 003 back into 800 then sum to DBox for Monitoring. Signal is clean and true IMO........

What I am lacking is a big board type of setup which for some reason people need to see in order to take you serious. soooooo I thought ok what if I used the Mackie D8B as a Passthrough that provided meters for what was going in DAW and out and also as a hui controler would that be enough to satisfy the people who needed to see a big board? Or is there a better option out there?

D8B $1500
Rosetta i/o----->D8B Card 1
Digi i/o -------->D8B Card 2

[Karloff70]

Personally I wouldn't. But then I particularly dislike that thing from having mixed on it a couple of times and ......not liked it, shall we say. Before you know it you'll be using its eq and stuff, and I would rather not....spend the money on some analog desk? An Amek BC-3 or something perhaps. Looks much more serious for your clients, and IS serious toolage.....

[mdjice]

the bigger the better for the client. it's sad but true. I got over $30K of equipment in the past 6 months, including a neve 1084, lexicon 480L etc... most clients didn't notice anything.....the day I brough my DDA in....people where calling their friend taking pictures with the console etc...

[ScottAltiz]

D8Bs sound just terrible. Get a Mackie 24x8 if you're just looking to get a desk. It won't F-up the sound, it's got size, and the pre-amps are at least 'useable'
D8B... ugh. They crash, they sound terrible. You'd bang your head against the wall in no time.

Mackie 24x8, Soundcraft desks, etc. You could even 'mod' the 8 channels you're actually using so they sound a little better

[RonT]

Originally Posted by Karloff70

Personally I wouldn't. But then I particularly dislike that thing from having mixed on it a couple of times and ......not liked it, shall we say. Before you know it you'll be using its eq and stuff, and I would rather not....spend the money on some analog desk? An Amek BC-3 or something perhaps. Looks much more serious for your clients, and IS serious toolage.....

Cant find the price or reviews on it?

[phillysoulman]

Its all bullshit.
You either have the sound or you dont.
Its a damn shame that people are so hung up on aesthetics.
Like some yoyo rapper walked in once and said.."you.he got a flatscreen"

Personally,I dont need a LFC.
My place SOUNDS awesome,according to the clients who keep coming back and who know the difference.
There are MANY studios with LFCs that sound like shit and look awesome...and there are those which sound awesome but the yoyo clients confuse aethetics with great sound.

[RonT]

Originally Posted by phillysoulman

Its all bullshit.
You either have the sound or you dont.
Its a damn shame that people are so hung up on aesthetics.
Like some yoyo rapper walked in once and said.."you.he got a flatscreen"

Personally,I dont need a LFC.
My place SOUNDS awesome,according to the clients who keep coming back and who know the difference.
There are MANY studios with LFCs that sound like shit and look awesome...and there are those which sound awesome but the yoyo clients confuse aethetics with great sound.

I know this and I have plenty of clients who come to my small apartment and are very very happy when they leave BUT......I am looking for a commercial buildling now and I am going to open up to the public so when they come in they will have the WoW factor before they hear the sound!

I am willing to invest about $2000 just for eyecandy I know this is sad but I think I will get it back in a month or two just by people thinking that the "board" is actually doing something..........Of course it would be cool to find something that actually did something thats why I was looking at the D8B at least it has DAW control on it? A Control 24 would be ideal but it cannot control my main DAW which is Nuendo and all other Big controller solutions are out of my budget right now. HELP HELP!!!!

[mdjice]

Originally Posted by phillysoulman

Its all bullshit.
You either have the sound or you dont.
Its a damn shame that people are so hung up on aesthetics.
Like some yoyo rapper walked in once and said.."you.he got a flatscreen"

Personally,I dont need a LFC.
My place SOUNDS awesome,according to the clients who keep coming back and who know the difference.
There are MANY studios with LFCs that sound like shit and look awesome...and there are those which sound awesome but the yoyo clients confuse aethetics with great sound.

Unfortunatly most rappers I work with have NO idea about gear or even about sound. We walked in a room (studio 7303) a few years back and the artist I was with was extremly impressed with the HUUUUUGE console. so impressed that he booked a week of studio time!! he said it was going to sound so much better!!.....it was a 48 or so faders procontrol....they recorded him using an avalon 737 sp and akg c414.... it's all phychological. does a big board make my studio sound better?...well yes but could I have great sound only with preamps etc... SURE!!! however the clients (artists) will judge your studio on sound AND look.
it also helps having a benz parcked in the drive way. yes it sucks but that's the way it is. If I had a studio with a digi 002 a 15 crt monitor a mic pre on the floor with a beat up dodge neon parcked in the front I can GUARANTEE you none of my actual clients would show up no matter what the sound!! (maybe only a couple of the smart ones would). How do I know? because I was there!!! I still have pics of my old studio and boy it looked different...did it sound much different? not really but artists I knew then were not clients nor they were recording in my studio. NOW...they even shoot videos to put on their myspace showing my studio etc... so you know what YES sound FIRST looks VERY CLOSE SECOND

