Genetically Engineered

[Renie]

Hi all,

Just wondered if anyone wants to talk about genes and engineering.

Are there any known genes that might benefit an engineer/producer?

Would spatial awareness count with sound for example? Is that a gene anyway or an enhanced part of the brain due to hormones, usually in males?

Cheers

Renie

[thethrillfactor]

Originally posted by Renie
Hi all,

Just wondered if anyone wants to talk about genes and engineering.

Are there any known genes that might benefit an engineer/producer?

Would spatial awareness count with sound for example? Is that a gene anyway or an enhanced part of the brain due to hormones, usually in males?

Cheers

Renie

Hi Renie ,

I can only speak for myself, but I feel just the ability to naturally multitask, the ability to use both sides of the brain at once and to not take things personally make women genetically more gifted for engineering than males.

I am a man and I suck at all of those(over the years I have gotten much better).

Which also coincides with my growth as a mixer engineer.

Women are naturally born with these gifts. The only problem is lack of opportunity.

[thethrillfactor]

Also other genetic factors are the shape of your head and the size of your ears.


I read a while back in an engineering journal that the shape of your head contributes a lot to the frequencies you hear. Since sound is refracted of your frontal lobes to our ears on the sides certain frequencies will be accentuated. The shape of the head contributes to how fast certain frequencies get there.

The size of your ears are also important since they are what you use to pick up sound. I have noticed that some of the best engineers in the world(Sweden,Schmitt,Scheiner,Killen) all have big ears.rollz

But that could also be because of age, the older a man gets his ears get bigger...

(but his you know goes what goes in another direction)

That is another story altogether!!!lol

[e-cue]

Originally posted by thethrillfactor
I have noticed that some of the best engineers in the world(Sweden,Schmitt,Scheiner,Killen) all have big ears.

The best engineers? Perhaps you could list some.

[Renie]

Originally posted by thethrillfactor
Also other genetic factors are the shape of your head and the size of your ears.


I read a while back in an engineering journal that the shape of your head contributes a lot to the frequencies you hear. Since sound is refracted of your frontal lobes to our ears on the sides certain frequencies will be accentuated. The shape of the head contributes to how fast certain frequencies get there.

The size of your ears are also important since they are what you use to pick up sound. I have noticed that some of the best engineers in the world(Sweden,Schmitt,Scheiner,Killen) all have big ears.rollz

But that could also be because of age, the older a man gets his ears get bigger...

(but his you know goes what goes in another direction)

That is another story altogether!!!lol

That's interesting Thrill. Do you remember where you read that article?

I've got smallish ears. Is it big ears or big ears that stick out aswell?! yuktyy

Do you know anything about the spatial awareness subject?

Age does funny things don't it!

Cheers Thrill!

[thethrillfactor]

Originally posted by e-cue
The best engineers? Perhaps you could list some.

Hey E,

First of all congrats on the Bucs, I hope they do well on Sunday!!!

Tell them not to forget their longjohn's and hot cocoa!!(they will need it in Philly).

Best engineers?

Well...

I guess to me, the best guys are the guys that go well both ways; ie tracking and mixing. And also are probably the easiest(personality wise) guys to work with.

My list would probably be: the guys I named above and throw in some others(Bob Clearmountain,Allen Sides, Gary Pcosza, Chuck Ainlay,JJP, and the list can go on).

I know this is highly subjective.

What are your thoughts amigo?

[thethrillfactor]

Originally posted by Renie
That's interesting Thrill. Do you remember where you read that article?

I've got smallish ears. Is it big ears or big ears that stick out aswell?! yuktyy

Do you know anything about the spatial awareness subject?

Age does funny things don't it!

Cheers Thrill!

It was a while ago, but I will try to dig it up.

The ears thing is a tricky thing. Not all of the greats have big ears(but you know I saw a picture of Tom Dowd recently and he had large ears). I also noticed that Bob Ludwig does too, maybe its an age thing?

I also read the if you are born with balance on equal side(if both of your arms are the same length,legs,eyes,ears,..I think you get the picture) you are genetically destined to succed.

They used a lot of famous people for the study(Michael Jordan,Wayne Gretzky,Joe Montana,Muhammad Ali,Winston Churchill,JFK etc) and found the same characteristic...BALANCE!!!

Geneticians believe that a balanced genetic body, can aid you in all kinds of things. A person who is not genetically balanced will always have to overcome their defect, which will take them away from the tasks at hand. I guess they see this person as unbalanced.

I know controversial, but I guess when they start cloning humans this will be one of the criteria.

Spatail awareness i've heard some. I think in men it is stronger because our minds are very linearly focused(we can only concentrate on one thing at a time). That makes us highly acute in some areas(sports and business usually).

