Fatso or Distressor???

[Agno]

Alright this is what I'm trying to do......

I'm looking to for something to warm up my master buss, and maybe do a little compression.... also to track with.

I'm getting a pair of Distressors.... but I wanted to hear first hand experience from anyone who has used both ... or anyone of these for what I'm trying to do.

Any help would be appreciated....

[jbuntz]

I don't think either is going to be very cool on the 2-mix. Sorry. Both cool on individual tracks.

[scott petito]

you need both..
I love the Fatso on the 2 buss...but be very careful....a little goes a long way

cheers
SP

[WildCowboys]

scott, can you tell me how you like the distressor best on the mixbuss? is it the warmth, the tranny or the buss-compressor? I am waiting for mine to arrive and would love to get some starting points!

thanks a lot!
Pat

[jho]

Originally posted by Agno
I'm looking to for something to warm up my master buss, and maybe do a little compression.... also to track with.

Warm up master buss: Fatso would work better than distressors (I would use something else entirely though, like CS Phoenix plug, HEDD, or another comp/EQ combo)

A Little Compression: I prefer Fatso for buss type compression and distressor for individual instrument compression.

To Track with: Fatso shines here with harsh sources (warmth modes) while distressor is a more versatile comp with adjustable attack/release.

You need (want) both :), but to answer your question, between the TWO - to fit your description best I'd go with fatso. Although I don't really care for either on the master buss. Some people do though, as always YMMV.

[jho]

Originally posted by WildCowboys
scott, can you tell me how you like the distressor best on the mixbuss? is it the warmth, the tranny or the buss-compressor? I am waiting for mine to arrive and would love to get some starting points!

thanks a lot!
Pat

I'm not scott but I think you have the distressor and fatso confused. Distressors don't have the 'tranny, warmth' features etc.

[WildCowboys]

oh, my fault, of course I wanted to type "fatso"....

[jho]

Originally posted by WildCowboys
oh, my fault, of course I wanted to type "fatso"....

I know just having fun

If I were to use it on the mix buss I'd most likely start with the buss compressor setting, input so that it barely wiggles the leds, with maybe the warmth on zero, the first or second setting. Like scott said a little goes a long way, which can be true of most anything on your 2-mix.

[brownmouse]

the fatso can be cool on the 2 buss using just the tranny/warmth features, but i prefer the compression tasks go to another unit if possible.
joshua

[Shaman]

Originally posted by Agno
I'm looking to for something to warm up my master buss, and maybe do a little compression....

My advice: Be extremly careful with everything, you strip on your 2 buss. This really is an art of its own !
Especially with the FATSO and buss compression you eventually can destroy more than get benefits

Warmth, punch, loudness........these are things for MASTERING ENGINEERS or VERY experienced mix engineers. If you are not one of both - HANDS OF the 2 buss !
I learned this hard lesson by making the mistake by myself several times.

It´s so easy to overprocess a mix.
For example there are thousands of ways of creating "WARMTH".
Sometimes warmth means cutting the mid highs / highs with a filter. Sometimes it means recording your master to 2".
Sometimes it means to add half a db of fatso warmth, half a db of HEDD, half a db of VARIMU...

[faeflora]

Dave, where's the FATSTRESSOR or DISFATSO?

Personally, I'd be willing to pay $$ for a combo unit that had all the features of both, and STEREO!

Maybe in a few years, the DISFATFREQ?

[jho]

Originally posted by Shaman
My advice: Be extremly careful with everything, you strip on your 2 buss. This really is an art of its own !
Especially with the FATSO and buss compression you eventually can destroy more than get benefits

Warmth, punch, loudness........these are things for MASTERING ENGINEERS or VERY experienced mix engineers. If you are not one of both - HANDS OF the 2 buss !
I learned this hard lesson by making the mistake by myself several times.

It´s so easy to overprocess a mix.
For example there are thousands of ways of creating "WARMTH".
Sometimes warmth means cutting the mid highs / highs with a filter. Sometimes it means recording your master to 2".
Sometimes it means to add half a db of fatso warmth, half a db of HEDD, half a db of VARIMU...

