Mbox 2 Pro or Apogee Duet

[jmorales]

I am thinking about purchasing one of these two and was wondering the difference in sonic quality between the two. I am only recording acoustic guitar and vocals (but not simultaneously). Probably with only one mic at a time. Between the two is one substantially better than the other. (ie mic preamps and overall quality.

[dhiltonlittle]

i think the apogee sounds alot better. the question is are you going to be or do you want to be using protools le? if so you can not use the apogee with it.

[Whitecat]

the duet sounds better.

but do you need to run Pro Tools?

if so, the Mbox is the one.

EDIT: d'oh, gotta be quicker...

[jmorales]

i don't need to run one over the other. i could do either. i was wondering if one sounds significantly better. is the duet as good as you say. I hear everyone raving about here on the site. I'm sorry to ask ask, but what about the duet makes it sound so much better than the mbox 2 pro. (like what specific aspects). I know this is an annoying topic, but any help you guys can give me is much appreciated.

[thesuitelounge]

Careful...I was in this exact position a few months ago. I had an MBox 2 Pro on a Dual 2.5 G5. I CONSTANTLY ran into buffer error problems, tracking latency in LE always bothered me a little bit. I sold both, and bought a Duet and Logic (with a MacBookPro). Not in order of importance, but things to consider:

1. Software - you have decide if you need to use PT. If you get the Duet you can't (I do miss PT and am now considering going to an HD setup - but that's another story)

2. Sound quality - NOT EVEN CLOSE. I listen to mixes I did with my MBox 2 Pro vs. the Duet. It literally sounds like someone took a comforter off of my monitors. In fact, I a playing back some older mixes the other day and my wife walked in the room, when I went from a duet mix to an mbox 2 pro mix, she literally said, "why does this song sound so muffled?"...so to the avg listener side by side...

So, the Duet works (no glitches/buffer errors, VERY little latency) and sounds great, you are using Logic, period.

MBox 2 Pro, you could use either/both LE/Logic software, maybe some LE inherent limitations, sound quality NOT as great.

Good luck

[dhiltonlittle]

the preamps and overall quality on the digi are far from desirable. unless you are wanting to get a protools system there are no reasons why i'd pick that over the apogee.

[littledoodler]

the duet is about 100 times better unit than the Mbox. I think the Pro Tools LE is a huge scam and is really really buggy. Buy Logic express and a Duet and things will work out well for you.

[tsvisser]

...but the MBox2 Pro has a lot more I/O capabilities than the Duet, so if you had external A/D and D/A units, you could use those in conjunction with the MBox, where the Duet has no digital I/O and it also only has single ended outputs.

Between the two, I would go with the Duet myself, but I find it shocking that there isn't digital I/O at least... and unbalanced outputs? I mean, its not a big deal for short runs to a monitor, but who would have thought that a pro audio company would have made that decision?

PRESS RELEASE: Apogee announces the Quadriplegic. 2 channels Mic/Line and 2 channels via SPDIF or AES/EBU. Now has balanced outputs and two separate knobs, one for input, one for output, plus DAW transport control buttons. $1000 Now were talking, something a step up, but still not quite a full step up to the Ensemble.

But honestly, the more important question is do you want to run ProTools or not? That seems to be the larger issue to me. If you haven't learned PT already or are not a professional that HAS to use it, you are probably better served by going the Logic or Cubendo route.

[Doc Mixwell]

What do you need a digital I/O for? Why bypass good conversion? If you need a software dongle, there are plenty of them out there. but why waste the dough to simply interface a better converter? Looking at it this way, there's no point to even buying a product like this......

If you need digital I/O for a more complex system, the Ensemble is the choice. Duet is as simple as it can be, which for most is what the point is here, not flexibility and compatibility. Making a 1000$ interface would be pointless when the Ensemble is already being made to suit these needs.

Sure its more money than 1000$, but its got more features.....

[thesuitelounge]

he's right. and so are the above posts. Take my experience - I already went this route BEFORE THE DUET was released. I even had an Apogee Mini-Me in front of my M Box 2 Pro, and the Duet STILL sounds better. And it's a simple, easy to use solution that WORKS. UNLESS you NEED PT software (which you said you don't) and more ins-outs, the Duet is the way to go. I am only considering going to PT HD because I miss the PT interface and workflow, but even that is a hard sell for me now since the Duet is so good. (I have an engineer friend that argued with me for an hour that the Duet converters are better than the Digi 192 in PT HD)....If you get an MBox 2 Pro, get a Rosetta and a really good pre, and the MBox becomes a software dongle for PT LE, but that's a different setup...