And highly deficient in others(for example emotional relationships).

[Fletcher]

I like Levi 501's...

[kosi]

Hey, I have big ears too !

(this is not a thumb, it's my ear !)

Yippi

[BevvyB]

lol kosi

[Renie]

Originally posted by Fletcher
I like Levi 501's...

So that's what's on your lower half, I always had you down as a Wrangler snug-fit kinda guy.

I think nurture must play a part in all this.

[Jax]

Originally posted by thethrillfactor

The ears thing is a tricky thing. Not all of the greats have big ears(but you know I saw a picture of Tom Dowd recently and he had large ears). I also noticed that Bob Ludwig does too, maybe its an age thing?

I'll add to that. It's true that as a person ages, his or her ears get bigger. What I think is missing in the thread so far in being a big-eared elder engineer is the amount of experience gained over all those years. That's got to be more useful than having big ears! Not to sound cynical, but if you could genetically enhance (read: use cloned replacements? ) the ears of a medicore engineer, would it immediately improve that person's engineering skills? IOW, if you can hear frequencies in a way that might give you an advantage over other engineers, but you don't know what to do with what you're hearing, then you probably have no advantage. You have a potential advantage, however. So yes, there may be something to the big ears of some top guys that gives them a listening/working advantage, but experience probably has much more to do with it.

One the topic of balanced builds in sports, just as an example, Charles Barkley was one of the NBA's best basketball players, but he was flat-footed and not very symetrically put together compared to Michael Jordan.

A person's social skills also would contribute hugely to their success in a communication-based business like sound engineering.

Cool topic. Just adding a few more variables and thoughts to it.

[Renie]

Originally posted by Jax


One the topic of balanced builds in sports, just as an example, Charles Barkley was one of the NBA's best basketball players, but he was flat-footed and not very symetrically put together compared to Michael Jordan.

A person's social skills also would contribute hugely to their success in a communication-based business like sound engineering.

Cool topic. Just adding a few more variables and thoughts to it.

You just reminded me of Beach Boy Brian Wilson. He's deaf in one ear isn't he.
People who are symmetrical facially definitely are supposed to be more generally attractive. There's always rulebreakers though. And very charming symetrical people who are monsters.

I don't suppose there have been that many studies on engineers/producers and certainly enough of a range of calibre/experience/age/gender/ethnicity.

I also suspect it's hard to study in brains because music arises/stimulates different parts of the brain, the technical, analytical, verbal and creative, artistic, and the 'feeling' part of the brain that's much older evolutionary-wise.

[Jax]

I would think a sociological behavioral study would be more revealing than putting some suction cups on a group of people's heads and seeing what parts of the brain light up, but probably some amount of shared info from each field would benefit a whole work.

There probably have been studies in science and medical journals on the topics of ear size and genetics relating to what people are able to hear. How they perceive what they hear is another study, and probably all three would have to cross-examined to form some real reference on what this means to how an engineer makes audio-sculpting decisions. The first place I'd look is in the AES journals for related topics. The AES may very well have released notes on very similar if not the same topics. If I get the chance I'll look it up.

[Renie]

There's an interesting on-line test from today's Guardian on how male or female your brain is!!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/news/...937443,00.html

I scored 67 on the E test
29 on the S test.....

[alphajerk]

.... i scored an 18 on the E test: and a 55 on the S

geez, what the hell is asperger syndrome? guess i will have to search that now.

although that test is flawed on too many levels.... especially in the b/w nature of the questions. i wonder if i had just answered the box next to the one i chose would of affected the final score, or a neutral option being offered.... the E test is extremely flawed considering the nature of compassion. i personally have "selective" compassion... and some of the questions were based on initial conversations with virtual strangers, while i have one approach with that area... the more i know someone the more open i become with them and will do just about anything for them. if i changed simple things on the test to someone i know for a while, my score would drastically change.

[Renie]

Originally posted by alphajerk
.... i scored an 18 on the E test: and a 55 on the S

geez, what the hell is asperger syndrome? guess i will have to search that now.

although that test is flawed on too many levels.... especially in the b/w nature of the questions. i wonder if i had just answered the box next to the one i chose would of affected the final score, or a neutral option being offered.... the E test is extremely flawed considering the nature of compassion. i personally have "selective" compassion... and some of the questions were based on initial conversations with virtual strangers, while i have one approach with that area... the more i know someone the more open i become with them and will do just about anything for them. if i changed simple things on the test to someone i know for a while, my score would drastically change.

Agreed, there were questions i tried to squeeze into due to lack of suitable answers, or questions that were just too flawed to start. Anyway it is interesting in terms of the gist of it..and probably about right in terms of the polar opposites we are Alpha!!!