Good advice

[scott petito]

yeah its fatso for the mix buss... a stereo pair of distressors just doen't track very well and smears the image( I find this true of most stereo recording with the distressors...now if you want to have some fun unstrap the 2 units and use very different setting ... sometimes it's just the thing... as for fatso on 2 buss I a/b the output with the console..with warmth at 2-3 with 2-3db of compression the fatso usually wins.....(tranny is not always best for me)....for more drastic compression ,... for me thats more then 3 db...)the dramer is quite nice and the api 7800 is another possible for some kinds of music...by the way it's not about getting it maxxed out levelwise for me ... I use this stuff as a kind of glue....fills in the fine lines kinda like tape did ... but I don't have to go through 5 reels to find one that sounds ok....I actually am much more careful with 2 buss eq, I find that i can really screw up a good mix with that....it's either my ears are frying by the time i insert it or i don't like the phase shift from analog or crummy digital eq's.... much better to do this in mastering or early on a new day at the very least

cheers
Scott

[Agno]

Be extremly careful with everything, you strip on your 2 buss. This really is an art of its own !
Especially with the FATSO and buss compression you eventually can destroy more than get benefits

Thanx for the responses.... I've a good share of experiences with smoothing out the master buss... I just don't have those tools any more. But I'm interested in the these pieces and wanted to know if theses would do the trick. (Besides the fact I'm getting the distressors anyway)


So let me ask this, in theory, can a pair of Distressors linked be used to warm up a Master buss if that was all you had?

Of course using it in moderation and not over driving or squashing the mix.

And can someone tell me, are the distortion modes on the distressor input dependent? Meaning the harder you drive the input the hotter the distortion gets.......

Oh by the way Shaman, I totally agree with you. Keep your hands off the master buss if you don't know what you're doin!

[toledo3]

Originally posted by Shaman
My advice: Be extremly careful with everything, you strip on your 2 buss. This really is an art of its own !
Especially with the FATSO and buss compression you eventually can destroy more than get benefits

Warmth, punch, loudness........these are things for MASTERING ENGINEERS or VERY experienced mix engineers. If you are not one of both - HANDS OF the 2 buss !
I learned this hard lesson by making the mistake by myself several times.

It´s so easy to overprocess a mix.
For example there are thousands of ways of creating "WARMTH".
Sometimes warmth means cutting the mid highs / highs with a filter. Sometimes it means recording your master to 2".
Sometimes it means to add half a db of fatso warmth, half a db of HEDD, half a db of VARIMU...

Well, you don't gain that experience by never trying things out. I agree with the meat of what you are saying.... but it's not really right to think of the possibility of making a mistake as a reason to avoid learning.

It's just as easy to underprocess a mix. I hear soooo many mixes where it is obvious that the mixer thinks that it is verboten to add or subtract more than 3dB of eq (what idiot came up with that rule?), add obvious reverb or delay... There are many people too timid to work something until it really sounds good. Obviously, there is a fine line.

There's something to be said for taking a picture as a historical record.... but that doesn't mean it is wrong to break out the airbrush sometimes.

[Agno]

Originally posted by toledo3
it's not really right to think of the possibility of making a mistake as a reason to avoid learning.

...... I like that.......

[NathanEldred]

Originally posted by toledo3

It's just as easy to underprocess a mix. I hear soooo many mixes where it is obvious that the mixer thinks that it is verboten to add or subtract more than 3dB of eq (what idiot came up with that rule?), add obvious reverb or delay... There are many people too timid to work something until it really sounds good. Obviously, there is a fine line.

There's something to be said for taking a picture as a historical record.... but that doesn't mean it is wrong to break out the airbrush sometimes.

I couldn't agree more with George. We learn by making mistakes. When it comes to spending cash though, it can be good to avoid 'mistakes' by learning what may or may not work through the eyes of other peoples opinions. The problem being that there are a million opinions, and even if the majority agrees it's not necessarily 'correct'.

[Agno]

Originally posted by NathanEldred
even if the majority agrees it's not necessarily 'correct'.

..... like that too......

[Redi Knight]

You need two trakkers.

[Shaman]

Originally posted by NathanEldred
I couldn't agree more with George. We learn by making mistakes.

I agree with you all.
The only problem is......some can afford mistakes...some others can not

let´s say if you are mixing just for fun for some bandmates for their new demo CD, one or the other mistake doesn´t matter

but if you get paid for what you do and some 10.000s CDs get pressed from your master mix (with mistakes on it...) shame on you and your reputation as a `professional´.

Nothing against learning by doing and playing around with this compressor and that warmth box.....I did the same for years...

but as a PROFESSIONAL, who´s really responsable for what he does / produces you need one or two tricks more than just this or that "magic box". Some do call it EXPERIENCE or SKILLS.

Rare words these days, when everybody seems to be a PRODUCER after some months SAE crashcours in audio engineering.

sorry for being direct, but that "which box do I need to make my mixes sound bigger than life" - game really makes me sick.

Try things out by yourself. Ask 100 engineers how they generate "warmth" and you´ll get 100 different opinions.
It´s not only the tool which matters, its what you do with it, when-, and how you do it....
Trust your ears !

You can´t write on your CD:

Sorry for the bad sound of this recording, but some jerk on gearslutz recommended the FATSO ->C2 ->Massive Passive on the 2buss and it sucked completely....