[tsvisser]

I'm just saying, If I wanted to use my API A2D or Neve 1073DPD on a minimalist setup, I'd actually probably go with the Apogee MiniDAC + FW just because of its digital I/O. Under $1k, there's no question in my mind that the Duet is the best deal out there, if you value sound quality. In fact, I can't think of another box under $1500 that I'd choose over it and the next contender for me is the ULN2. Its just a shame that they could have added a lot more flexibility had they added digital I/O, which in reality, could not have added that much to the cost. I suppose that $500 was a magic number for marketing, and obviously corners were cut to make it happen, but that's the reality of electronics sales.

...or to put it another way, the MBox2 is a 6 in 8 out box with independent headphone monitoring capability that has mediocre everything and runs ProTools. The Duet is a 2 in 2 out that has a very good signal chain, and either headphone OR monitor feed and doesn't act as a dongle to run ProTools. They really look like entirely different products from both a hardware and software standpoint, so your requirements should end up being the driving force, not necessarily a 1 for 1 comparison.

It would be interesting to get Max's take on this

Myself, like I said, my choice would be the Duet, just trying to point out where the products are different. I also know that I wouldn't only spend $500 on gear if I was just starting out and I'd quickly outgrow the Duet.

[Doc Mixwell]

Originally Posted by tsvisser

I'm just saying, If I wanted to use my API A2D or Neve 1073DPD on a minimalist setup, I'd actually probably go with the Apogee MiniDAC + FW just because of its digital I/O. Under $1k, there's no question in my mind that the Duet is the best deal out there, if you value sound quality. In fact, I can't think of another box under $1500 that I'd choose over it and the next contender for me is the ULN2. Its just a shame that they could have added a lot more flexibility had they added digital I/O, which in reality, could not have added that much to the cost. I suppose that $500 was a magic number for marketing, and obviously corners were cut to make it happen, but that's the reality of electronics sales.

.....totally understandable! And yea the Mini-DAC is great in that regard [mini-advanced routing]

But, what would you say If I said just patch the analog outputs into the Duet and use its AD converters with your external preamps? How much better do you think the AD converters are.....in the unit's you have.

Of course the A2D is an awesome converter; but consider the cost of it....
I dunno, its worth a shot. I haven't really used the Neve AD converter in any real application.....it does cost more money, but we all know that says nothing about what the gear offers to the end user.

[staudio]

I love my Duet. I works well and sounds better than anything else with a similar form factor.

[tsvisser]

I'm not saying to get caught up in the digital to digital comparison, I guess what I really should say is that that with the MBox2 Pro, you could use a high end external box if you wanted to, and still have 4 utilitarian channels to use for something else. I would absolutely use the Duet's converters for any application I could think of? Would they be better than a dedicated external converter? No, they wouldn't, but would I worry about it, probably not.

Honestly, there is a part of me that would obsess over the ability to A/D close to the source, so I do like that about interfaces where digital I/O is offered. But really, we're talking about some guys first purchase of an interface to start building his home studio. My problems are not this guy's problems. He may not have good mics, I don't know, there are a lot of factors to consider... but after a couple of months when he has some material written and wants to bring a drummer into track with him, is he going to want to upgrade to an ensemble then or would he appreciate the MBox's extra I/O?

ProTools or NOT ProTools?
2/2 analog I/O or 4/4 analog (+2/2 digital) I/O

When evaluating that, the answer should be obvious.

[jmorales]

ok so I've made my choice, I'm going with the apogee duet. I am thinking of getting it used (good or bad idea?). how can i tell if it is a good unit when I see it or how can I test it. also do i need the logic studio for soundtrack pro, etc or can i just logic express. is it worth it to get the larger software bundle and is it more complicated? Thanks guys

[jmorales]

also, in the future if I want to get an interface with more ins and outs. I can still use the duet as a nice mic pre can't I? or will that cause problems. I want to keep that quality and I think I can just use the duet pres as a preamp to perhaps an mbox or something.