I do find that I'm having to develop my s side to be able to do the work I want to do in ths field.

I think I understand Nika a bit more now too. I wonder how Jules would score
my guess would be E 23 S 50.

[covert]

Originally posted by alphajerk
.... i scored an 18 on the E test: and a 55 on the S

geez, what the hell is asperger syndrome? guess i will have to search that now.

It's a neurological disorder, that seems to relate to how well one handles breaks in patterns. Those afflicted can react very badly to shifts in the expected.

My nephew has it.

There's a far amount of info on the net.

[renshen]

Just a note....
It is my understanding that the shape of the Pinia (spelling) is more important than actual size of the ear. There have been test's (so they tell me) on this theory, also size of jaw bone may effect low frequency perception.

Also concerning balance, many studies and eastern thought (Traditional Chinese Medicine) state that one's ability to balance themselves. Actually the physical sensation of balance will indicate longevity, or life span.
Several specific Martial Arts focus on techniques to improve and develop balance. So it is my understanding that balance is not symmetrical issue, but more concerning the fluids and ear canals.
This would give me the thought why balance may effect sound perception...... ear Ear canals, fluids, and air pressure = ?

Just my 2 cents.....
Renshen

[thethrillfactor]

Originally posted by Renie
There's an interesting on-line test from today's Guardian on how male or female your brain is!!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/news/...937443,00.html

I scored 67 on the E test
29 on the S test.....

Renie,

I did 63 on the EQ test
31 on the SQ

The question that got me was about the plant life, wondering about the names.

[Jules]

I like to think my baggy jeans help me do my music work. I feel less "restricted" by them.

[Jax]

At this time, Jax made a 38 on the EQ, 31 on the SQ. Future results are subject to change without notice.

I always felt I had a fair balance of systemizin' to empathizin'.

Noticed there was overuse of "precisely" in many of the "ponderables" (I call them that cos they weren't questions...). That word doesn't leave enough room for what your tendencies would be. But ain't that what someone who is fairly equal in each would think? Also, there were conflicting statements in a few of them. Guess all that book learnin' at Cambridge doesn't count for as much as you'd think.

My SQ is often in conflict with my EQ, which results in me trying to come up with the best solution that hurts the least! Not easy!

[alphajerk]

Originally posted by Renie
Agreed, there were questions i tried to squeeze into due to lack of suitable answers, or questions that were just too flawed to start. Anyway it is interesting in terms of the gist of it..and probably about right in terms of the polar opposites we are Alpha!!!

i thought about the test some more while working today [nothing like thinking about something else while working] and i think the reason why i scored so low on the E side was because the nature was regarding STRANGERS. im naturally a VERY shy person at first.... and become very close and caring once i get to know someone. but until then most people think im a total ass.... well, they STILL think im a total ass after they get to know me but love me for it [i guess].

im suspecting if i retook it, i would score much higher subbing friends for strangers.

although the other side, i think i scored about right... that side was MUCH easier to take.

hey renie... my wife and i are polar opposites too. i think she would score the same as me on the test except in reverse. she is a bleeding heart softie but has no order to her and cant put two and two together to save her life [good thing or she wouldnt of married me in the first place]

[Jules]

Renie - "I wonder how Jules would score my guess would be E 23 S 50."

tutt

I have, by and large, a "cocktail party" personality (Hey! You're all at it! Fresh drink?), with a heightened social awareness. That is tempered though, by a rampant self centeredness.

Deep down however, once you do get to know me, I am really quite superficial!



So...

E 53
S 30

The results say I have a B Brain!

My dad used to call me "BB Brain" - so that works I guess!

I hire tech folks to fix my stuff! I dont need to understand how it works at all (yawn!), merely how to operate it. But folks like me appreciate all the high scoring S folks on here...and try not to crack jokes about their pencil protectors and obsession to detail.

[Renie]

Originally posted by thethrillfactor
Renie,

I did 63 on the EQ test
31 on the SQ

The question that got me was about the plant life, wondering about the names.

Hey thrill, we're pretty similar ..

I remeber that question, i thought about my dad who's an ex-forester, when we go out together his conversation consists of lists of the names of the flora and fauna as we pass by, I'm directed to closer views with the binoculars he supplies me ... he said he met an old teacher of mine when i was small who said he would never forget me because I corrected him about the exact name of a kind of fern ....

I feel essentially quite different to that type of personality, my dad left when I was 11, but with audio gear I probably am a bit like that, it feels like it's all about 'better sound' but maybe there's more to it. I know there are people here much more 'obsessive' than me...or maybe they're just further down the road..


