A&H Zed R16 Firewire Mixer

[arvproductions]

Originally Posted by GraemeSP

I looked back through all AlienHealth's posts and I can't find a compatibilty checker. My eyes are drying up reading this forum and I need a beer.

I've used PCs and Cakewalk since it was a DOS program. "Get a ZED" I was told - "best mixers going". So when my Behringer died I bought this nice R16. It worked fine with my PC although I could never get the MIDI functions to work for long. I like it - its sexy and it sounds great.

I have heard from many a Mac user that Macs are the way to go for audio recording and when I started having problems with my PC (BSOD - largely due to a wire jamming the CPU cooler fan) I thought seeing as I needed to replace everything in my PC, I'd try the Mac route and I bought an Imac and Logic. Now with most of my hair lying on the studio floor after repeated attempts to get this piece of junk working with my ZED, the next person who tells me that Macs are the way forward is going to get his lights punched out. Apple forums say the IMac firewire chip is at fault, but mine is made by TI and supposed to be the "right one". I've had nothing from my enquiries to Allen & Heath, both by email and on the tech support web site. I've read every post by AlienHealth and so far nothing has made the slightest bit of difference. I've got projects backing up and clients making tutting noises. I need to get this situation resolved.

Sorry to hear this Graeme.
I took a similar route when my PC was not powerfull enough anymore to do the stuff i wanted to do. So i went ahead and procured a MacPro and a ZEDR16. I just did not want to make any consessions.
I know the old PC also had the correct TI chip, and so does the Mac.

As far as the problems you are dealing with, i think the message you are talking about: "ZED DICE loading - blah blah ZEDDICE rejected" is a message concerning the FW driver. It sounds to me that the driver is not correct. Check the A&H site, they offer different versions.

R

[daveg62]

Does anyone here have a decent case for their ZED? And where did you get it? The only one I can find is selling on ebay and made by NY roadcase or something like that for $99. I'm not sure how good they are and don't want junk.

[malfunction]

here are a couple but they're in Europe:

Mixer Case for Allen & Heath Zed R16 Firewire m 4

THON MIXERCASE ALLEN&HEATH ZED-R16 - U.K. International Cyberstore

[daveg62]

Originally Posted by malfunction

here are a couple but they're in Europe:

Mixer Case for Allen & Heath Zed R16 Firewire m 4

THON MIXERCASE ALLEN&HEATH ZED-R16 - U.K. International Cyberstore

Yes they both look very good, now if I could only find one in US.
Gator makes 20x30 cases but I might have to adapt them for good fit and that's about all I can find here.

[Andrew Spence]

If you use the full 16 ins + 8 adats is it possible to still monitor post daw through the desk?

If recording at 44.1/48

I understand that its not possible to monitor the adat inputs when tracking? or am I mixed up

I"m looking for a good solution to getting around 20 channels in at once to Logic but I'dprefer to be monitoring post daw.


Anyone enlighten me to this?

Cheers.

[WAVERUNNER]

I use mac 10.4.11. has anyone tried using this board with Digital Performer 4.6? I would really hate to switch my tracking program. Any other issues I should be warned about with Mac? Seems like a kickass board. I hope it works out.

[GraemeSP]

Right - I'm sorted. How, why I don't know but my problem is fixed. Gustav came from the shop and spent ten minutes doing exactly what I'd spent the last two weeks doing , install drivers, dress up audio settings, set outputs and inputs - make test recording - but after he'd finished the ruddy thing worked. "A small problem, I installed the drivers and set outputs 17 & 18 up" he said - But I DID that! - I reckon the iMac knew I hated it and thats why it wouldn't work for me. A teeth grinding moment , but it works now.

At least I've learned a bit about firewire, Zeds and Imacs - and this forum, which by the way is a GOLD MINE of useful information.

Allen & Heath were no help. I had this query up on their tech support site for two weeks with nothing more than a email saying they'd received my query and would get back to me. A nice mixer but it was costly and caused me a lot of angst and lost hair.