You will write:

...mixed by...Agno 3000

and if the sound sucks, whatever gear you used, YOUR reputation is gone.....

just some thoughts

[monads]

Originally posted by Shaman
...mixed by...Agno 3000

and if the sound sucks, whatever gear you used, YOUR reputation is gone.....

just some thoughts

True, but if it was mixed well you'll still here peeps trying to take away your credit judging you by the gear you have.

[producer3000]

I was never crazy about the Fatso. Was better for tracking than for the two-bus. Sold it and got two distressors. Rarely use them on the two bus but it sounds cooler than you'd think.

[Chrisac]

Originally posted by toledo3
There are many people too timid to work something until it really sounds good.

I agree with that

[Agno]

Originally posted by Shaman

sorry for being direct, but that "which box do I need to make my mixes sound bigger than life" - game really makes me sick.

Sorry for the bad sound of this recording, but some jerk on gearslutz recommended the FATSO ->C2 ->Massive Passive on the 2buss and it sucked completely....

someone got there panties caught in a bunch.....

I agree with you Shaman... but if someone doesn't have any of these pieces accessible to them - what the f*ck do you expect them to do.... research it, right?

So if I'm not mistaken, once upon a time there were a group of professionals that wanted to create a community where pros and semi-pros can network/share information and expreriences in the same field that they're in, without spending a shit load of money to travel to conventions, where everyones ego is glorifying in it's success's. Thus, a forum called 'Gearslutz' was formed, where pros and semi-pros (shit even muthaf*ckaz that want to become semi-pros) can go and share the same affinity for what we would to call GEAR.

So, if I'm not mistaken, once again, the FATSO and the Distressor are considered to be two pieces of 'GEAR' - and this is a place of research - Don't make it a bad experience for people just because you came across a shit-storm of apprentices in your lifetime. (we all have - hence the main point here is that I agree with you - just don't shit on other peoples parades)

Thanx............AGNO

PS... Shaman what I quoted you on was hilarious!

[Shaman]

Originally posted by Agno


Thus, a forum called 'Gearslutz' was formed, where pros and semi-pros (shit even muthaf*ckaz that want to become semi-pros) can go and share the same affinity for what we would to call GEAR.

Engineers talking about gear is nice.
It´s a bit like woman talking about shoes.
Everyone likes something different.
But it´s only talking and talking not making sound.

the funny thing is:
Some people in this thread recommend this or that gear.
One guy is mixing rock, the other Jazz, the third electronica, another classical music, another one (like me) ambient new age...

Some are pros, some are pro audio dealers, some are pro audio manufacturers, some are semi pros, many are not even semi pros.
So how exactly do you measure statements like "Buy two trakkers" ?

It´s nice to take their opinions as A BASIS for further research / testing. But don´t be crazy and buy it from these recommendations !

However - please do some more research about the FATSO in the Gearslutz SEARCH - we had TONS of discussions about that one....

[Agno]

Originally posted by Shaman
Engineers talking about gear is nice.
It´s a bit like woman talking about shoes.
Everyone likes something different.
But it´s only talking and talking not making sound.

the funny thing is:
Some people in this thread recommend this or that gear.
One guy is mixing rock, the other Jazz, the third electronica, another classical music, another one (like me) ambient new age...

Some are pros, some are pro audio dealers, some are pro audio manufacturers, some are semi pros, many are not even semi pros.
So how exactly do you measure statements like "Buy two trakkers" ?

It´s nice to take their opinions as A BASIS for further research / testing. But don´t be crazy and buy it from these recommendations !

However - please do some more research about the FATSO in the Gearslutz SEARCH - we had TONS of discussions about that one....

without a doubt my friend, without a doubt......

[bnath]

..:


Agno:
Chiming in late here... but I, like several other folks here, own both and would recommend the FATSO for your application specifically. The EL-8 is a GREAT piece, perhaps one of my fav pieces of outboard gear. But I generally use them more for single tracks than for the entire mix. That isn't to say you can't use them from time to time on the mix bus and get good results, just that it more frequently tends to impress me when working with individual tracks --- it's quite the tone shaping tool that generally tends to leave me grinning.

The FATSO, on the other hand seems to work reasonably well in both applications, though the limited amount of control makes it more utilitarian in this regard. I know some folks say that it doesn't work well on the mixbus. I've found that this isn't necessarily always the case -- it really depends on the track, in my experience. Certain times it will help to beautifully pull things like the kick and bass into focus, other times it will do the exact opposite. The FATSO is also great for tracking, the saturation and warming circuits tend to sound good on a large variety of input sources. But again, compared to the EL-8, it's so much more limited in terms of its tone shaping capabilities.

b :*