"Boys enjoy playing with toys that have clear functions, buttons to press, things that light up, or devices that will cause another object to move."

sounds like what we are doing here!! toys- that- make- sound- move- r- us
If i were 'normal' I'd be out there having coffee mornings and caring for neighbours pets!!Oh well!!

[Renie]

Originally posted by Jax
At this time, Jax made a 38 on the EQ, 31 on the SQ. Future results are subject to change without notice.

I always felt I had a fair balance of systemizin' to empathizin'.

Noticed there was overuse of "precisely" in many of the "ponderables" (I call them that cos they weren't questions...). That word doesn't leave enough room for what your tendencies would be. But ain't that what someone who is fairly equal in each would think? Also, there were conflicting statements in a few of them. Guess all that book learnin' at Cambridge doesn't count for as much as you'd think.

My SQ is often in conflict with my EQ, which results in me trying to come up with the best solution that hurts the least! Not easy!

Jax,

Nice and balanced!!! and too right about the limits of academia

[Renie]

Originally posted by alphajerk

im suspecting if i retook it, i would score much higher subbing friends for strangers.

although the other side, i think i scored about right... that side was MUCH easier to take.

hey renie... my wife and i are polar opposites too. i think she would score the same as me on the test except in reverse. she is a bleeding heart softie but has no order to her and cant put two and two together to save her life [good thing or she wouldnt of married me in the first place]

I opted for a balance of friends to strangers but sometimes it was hard, like do you really enjoy looking after people? well it really does depend!!

and yes, contrasting personalities can make great sparking combos!! especially when they encourage oneanother to develop and learn from eachother! one way or another!!

[Renie]

Originally posted by Jules
Renie - "I wonder how Jules would score my guess would be E 23 S 50."

tutt

I have, by and large, a "cocktail party" personality (Hey! You're all at it! Fresh drink?), with a heightened social awareness. That is tempered though, by a rampant self centeredness.

Deep down however, once you do get to know me, I am really quite superficial!



So...

E 53
S 30

The results say I have a B Brain!

My dad used to call me "BB Brain" - so that works I guess!

I hire tech folks to fix my stuff! I dont need to understand how it works at all (yawn!), merely how to operate it. But folks like me appreciate all the high scoring S folks on here...and try not to crack jokes about their pencil protectors and obsession to detail.

Jules,

so sorry for getting you wrong!! I'm not a clever as i thought then

deep down you're superficial eh? I'm trying to fathom that...does it mean heavily defended, or beyond caring I wonder. But we're getting a bit deeper than flashing lights aren't we.

[alphajerk]

Originally posted by Renie
I opted for a balance of friends to strangers but sometimes it was hard, like do you really enjoy looking after people? well it really does depend!!

its a tough one... i seem to choose [probably based on the S side] who i help and who i empathize with the weird one was do you empathize with people you see on the TV... depends on the circumstance. sometimes i feel damn sad for them, most times im fully detached [i answered strongly disagree which probably didnt help my score any]

and i think a lot stems from my personality. i have difficulty letting others do things for me out of the fear of it not getting done properly. i will also go out of my way for people to do things for them to insure it gets done properly.... and recently, several things i have done have backfired in how people perceive me saying some pretty nasty things about me [which pisses me off and makes me colder to those people]

i also probably was a little aprehensive about answering some of the questions about reading people. im actually REALLY good at it to a fault but its not by reading visual cues but picking up on energy.... ill miss any visual cues but still get cues elsewhere.

so who knows. whats the topic again? genetic traits towards music? hell if i know.... i wish i had better genetics to sing. i wish i could sing but i CANT. sucks for me. i do often wonder why some can sing FAR better than others.

[Renie]

Originally posted by alphajerk

and i think a lot stems from my personality. i have difficulty letting others do things for me out of the fear of it not getting done properly. i will also go out of my way for people to do things for them to insure it gets done properly.... and recently, several things i have done have backfired in how people perceive me saying some pretty nasty things about me [which pisses me off and makes me colder to those people]

i also probably was a little aprehensive about answering some of the questions about reading people. im actually REALLY good at it to a fault but its not by reading visual cues but picking up on energy.... ill miss any visual cues but still get cues elsewhere.

so who knows. whats the topic again? genetic traits towards music? hell if i know.... i wish i had better genetics to sing. i wish i could sing but i CANT. sucks for me. i do often wonder why some can sing FAR better than others.

maybe people feel undermined in your focus to get things 'done properly' although you are genuinely focussed on the best results it does sound like you think you're the 'best', you may well be but people can find that tough!!

so do you pick up on sound energy because what else is there other than visual?, touch i suppose or spiritual, the latter two are not in my radar much at work!!or do you mean it's visual but unconscious?

the topic has evolved