Lexicon PCM 70 vs PCM 91 (and more related questions)?!

[88fingerz]

Happy holidaze to all!

We've got a PCM 70 here and while it's used and loved regularly for lead vocal treatment (small and Rich plates mostly) I've these few questions concerning Lexicon, if anyone actually knows the Real deal:

1. Will the 91 (or 81 for that matter) be a sonically obvious (to the sensitive trained ear) improvement overall over the 70 (including the fact of spdif i/o verses analog mono in/stereo out on the '70)?

2. Where does the MPX-1 REALLY fit in? Is it a unique beast on it's own, or is it a precursor to the later released MPX 500 (or 100, 200 for that matter) and Lexicon just kept it on the market to fill a $700.00 niche?

3. With that said, how will the MPX-1 compare to the PCM 70?

It's the sound and depth of quality we're searching for, not the ease of programming/button pushing that matters most.

4. Is Lexicon "avoiding the truth" when they tout the PCM-91 as having the same sound quality as the M300?

What's the REAL Lexicon story here when it comes to these devices? Hmmmm?

Thanks to anyone truly in the know. Dean in NYC.

[Tibbon]

I'd love to know where the MPX1 sits in this too!

I have one sitting back at my apartment in the UPS box (err i hope it's there), and i'll try it when i get home... but that's not for a few...

[Kestral]

I'm kind of curious about this too - and add to that the Lexicon PCM 60. I love those old Yamaha PCM 60's and 70's and I'd be curious to know how they now compare to the newer Lexicon units.

[Tibbon]

Hopefully someone will tell me that the MPX1 is better sounding than most RTAS plugs (shudders thinking of Dverb)

[neve1073]

While you're discussing pcm 60s and 70s: If there is a vst plug that sounds as good as a pcm70 I'd like to know about it please.

[SiliconAudioLab]

Pug-in? Lexiverb could work.

The 70 is thick and ADDS to what's not there IMHO - big plus!

I sold the MPX because it fell into the LXP1 (or worse) catagory in sound.

The 91 does not sound like the 300 - it's close but different somehow (thinner & more pluggey sounding).

Keep that PCM 70.

Check out this thread I started a month ago:

http://gearslutz.com/board/showthrea...ighlight=pcm70

[BrianBrian]

Neve1073: If you use Creamware cards, you can get an exact replica of the PCM91 algorithms for a steal of a price (about $300). Also a bonus dynamic chorus/delay that I suspect was taken from the PCM80 or another Lexi.

I think the PCM70 halls sound more dense/lush than the 91 overall and sound more obvious (more like an effect than putting the sound in a real hall).

[karl]

I borrowed a 91 from a friend for the mix of an album. I had the MPX500 hardware verb and a Lexiverb already. To my ears I found it similar to the 500 and maybe a bit grainy compared with the smooth sounding 70. In fact I preferred the Lexiverb when we were using OS9. It might just be that you need more time with the 91, but I was never impressed considering the price. Light years away from a 480L as well!

[rack gear]

reviving this old thread...

I've been reading a lot about how creative the uses were for the PCM 70 (particularly brian eno and daniel lanois).

I've have a PCM91 which I mainly use as a second reverb layer for atmosphere - but I've been jonesing for a PCM 70 after reading about some of it's various pitch effects, etc.

Are there specific things that the PCM 70 does that the PCM 91 does not do?

Has anyone owned or used both? Any one care to comment on their opinion of both of these boxes?

For trippy stuff I'm pretty well covered with both an H3000 D/SE and an Eclipse... but ya know... can you ever have to much gear?

Thanks

[seancostello]

Originally Posted by redvelvetstudios

I've been reading a lot about how creative the uses were for the PCM 70 (particularly brian eno and daniel lanois).

Where have you been reading this? I always thought that Eno and Lanois used the Lexicon 224, but I would love more info on this subject.

From a technical perspective, the PCM70 algorithms should be very close to some of the algorithms in a 224XL, except with a mono input (a cost saving move in the late 1980's, when A/D converters were still expensive). I know that Eno and Lanois would have used the 224 Concert Hall algorithm a lot, and the PCM70 Concert Hall is apparently pretty close to the 224 algorithm.

[thermos]

Originally Posted by seancostello

Where have you been reading this? I always thought that Eno and Lanois used the Lexicon 224, but I would love more info on this subject.

From a technical perspective, the PCM70 algorithms should be very close to some of the algorithms in a 224XL, except with a mono input (a cost saving move in the late 1980's, when A/D converters were still expensive). I know that Eno and Lanois would have used the 224 Concert Hall algorithm a lot, and the PCM70 Concert Hall is apparently pretty close to the 224 algorithm.

Check out the u2 making of the Joshua Tree video. Eno talks about using the 70 a bunch, more for the harmonizers and stuff. Pretty cool footage.

[Dave Peck]

I have both the PCM70 and the MPX-1. Like a lot of folks, I love the sound of the PCM70. The reverb in the MPX-1 does sound pretty good but does not have that lush, unrealistic-but-musical quality of the PCM70, perhaps partially because it does not have the same detuning parameter built into the reverb algorithm.

However, the MPX-1 is a very versatile box and can actually do a lot more than the PCM70, since it's intended more as a mid-level multi-effects device than as a dedicated reverb like the PCM70. It does pretty good versions of the classic "stereo chorus > stereo delay > stereo reverb" multi-effects chain, and includes a lot of extra features not found in the PCM70, like a phase shifter. It also has a fairly deep architecture, allowing you to change the routing of the various effects blocks and do a lot of unusual modulation routings if you want to dig a bit deeper.

[HudHudson]

I have a PCM70 2.0 and had a PCM91 alongside for many years. I still have the 70, great character 'verb while the 91 didn't have any special mojo.

[Les Paul Gibson]

I have my PCM-70 v2 and I had the had the PCM 80 and 81, they all sound great, the. The PCM 80,81 has many presets, unfortunately I felt you had to tweak most of them quite a bit, you have 2 modes GO and PRO, GO gives you access to 1 parameters and PRO gives access to everything. I just felt I was tweaking more that I was using it. It sounded great I used some programs in stereo with my guitar. The 70 was just easier to use I thought. Neither is really better that the other, they all sound really professional. I dig my Eventide Eclipse, it has some nice reverbs and fx's as well. the reverb sounds can rival the Lexicons,