Apple gets in the audio hardware market

[mersisblue]

cool I like the price but would like to see logic excessories

[RobMacki]

According to internal company estimates, sales of the device are projected to add approximately $3 million to Apple's bottom line each quarter.

EACH QUARTER!!! Too many GarageBands!

[Crandall1]

Oh, dear. As the owner of a label, the thought of all the demos we're going to get made with AppleLoops makes my eye start to tic uncontrollably.

-Chris Randall

[chadly]

Is anyone getting sick of microsoft, I mean Apple muscling in on the production business? Any thoughts on what this is going to do?

[mersisblue]

i imagine prices will drop

hopefully we'll see more apples

[GilWave]

This was inevitable.

How long before we see Final Cut Pro/Audio with Digi HD-like hardware?

The DAW wars ratchet up a notch...

[Kestral]

Doesn't affect anything. My recordings done on a Pro Tools HD with an Apogee box with a U47, Neve 1073 and Urei 1176 will still completely blow "Asteroid" away.

[GilWave]

Originally posted by Kestral
Doesn't affect anything. My recordings done on a Pro Tools HD with an Apogee box with a U47, Neve 1073 and Urei 1176 will still completely blow "Asteroid" away.

Well, it does if you're M-Audio (now part of Avid), Frontier, Aardvark, Echo, or any other company making entry-to-mid level audio hardware.

Not everyone is as blessed as you are to have Apogee, Neve and Urei gear. And while your recordings might sonically blow "Asteroid", it doesn't mean diddly if no one hears them.

Many in the next generation of "garage bands" (no pun intended) are growing up without the love and respect for the brands we hold dear. To them, "good enough" is good enough. They don't know a Neuman from an ADK, nor do they care.

It will be a natural extension for them to go from Apple iPod + iTunes to iMac + Garage Band w/ Asteroid to G5 + Logic Pro w/ [insert future Apple audio hardware product here].

The digital future is crashing down on us whether we like it or not. As a purveyor of analog kit I would like it to be later rather than sooner, but it is what it is.

Long live Analog!

-gil

[DrDeltaM]

Originally posted by GilWave
G5 + Logic Pro w/ [insert future Apple audio hardware product here].

I hope you're right about this one. The rumoured interface is kinda like the Apple "MBox", but who knows it clears the road for a true professional audio interface?

[Frost]

There are a million people who can record at home now, the ones that matter still know that their skills and equipment arent up to par with a real studio.

Frost

[GilWave]

The problem is, what defines a "real studio" these days?

API 56 input console with Studer A820s? Dolby SR?

An older SSL with 48 to 96 tracks of Sony reel-to-reel digital?

Or a new SSL 900 or Digi Icon with Pro Tools HD with 96 or 192 I/O?

Or what about Nuendo? Digital Performer? Mackie D8B or HDR?

Is a studio defined by the gear, the amount of rooms, or whether or not it is a commercial facility?

When Alanis Morissette recorded Jagged Little Pill on ADATs, and went on to sell over 28 million copies of it, does that constitute a studio record?

Does anybody care where U2 recorded their new album, or do people buy it because of the band and the songs? Apple didn't care when they signed their exclusive with U2, and premiered the album 6 weeks ahead of its CD release on iTunes.

Also, a persons skills have very little to do with what studio they record in.

-g

[natpub]

Your right on target Gil.

And to take it further, cultures and society develop their definition of what sounds "good" based up how their collective ears are trained, educated, and conditioned. As a result, a whole generation is now being conditioned to perceive ever-cheaper and degraded sonics as sounding "professional."

A perfect metaphor would be to compare classic, hand-painted Disney-like animation to the 3DS-Max rendered stuff today. I see kids under 10 YO who see the Disney classics and think it looks "old fashioned" and they say it is "boring." Those same kids may soon feel that the finest analog material sounds "old fashioned" also, and perhaps subsequently boring. There will always be those who adore "Kind of Blue," but that will always be music history rather than future.

The good news is, though it is likely that completely adequate studio gear will get smaller and cheaper, the old rules of tracking and mixing skill will remain untouched. Furthermore, this is a probably a great time to invest in the one piece of kit that will not pass out of fashion...mics :-)

[GilWave]

I was watching "The Incredibles" last weekend, and wondered if Disney would "remake" their classics (Bambi, Sleeping Beauty, Cinderella, Pinochio, etc) in 3D Pixar-style computer animation to appeal to the new kids, much like Turner colorized black and white films to try and extend their popularity.

I was happy when they found the Robert Johnson cylinders and released a CD set of his work, but I have to admit it's hard to listen to beyond its historical value.

As for microphones, I would agree with you to a point - but you can get some pretty good mics from ADK, SE and the like, and for most people they are "good enough". The amount of enthusiasts willing to pay $5000 for a Neumann are reducing in number with each passing year, and at some point it just won't matter to anyone.

On another note - I find it ironic that the very digital technology that Sony/Phillips forced on our industry since the mid 80's would make it possible to "share" music over computers today, which in turn cost the record industry (Sony included) 100s of millions in lost revenue. Was it worth it?

With all the promise that digital was to bring us, we are still running around searching for the perfect magic piece of gear that will add back that elusive "analog-like quality" that we had in the first place!!