Based on this experience, I don't think I'll be having anything more to do with A&H products. If this ZED packs in again, I'll snip out out everything digital and use it as a live mixer. Mackies have a good rep.

[arvproductions]

Originally Posted by GraemeSP

Right - I'm sorted. How, why I don't know but my problem is fixed. Gustav came from the shop and spent ten minutes doing exactly what I'd spent the last two weeks doing , install drivers, dress up audio settings, set outputs and inputs - make test recording - but after he'd finished the ruddy thing worked. "A small problem, I installed the drivers and set outputs 17 & 18 up" he said - But I DID that! - I reckon the iMac knew I hated it and thats why it wouldn't work for me. A teeth grinding moment , but it works now.

At least I've learned a bit about firewire, Zeds and Imacs - and this forum, which by the way is a GOLD MINE of useful information.

Allen & Heath were no help. I had this query up on their tech support site for two weeks with nothing more than a email saying they'd received my query and would get back to me. A nice mixer but it was costly and caused me a lot of angst and lost hair.

Based on this experience, I don't think I'll be having anything more to do with A&H products. If this ZED packs in again, I'll snip out out everything digital and use it as a live mixer. Mackies have a good rep.

I's very stupid that you start blaming A&H. And you should also be happy it works. As if the rest of the brands have no problems?
I don't undestand your whining at all pal.


R

[cavern]

some people should just stay away from complicated stuff.

[daveg62]

Just my $.02. These firewire issues can be very frustrating. One of the main reasons why I used an adat interface for the last several years. So it's the nature of the beast, you could be having the same issues no matter what firewire interface you use if your pc, firewire chipset, OS is not configured exactly right. WWIW I had tons of problems with an RME fireface, MOTU 828 before giving up on firewire and going adat. Now I'm back to firewire with the ZED and a newer, faster carefully chosen DAW and firewire works like a dream for me.... it's a hard sell blaming A&H for problematic firewire issues if you ask me.

[jplum]

Originally Posted by daveg62

Just my $.02. These firewire issues can be very frustrating. One of the main reasons why I used an adat interface for the last several years. So it's the nature of the beast, you could be having the same issues no matter what firewire interface you use if your pc, firewire chipset, OS is not configured exactly right. WWIW I had tons of problems with an RME fireface, MOTU 828 before giving up on firewire and going adat. Now I'm back to firewire with the ZED and a newer, faster carefully chosen DAW and firewire works like a dream for me.... it's a hard sell blaming A&H for problematic firewire issues if you ask me.

Suggestion for A&H is that any updates to ZED-R16 or an R24 model is to provide ADAT I/O option for ST-L & R and also maybe even the AUX bus

If I had ADAT on stereo bus on the ZED-R16 I would be not have used firewire at all and everything would go via RME RayDAT card

That said, so far everything is rock solid on Cubase 5.11(32bit) / Win7(X64)

rgds

[daveg62]

Originally Posted by jplum

Suggestion for A&H is that any updates to ZED-R16 or an R24 model is to provide ADAT I/O option for ST-L & R and also maybe even the AUX bus

If I had ADAT on stereo bus on the ZED-R16 I would be not have used firewire at all and everything would go via RME RayDAT card

That said, so far everything is rock solid on Cubase 5.11(32bit) / Win7(X64)

rgds

I agree. The only reason I use firewire is because of the master bus. I'm still using both though. Matter of fact I just bought an Alesis HD24 and it works very well hooked up adat to the Zed. So I kinda have tons of options here and I'm in the experimental stage looking for the best way to work. Remotely it's Zed and HD24 via adat, studio firewire seems to work best because of the stereo bus, but i still have my RME 9652 card and wondering if I can use this somehow.

[AlienHealth]

Hi Guys,

Just caught up on the last couple of pages of posts (sorry that I didn't pick yours up sooner Graeme, I'll feed your comments back to Tech Support -gently!)

