Pump Orgsn miking tips, anyone...

[xlon]

Does anyone have any tips or ideas as how to record pump organ ?
I´m looking for a natural sound but this far I haven´t been satisfied
with either a pair of U 87 or a pair Sm 57 at close range.

It either gets too energetic in the mid or too dull with the sm 57´s.

The recordings I make are usually not with the pump organ as solo instrument.
So I´m greatful for any tips as how too keep the sound together so to speak, and at
the same time capture what little transients a pump organ might have.

regards,

x

[evangelista]

Are you limited to stereo, can you record 4 channels?

If close 57 or far 87 doesn't work, my first instinct would be to try reversing their positions.

[xlon]

Originally Posted by evangelista

Are you limited to stereo, can you record 4 channels?

If close 57 or far 87 doesn't work, my first instinct would be to try reversing their positions.

I can record 4 channels, how do you mean I should put the mikes ?

regards,

mikael

[The Reel Thing]

usually i record the pump organ in mono from the wall side, with either a U87/U47 or a Royer R-121. i just move around and listen where the particular sound comes across best, like you do with an upright piano. usually that's around the upper left side of the instrument, about a foot distance, but that might vary with the build of different models.

if you want stereo, try M/S in the same manner. So you have the width if you need it, but you can also mix the pump organ small and narrow.

great instrument, isn't it?
good luck,

tom

analoghaus :: studio label verlag - home

[xlon]

Thanks a lot Tom,
I´l definitly try that.
Yeah, I love that instrument.

cheers !

[Sounds Great]

I have a pump organ. I've never tried to record it. I imagine it would be quite challenging as the pedal action makes a lot of noise while you play it.

[joelpatterson]

I recorded a pump organ once that looked like it was in fact a giant suitcase, portable in the way that the earliest tape decks were portable, bulkly behemoths, but at least they were square and boxlike when they were all packed up.

Put a CAD 7000 ribbon about a foot out from the opening... there was fabric over the opening, if I remember...? The laboring of the pumping seemed like part of the sound, the ghostly human background noise. The whole sound was spooky and ethereal. The wind crying Mary.

[DJGoody]

Indeed the pedals are part of the sound. It's like the wow and flutter on a mellotron. Just part of the beauty, friends......

[Sounds Great]

[ssaudio]

Originally Posted by xlon

at close range

I'd suggest that was your problem right there - move at least 1.5m away and things should improve - however, your room will start to play a bigger part
Positioning is key here and 87s should be more than capable

[CapnMarvel]

The thread title really needs to be fixed. Every time I've seen it today I think it says 'Pump Orgasm milking tips, anyone...'

I blame you for my perversion.

[ssaudio]

I certainly dribbled some love pee when I read it first...

[iordan]

I am working on recording an album with almost all pump organ and vocals. We wanted to capture alot of the pumping. I used a paid of 414's set to cardiod on the front and a royer r122 on the back. Got great results. If you use condenser mics you will get alot of pumping noise. But it is a "pump" organ. Just be careful with phasing.

[andygomez]

Originally Posted by CapnMarvel

The thread title really needs to be fixed. Every time I've seen it today I think it says 'Pump Orgasm milking tips, anyone...'

I blame you for my perversion.

I cant make my head stop seeing that

[xlon]

Haha ! Thanks a lot everyone.
I think everyone reads it as pump orgasm. I´m sorry...

Some real good tips here that I´ll check into, the problem in
the past has been that everybody has wanted to be in the same
room which pretty much rules out room miking as an option to
capture only the organ.

I also think the pumping and pedalsound is part of it and I would never
try to eq it out (except for the lowest bottom sometimes)

If the instruments surrounding the pump don´t take to much room it sounds
great but as soon as there is too much competition you loose the breath of
the instrument as to my experience.

I´m really greatful for all the tips and I will be bring some of them into practice
at once.

Thanks !

Mikael

[xlon]

Originally Posted by Sounds Great

Jesus ! What a piece.

[ssaudio]

Originally Posted by xlon

If the instruments surrounding the pump don´t take to much room it sounds
great but as soon as there is too much competition you loose the breath of
the instrument as to my experience

Try using your 87s in Fig 8 mode and position such that their nulls points at the other musicians, this will give you a quite unexpected level of seperation

[Jim Williams]

My experience recording them was not too fun. The pedal noises are a big distraction. This was 30 years ago, however. They do have a great sound. I would investigate connecting an air compressor hose to the pump and running the compressor at low power and locate it far out of the room. That would give a constant pressure to even out notes and would releave the player from sweating too much while playing. If it has foot pedals that would free up both feet for playing.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

[djimbe]

I've rebuilt a few pump organs. Most of them don't blow, they suck...

O.K. Seriously. The pedals move the bellows. The bellows draw air out of a reservoir that is nothing more than a pair of wood plates with a spring hinge on one side, and totally covered with the same vulcanized rubber cloth as on the bellows. You develop a negative pressure in the instrument, and when you press a key it lifts a valve over the reed pocket and air is drawn across the reed making the noise. On that picture above, you'll see a fancy latice-work and cloth panel under the keys. That's the air intake. It's also where lots of the sound comes out, since it's one of the few direct open shots to the reed pockets.

Most organs have crappy leaky bellows and reservoirs, which is why they wheeze so bad, and are so (human) energy intensive to play. It's also why they often aren't very loud, since volume is basically related to the negative pressure that you can develop. Imagine a totally leaky reservoir that prevents you from sucking much air into the instrument...very little and very inconsistent sound is going to come out of that organ, related to the air leaking outa the reservoir. My main organ, which I rebuilt maybe 5 years ago, will hold a note with no pumping for almost 20 seconds, and you can pump away nice and gentle and get good volume and consistent tone.

I like me SDC mics, positioned kinda behind the performer and at that air intake. I also like the wheeze factor, which this general mic arrangement gets me. But my organs don't wheeze much, so maybe that's why I like it.

Also, know that most old pump organs may be in tune with themselves, but not the world. Built before A=440Hz as a standard, you see...

[ssaudio]

I've never had a problem with the mechanical noises, all a part of the instrument in my (and the client's) view