[kingofswing]

Originally Posted by mdjice

Unfortunatly most rappers I work with have NO idea about gear or even about sound. We walked in a room (studio 7303) a few years back and the artist I was with was extremly impressed with the HUUUUUGE console. so impressed that he booked a week of studio time!! he said it was going to sound so much better!!.....it was a 48 or so faders procontrol....they recorded him using an avalon 737 sp and akg c414.... it's all phychological. does a big board make my studio sound better?...well yes but could I have great sound only with preamps etc... SURE!!! however the clients (artists) will judge your studio on sound AND look.
it also helps having a benz parcked in the drive way. yes it sucks but that's the way it is. If I had a studio with a digi 002 a 15 crt monitor a mic pre on the floor with a beat up dodge neon parcked in the front I can GUARANTEE you none of my actual clients would show up no matter what the sound!! (maybe only a couple of the smart ones would). How do I know? because I was there!!! I still have pics of my old studio and boy it looked different...did it sound much different? not really but artists I knew then were not clients nor they were recording in my studio. NOW...they even shoot videos to put on their myspace showing my studio etc... so you know what YES sound FIRST looks VERY CLOSE SECOND

So true...

bigger the better...to some atleast.

[Karloff70]

Originally Posted by phillysoulman

Its all bullshit.
You either have the sound or you dont.
Its a damn shame that people are so hung up on aesthetics.
Like some yoyo rapper walked in once and said.."you.he got a flatscreen"

Personally,I dont need a LFC.
My place SOUNDS awesome,according to the clients who keep coming back and who know the difference.
There are MANY studios with LFCs that sound like shit and look awesome...and there are those which sound awesome but the yoyo clients confuse aethetics with great sound.

Of course it is, but if the man is making a better living catering to it then not and is asking for advice.........

[big country]

in reality wow factor is superficial ...

look at guitars people pay extra to make them look like shit .
30bucks for cigarette burn 40 for a drop ...

you gotta look at it both ways ,

I look at people with serious professional equipment and I think
hey this guy is a pro , that doesn't always stand true.

a big bank account will not make you a bitch-en engineer

its all in the individual behind desk and the talent thats gonna make a great record.

pro studios are the shit no doubt... but it takes talent...

[Crash]

The d8b is OK, especially for the money you are talking about. Not sure I agree with the slam on the pres or that an analog Mackie has better pres, but everyone has an opinion I guess. In realiity the pres between the analog and d8b, while not identical, are quite similar in design.

Things to consider, the d8b is limited to 44.1K or 48K, if you operate higher than that, keep it in mind. To have the HUI mode, you have to have version 5 installed. Do not even consider one that does not have an Apogee clock card. They are no longer made and when you do find one, which is rather rare, you will pay a premium for it. There were 3 different digital cards (PDI.8/DIO.8/OPT.8) made for it so make sure you would get the one you need for your application.

The automation on the console is outstanding and the comps and EQs are decent as well. There are EQ, comps and gates on every channel 1-48 which is cool. I find the pres to be OK, rather neutral, nothing great but they don't suck either.

The biggest issue with a d8b it is a little long in the tooth and the physical footprint of it is not huge since it is 4 layers deep. For WOW factor, with moving faders and flashing lights it might work for you.

[RonT]

Originally Posted by Crash

The d8b is OK, especially for the money you are talking about. Not sure I agree with the slam on the pres or that an analog Mackie has better pres, but everyone has an opinion I guess. In realiity the pres between the analog and d8b, while not identical, are quite similar in design.

Things to consider, the d8b is limited to 44.1K or 48K, if you operate higher than that, keep it in mind. To have the HUI mode, you have to have version 5 installed. Do not even consider one that does not have an Apogee clock card. They are no longer made and when you do find one, which is rather rare, you will pay a premium for it. There were 3 different digital cards (PDI.8/DIO.8/OPT.8) made for it so make sure you would get the one you need for your application.

The automation on the console is outstanding and the comps and EQs are decent as well. There are EQ, comps and gates on every channel 1-48 which is cool. I find the pres to be OK, rather neutral, nothing great but they don't suck either.

The biggest issue with a d8b it is a little long in the tooth and the physical footprint of it is not huge since it is 4 layers deep. For WOW factor, with moving faders and flashing lights it might work for you.

I guess thats the kind of answer I am looking for. I will not be using any of the converters in the D8B! I will go into the D8B from the Rosetta 800 then to the Digi 003 for Mixing then out of the 003 into the D8B just for Metering then out of the D8B back into the Rosetta for conversion then to the Dangerous DBox for monitoring. I will clock it all to the Rosetta. The version of the OS system is 5.1 with 3 Adat cards in it. I would do a regular analog consol but I dont wont to have a consol in front of me that I cant have any DAW Control on it.SSL Matrix would be the ideal solution for me but I just dont have $25,000 laying around! I reallly thought about taking out a mortgage on my house to get it but I thought someone somewhere has to make a DAW controller with 24 faders with meter Bridge in line and lcd scible strips with a monitoring section on it???? Why Why dosnt a board exist like this for under $5000? Just dosnt make sense to me!!!!All I need is a MCU Pro with a meter Bridge thats 24 channels long with a transparent monitoring section on it? WTF

[Crash]

What about something along the lines of a Pro Control 24?