[moonman]

these threads can be confusing..i think i can help you a little bit,,i had an mbox2 until recently,,i really had never recorded digitally before(i had my own studio that was all analog for awhile),,i didnt really do any homework, i thought everybody used pro tools , and it was cheap. i got it, and guess what,,it worked-but it sucked. i was totally dissapointed and it took alot of fixing when i went to mix,,,noise,hiss etc was awful and it froze during tracking constantly,,it is a lame piece of gear..now the duet on the other hand is awesome. really great sound and it is literally night and day to the mbox ,,if your going to do 2 tracks at a time this is it..you can get logic 8 le for 150 or the full for 400 both are great and with the duet and maybe a nice plug or 2 you can do pro recordings..if you need more than 2 tracks at a time than the mbox/duet world is too small and you need to get away from the idea of using either,,apogee makes the ensemble which is 8 tracks and then there are a few more options,,dont waste any of your money like i did,,the duet is a great solution to 2 track recording,, i have 2 ribbon mics and a nice tube mic(2 cascade fat heads and an elroy),,i recorded my whole band 2 tracks at a time- guitar in stereo, drums(tube in front ribbon above), cello and viola (tube ribbon blumein set up),glock etc ..it sounds great,,totally pro,,i couldnt be happier,it sounds very close to analog and is organic sounding,,my whole rig(excluding my mac 5)costs less than 1500 and i can record whatever whenever with totally pro results,,ok.

[thesuitelounge]

I agree with this...had MBOx2 Pro , HAVE Duet. Not sure about it as a be-all/end all solution (you may eventually want some external pre's/dynamics, more inputs for larger tracking sessions), but yes, to take it anywhere, sound quality (not even for the price, for TWICE the price!) it's a great piece.

[thedommer]

definately the duet. if its just for personal or simple stuff you dont need or want protools. protools is for the engineer. killer editing software but total crap when it come sto songwriting and tracking (well le anyways) because the latency is lamer then lame. I have a mac pro 8 core 2.8 (the new one) and protools le still runs like a crippled mess on it. I use logic now. its a much better choice for song writing etc. of course if I was mixing full time then I would get a protools HD system.

example. on logic with latency at 128 I can run BFD2 metal amp room and a ton of other synths/plugins. on LE I cant seem to get it to do that without glitching at 256.

If I dont have a lot of plugins on I can get 64 with logic!! with protools and one plugin I cant get that...can barely get 128.

the fact of the matter is protools le is crippled and the mbox converters are less then stellar. get the duet and never look back.

[thesuitelounge]

for thedommer, if you were songwriting and tracking LIVE/REAL instruments, guitars, vox, (not VI's), liked Logic with a Duet, and had enough money for an HD system, would you buy it?

[firby]

I bought a Duet to use for my masterbuss on a great big board. It is phenominal. Never even used the mic pres although I hear they are allright.

[spitfire8898]

but I thought I'd post here instead of cluttering up the board with another old thread.

I currently have an mbox 2 pro and PT Le 7...I want to upgrade converters, have more I/O and have multiple monitors hooked up, and it looks like the Ensemble would fit the bill.

I always thought of it as "too pricey" for me, but after adding up what converters, a monitor switcher and more I/O would cost anyhow, it's a great deal...


It looks like since the Duet beats out the mbox 2 pro, the ensemble should be a no-brainer, right? So, Would it be worth the switch to Logic? Never used it, don't even think I've seen it in action...any help would be appreciated

[Duardo]

(I have an engineer friend that argued with me for an hour that the Duet converters are better than the Digi 192 in PT HD)....

Why couldn't they be?

[thedommer]

Originally Posted by thesuitelounge

for thedommer, if you were songwriting and tracking LIVE/REAL instruments, guitars, vox, (not VI's), liked Logic with a Duet, and had enough money for an HD system, would you buy it?

ha. didn't notice this question until today! and the question is how many instruments and do I own a sweet studio? if the answers are "lots" and "yes" then yes I would buy HD in other other situations then no.

[webraider]

Originally Posted by jmorales

I am thinking about purchasing one of these two and was wondering the difference in sonic quality between the two. I am only recording acoustic guitar and vocals (but not simultaneously). Probably with only one mic at a time. Between the two is one substantially better than the other. (ie mic preamps and overall quality.

The Apogee Duet is far better in the DAT's that it uses and it's really the first Audio Interface to ship with Good Decent Pre-Amps! Unless you NEED Pro-Tools, there is NO reason that you cannot use Logic. For the money you spend, you get the same quality of Pro-Tools, but far more Tools than Pro-Tools. You would spend an arm and a leg to get the same effects, instruments, etc.. than you do with Logic. If you've only used Pro-tools, or need it for compatibility on specific projects (Logic can export and import OMF etc..) then using PT's may be something that you want to consider. I would suggest that you look at something like M-Audio Pro Fire 610. It's probably better quality than the M-Box But not as good as the Apogee. I'm probably gonna hear it from the ProTools camp for posting this message but hey.. I'm just letting you know my experience/advice.

[patshep]

the duet also has better mic pres, in addition to better converters... if digi had apogee make the mbox, wouldn't that be cool

[youngrob]

get the duet, i have mbox2 i dont recommend it...