Are SSL dynamics all you need?

[lawrence_o]

Hi all,

I have been doing some mixes with only the SSL4056E dynamics and eq and I must say, it needs nothing more to it.

So I was wondering, why do we need extra outboard gear? Ok, they sound differently, but is it better?

Besides your personnal impression and flavor, are there e.g. technical reasons why people need e.g. an 1176 tc?


Thanks
Regards
Lawrence.

[tonymite]

if we speakin technically - u could get away with behringer. In my mind different comps have different characteristics even with no GR. due to topologies - and gain reduction techniques - be it VCA fet opto vari-MU etc ... depending on input source ... I cant believe i've gone so far
blah blah .. fletcher ... im not a tanaka but i want u to teach me
cya- im off to bed.

[Snatchman]

Originally Posted by tonymite

if we speakin technically - u could get away with behringer. In my mind different comps have different characteristics even with no GR. due to topologies - and gain reduction techniques - be it VCA fet opto vari-MU etc ... depending on input source ... I cant believe i've gone so far
blah blah .. fletcher ... im not a tanaka but i want u to teach me
cya- im off to bed.

Well then, I'm technically speaking cause I'm sure as hell using Behringer.! (not by choice though!)... ..... .... .....

[tonymite]

wouldn't matching different comps to fiff instruments only enhance your mix further ??? maybe even colour each inst a diff way = less eq
much the same as pre-amp choice / matching to mics ?

[bpatural]

Hi, I used to be an assistant over at Larrabee, one of the biggest mix studios in LA, and from my experience i heard many great mixes from some of the top guys in the buisiness using only the ssl and a couple reverbs, delays and maybe a vox compressor. On the other hand, most engineers liked to load on outboard like it was magic (having upwards of 7 fridge sized rack cases in addition to the overblown racks in the studio), most mixes sounded great, others didn't... it really depends if you know what you're doing, an ssl is a pretty flexible tool which should be able to cover the job most of the time, and while it's nice to have the option to put a 5,000 chain on a machine hihat (yes i know one mixer that does this) you have to ask yourself: is it really necessary?
Also when I've had songs mixed by different engineers on similar gear, it seemed the personality of the engineer had more to do with the sound than the gear that was used
....on the other hand, buying knobs and buttons is a lot of fun, and if you don't have an ssl handy it makes protools sound a whole lot better.
-brian

[Jose Mrochek]

Originally Posted by bpatural

Hi, I used to be an assistant over at Larrabee, one of the biggest mix studios in LA, and from my experience i heard many great mixes from some of the top guys in the buisiness using only the ssl and a couple reverbs, delays and maybe a vox compressor. On the other hand, most engineers liked to load on outboard like it was magic (having upwards of 7 fridge sized rack cases in addition to the overblown racks in the studio), most mixes sounded great, others didn't... it really depends if you know what you're doing, an ssl is a pretty flexible tool which should be able to cover the job most of the time, and while it's nice to have the option to put a 5,000 chain on a machine hihat (yes i know one mixer that does this) you have to ask yourself: is it really necessary?
Also when I've had songs mixed by different engineers on similar gear, it seemed the personality of the engineer had more to do with the sound than the gear that was used
....on the other hand, buying knobs and buttons is a lot of fun, and if you don't have an ssl handy it makes protools sound a whole lot better.
-brian

Yep this summs it up. It's all very personal like music in general, you don't need 15 diferent acoustic guitars to write a good song either. The thing you always have to keep in mind, is that if you know WHAT YOU WANT, never settle for less. Always aim higher if you know it's possible, even remotely.

To clear it up... if you think all you need is a SSL for a great mix, you will do a great mix guaranteed. But if in the back of your mind, you where thinking.. "what if I had this slutty thing" you will probably have a great mix to, but you will not be satisfied even if that mix kicked some ass...

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by lawrence_o

Hi all,

I have been doing some mixes with only the SSL4056E dynamics and eq and I must say, it needs nothing more to it.

So I was wondering, why do we need extra outboard gear? Ok, they sound differently, but is it better?

Besides your personnal impression and flavor, are there e.g. technical reasons why people need e.g. an 1176 tc?


Thanks
Regards
Lawrence.

It all depends on music style,production,quality of tracking and personal preference.

Yeah its possible to mix a song with just the dynamics and EQ built into an SSL.

But if you have problematic tracks or they need some kinda different treatment to make them unique and special its worth it.

I have both.

SSL EQ's and dynamics and tons of outboard to choose from.

Its just more colors on the painters pallette.

And i tend to use them all.

One day i will post a picture of my patchaby during a mix.

It drives my assistant crazy.

[ahhproductions]

Speaking of SSL dynamics. I'll soon be working on one of the new SSL AWS900's on a near daily basis. Since there are only two dynamics processors on that console, I'd love find a way to have some more of them to make it more like a full size SSL!! Are there any SSL channel dynamics clones out there? I know about the Alan Smart buss compressors, but what about the channel strip compressor? Its definitely not worth getting the Xlogic channel strip. Any suggestions?

Maybe this is a good time for SSL to put 4 of the dynamics processors in a one space rack. A nice touch would be to have both the E/G, and J/K dynamics, with a switch to toggle between them, kind of like the EQ on the newer consoles.

Thanks

Adam

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by ahhproductions

Are there any SSL channel dynamics clones out there?

Any suggestions?

Maybe this is a good time for SSL to put 4 of the dynamics processors in a one space rack. A nice touch would be to have both the E/G, and J/K dynamics, with a switch to toggle between them, kind of like the EQ on the newer consoles.

Thanks

Adam

The answer to the first question is no.

Any suggestions?

Maybe a couple of 160X's or 165a's, but they still do not sound the same.

Same goes for the E,G and J dynamics.

The older E's have the gold tin can VCA's which distort differently than the VCA's in the G's.

That's part of the reason people prefer mixing on the older E's, because of how the VCA's overdrives(or crunches) when you push them hard.

The drawback is they color and shit all over your audio.

Its a real art form to balance both and know when to use what.

The J's are a whole other story.

[DrDeltaM]

Originally Posted by ahhproductions

Are there any SSL channel dynamics clones out there?

I believe these are SSL clones. Not sure as i haven't heard/seen them in real. Danfield also makes an SSL buscompressor clone:
http://www.danfieldaudio.com/dyn/716a.htm

[lawrence_o]

Well I use the SSL in combination with some Pro Tools comps through a Prism and I must say, it does the Job. Sure I like more and more and still more gear but hell, half of it is just sitting there...


Thanks for the replies. Regards

[ahhproductions]

Thanks for the 716a link!!!

Anyone know where they can be purchased? They seem like they're just what we're looking for, but it seems they're only available in Europe, and they only have a 220 power supply.

Thanks again!

Adam

[Bang]

I've done some testing with the SSL dynamics and found that it can be emulated best with the dbx 160 165 stuff.. if anything, the SSL was a bit cleaner.. but I'm going to send Jim Williams my 160s and have him put in better chips and I'll hopefull be right there. I love SSL dynamics on a lot of stuff, it can even really push a vocal to the front of the mix well, its very pushy like the dbx stuff.

Steve
www.bangrecording.com
www.blacklinerock.com