Digidesign Control|24 | Sweetwater.com

[big country]

I think the wow factor is for good confidence as long as confidence is directed in the right way..

[RonT]

Originally Posted by Crash

What about something along the lines of a Pro Control 24?

Digidesign Control|24 | Sweetwater.com

Again the Control 24 is PERFECT for what I need!!!!!! Now I just something just like it that I can use with my DAW of choice Nuendo???Or I could just eat the $1800 I paid for Nuendo and the use of my beautiful UAD cards and the ease of production flow that I have with it or the wonderful interface that it has and the extreemly flexible monitoring and VST support that it has...............................mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm NOPE I will stick with Nuendo but I do run protools and know it well for those that insist on using it.

[andychamp]

Originally Posted by ScottAltiz

...Get a Mackie 24x8 if you're just looking to get a desk. It won't F-up the sound...

I beg to differ. Here's why:
- plug CD player with music of your choice into line in of any channel.
- set EQ to flat
- switch (flat) EQ in and out
- notice big part of sound going the way of the Dodo when EQ is in line.


If you decide to buy one anyway, make sure it has a meter brigdge. At least it'll look good.

[Crash]

Sorry Ron, missed the part about Nuendo....

[RonT]

I was really banking on NAMM 2008 for a company to come out with a controller to fill the needs of people just like me but no go! Anyone else have any suggestions?
Now you guys see why the D8B is looking like a sore winner to me! Yeah it sux but nothing else out there that has its looks and does daw control under $5000

[Karloff70]

How about an inflatable desk. Like a lilo with channelstrips painted on it. Rather that than the Mackie......might impress your younger clients....

[RonT]

Originally Posted by Karloff70

How about an inflatable desk. Like a lilo with channelstrips painted on it. Rather that than the Mackie......might impress your younger clients....

I think what I have now is better than that solution but thx for the advice

[RonT]

I ended up buying an expansion for my current Tascam FW-1884 called FE-8 and I just got approved for my commercial space. 1200sq ft for $800 a month and its wide open now! So I will be spending alot of time in the studio build forum! Got me $20,000 to have it all done

I am really nervous about this whole thing and I want to thx the people that helped me so far in purchasing the right equipment to get me up to pro level!

Finally after 12 long years of getting ready for this move It's finally here

[allencollins]

Originally Posted by ScottAltiz

D8Bs sound just terrible. Get a Mackie 24x8 if you're just looking to get a desk. It won't F-up the sound, it's got size, and the pre-amps are at least 'useable'
D8B... ugh. They crash, they sound terrible. You'd bang your head against the wall in no time.

Mackie 24x8, Soundcraft desks, etc. You could even 'mod' the 8 channels you're actually using so they sound a little better

Mackie has preamps? That's what those are? Bad advice man. Nothing is worse than a Mackie. Nothing is that sterile. Ok I take it back. Johnson & Johnson guaze pads may be more sterile. Just maybe

If you want very inexpensive board you buy an old english soundracs or Allen & Heath. If you have a few bucks you buy a Mdeas or even one of those old trident T24's maybe even a new Toft. Never a mackie. Behringer sounds better than a mackie for cripes sakes........... Refer to Mr. Fletchers infamous 'shit on a stick' for further instructions

[TapeOpAl]

What about one of those old Tascam US-2400 control surfaces? There's a few on eBay now and you can get one for under $1k. They'll work with Nuendo and they're physically large enough to impress clients.

[RonT]

Originally Posted by TapeOpAl

What about one of those old Tascam US-2400 control surfaces? There's a few on eBay now and you can get one for under $1k. They'll work with Nuendo and they're physically large enough to impress clients.

Yeah same thing basically as I have now. Was looking for something with lcd and meter bridge on it and that unit has either. Sad that tascam keep dropping the ball on those two things. The dm series have meter bridge but not in line with the strips themselves and no scribble strip on individual channels. Thx for the advice though! I have a freind who had 2 of them in a custom desk and most of the time he just uses the mouse instead of trying to figure which channel is which

[Lawrence]

The d8b is a fine console. I've owned one for many years and it sounds just fine. Lots of people are still using them, you can find them in use in pro studios with a quick google.

I tend to only use the digital I/O these days as I have better pres and AD (Lavry <-> AES and MOTU Adat to Cubase), for $1500 you won't find a better value in a digital patchbay with faders and daw control. I send all kinds of things through it but I mix in Cubase while monitoring through the d8b.

It's latest software is nice and the digital compressors are very useful.

All that assumes you don't want to go over 48k of course.

P.S. Stay away from the original ADAT cards - the DIO's - they reverse the polarity. Only use OPT-8 cards if you're gonna use ADAT I/O.