When technological advances happen in other industries (automobiles, appliances, computers), sales and market share typically INCREASE. With all the technological advances in our industry, sales of CDs, # of bands signed, tours, etc DECREASED.

The AES in San Francisco was much smaller than prior years. The Tonmeister Tagung in Dresden this year had 1/3 the amount of exhibitors. Guitar Center, Sweetwater, AMS/zZounds and Sam Ash combined do the lions share of the MI and Pro-sumer business, so how relevant is the NAMM show going to be, long-term?

WalMart did $248 Billion dollars last year. One-quarter of a trillion dollars. In their annual report they admitted that 80% of their goods are manufactured in China - almost $200 billion dollars worth!!!!!

The customers who shop at Walmart think the stuff they buy there is "good enough". The customers who shop at GC, etc feel the same.

It is my hope that a percentage of customers can be educated to discern the difference between "good enough" and exceptional, so that the good folks at Gearslutz and the manufactuers and dealers who cater to them can all enjoy a measure of success.

Someone get this soap box outta here!

-g

[radiospace]

Originally posted by GilWave
The customers who shop at Walmart think the stuff they buy there is "good enough". The customers who shop at GC, etc feel the same.

Is a Neumann bought at Guitar Center not as good as one bought elsewhere for more money?

[GilWave]

Originally posted by radiospace
Is a Neumann bought at Guitar Center not as good as one bought elsewhere for more money?

How many of the 134 Guitar Center stores carry Neumann?

I was referring to the used market for vintage Neumann's anyway - no one is paying $5k for a new one.

-g

[radiospace]

Originally posted by GilWave
How many of the 134 Guitar Center stores carry Neumann?

I was referring to the used market for vintage Neumann's anyway - no one is paying $5k for a new one.

My local Guitar Center carries Neumann, in fact they frequently stock vintage Neumann's for $$$$$$$.

[natpub]

Originally posted by radiospace
My local Guitar Center carries Neumann, in fact they carry vintage Neumann's for $5,000.

then that has to be the exception.


My GC didnt even have a 4060 or a new 414 for me to listen to. They said they would gladly order both of them if I bought them in advance :-(

[radiospace]

Originally posted by natpub
then that has to be the exception.


My GC didnt even have a 4060 or a new 414 for me to compare. They said they would gladly order both of them if I paid for it :-(

I'm sure it is the exception!

[GilWave]

Originally posted by radiospace
My local Guitar Center carries Neumann, in fact they carry vintage Neumann's for $5,000.

Oh for goodness sakes, how much for a NEW one?

I'll bet they have a nice vintage guitar room too, with '57 Les Paul's for >$25,000. But that is not what they, or Walmart, are doing their majority business in.

If you buy a Neumann at auction or on eBay, it's to get that particular Neumann. If it's at GC, it's to get you into GC to (hopefully) buy other stuff while you are there. And that's not a bad thing, nor is it wrong. However, it's not called "Vintage Microphone Center", it's called "Guitar Center", and they did close to 1.3 billion $$ last year. I can assure you, that wasn't from vintage Neumann mics.

-g

[natpub]

Actually I think AMS is the Walmart of mega online music stores. GC and Ash are more like Target & K-Mart

[natpub]

Originally posted by GilWave
As for microphones, I would agree with you to a point - but you can get some pretty good mics from ADK, SE and the like, and for most people they are "good enough".
-g

I agree with you here, Gil.

My point was that I believe it entirely reasonable to expect that everything needed to make truly fantastic sounding recordings on a very small digital unit is just around the corner.

Modeling technology is improving, and will surely get much better as computing power increases. The only thing unlikely to be made smaller, digital, and better are mics.

That said, even though the mic modelers now are such garbage that few will even discuss them, I gotta wonder if they too will simply become so fantastic and accurate that $10,000 mics will no longer be necessary.

Perhaps all we will need in the future will be a couple multi-pattern wide-range, totally flat mics, and the modelers will do the rest....sigh, who knows.

I fear we already hear far more Amp Farm than any dare suspect.

[GilWave]

Originally posted by natpub
Actually I think AMS is the Walmart of mega online music stores. GC and Ash are more like Target & K-Mart

Intersting.

From a numbers standpoint, GC (a publically traded company, these figures are available in their annual report) derives around 20% of its revenue from the Musician's Friend catalog, so somewhere in the viscinty of $240 million (which, interestingly, represents just .1% of WalMart's revenue).

Sam Ash (with 45 stores and a catalog) is a distant second, with AMS and Sweetwater not far behind.

So IMHO GC is the Walmart, Ash is the K-Mart/Sears, and AMS is the Target.

-gil

[GilWave]

NatPub -

Mics are necessary, but what connotes the "good" ones is a moving target.

I had a band in the '70's (yeah, I'm on my way to geezer-hood) and I used to be able to buy Shure SM58's for $98, SM57's for $79.

That's pretty much what they cost today. But I bet their manufacturing cost is way lower than it was in the '70's. I wonder how many SM58s have been sold since day one. I wonder, of that amount, how many are still in service. Butunlike Neumann, nobody will give me $5000 for my old SM58 from 1973.

I auditioned some ADK mikes that were very impressive for the money. I've heard raves about SE Electonics. But I still prefer Royer and Brauner - but I can afford 'em. In 1973 I was lucky to be able to afford enough SM8's for 3 of us to sing.

It's all relative.

-g