Just to say that we have had a few issues reported to Support where channels can't be accessed or seen in Logic 9 running on Mac OS X 10.6.
We looked into this and replicated it using older console firmware (the channel naming is slightly different). Once the latest console firmware is loaded everything is ok. Obviously Logic 9 has an issue with the older channel naming scheme.
So if anyone has problems seeing the output channels from the R16 with Logic 9 it's worth checking the firmware version by enabling the "Show Details" box in the Upload area of the driver control panel and iff the "App" number is previous to 1.2.0 then load the new console firmware.
The details for how to do this are attached (similar for Win & Mac), the firmware is be on our website but is also attached.

Cheers,
Mike.

[microwave]

Originally Posted by GraemeSP

I looked back through all AlienHealth's posts and I can't find a compatibilty checker. My eyes are drying up reading this forum and I need a beer.

I've used PCs and Cakewalk since it was a DOS program. "Get a ZED" I was told - "best mixers going". So when my Behringer died I bought this nice R16. It worked fine with my PC although I could never get the MIDI functions to work for long. I like it - its sexy and it sounds great.

I have heard from many a Mac user that Macs are the way to go for audio recording and when I started having problems with my PC (BSOD - largely due to a wire jamming the CPU cooler fan) I thought seeing as I needed to replace everything in my PC, I'd try the Mac route and I bought an Imac and Logic. Now with most of my hair lying on the studio floor after repeated attempts to get this piece of junk working with my ZED, the next person who tells me that Macs are the way forward is going to get his lights punched out. Apple forums say the IMac firewire chip is at fault, but mine is made by TI and supposed to be the "right one". I've had nothing from my enquiries to Allen & Heath, both by email and on the tech support web site. I've read every post by AlienHealth and so far nothing has made the slightest bit of difference. I've got projects backing up and clients making tutting noises. I need to get this situation resolved.

Mine worked straight out of the box and in the nearly one year period I had it I've used it on four different macs without a hiccup. So maybe the problem lies elsewhere?

[echo44]

Ready to give up on the ZED R 16 and take my losses :(
The first unit I received had all kinds of problems opened it up and had the missing resister problem. Sweetwater sent me a new one . Tried recording a few simple tracks to make sure the computer could see the board( it couldn't before) and all seemed well. Haven't had a chance to record anything
since that initial test until last weekend. Up to last weekend I had been using the ZED as a live board for our band practice great sounding board. Last weekend I recorded around 12 channels simultaneously in logic at 44.1. Intermittently a loud scratchy digital noise occurred. Never had issues before recording using apogee. Running logic on a relatively new mac. It really gets frustrating having to
spend so much time trouble -shooting!!! Has anyone else had similar problems? Is this the so called "grounding issue" ?

[echo44]

Here is what the noise sounds like i think its a firewire grounding issue the more i think about it. it occurs on all channels simultaneously and randomly and infrequently
a few times every minuet sorry about the mix i didn't bother actually mixing stuff since i am very frustrated.

[Tranxformer]

Sounds like the drummer farted...

[echo44]

LOL!! It does except it occurs on all channels simultaneously.

[CKK]

Originally Posted by echo44

LOL!! It does except it occurs on all channels simultaneously.

Then point the mics away from the drummer. Sure it wont fix the problem as a (w)hole - but it would bring down the farting level on all channels. You could also ask him to put a cork in it while recording.

All in all, there is no reason for you to blame a perfect working mixer - blame the drummer (as always).

[daveg62]

Originally Posted by echo44

Here is what the noise sounds like i think its a firewire grounding issue the more i think about it. it occurs on all channels simultaneously and randomly and infrequently
a few times every minuet sorry about the mix i didn't bother actually mixing stuff since i am very frustrated.

Not so sure this has anything to do with the grounding issue. Mine had the grounding problem and it would just lose connection completely and not be seen by the computer. Un-plug and re-establish connection and it would be fine until it happened again randomly. Never had any noise at all, just either worked or would not been seen at all . Your problem seems quite different. It could very easily be a problem with your firewire card and have nothing to do with the Zed, but I'm no expert so hopefully tech support can give you some insight and you get it straightened out. I'd probably try it on a different pc if possible and then you'll know for sure if it's the Zed or not.

[echo44]

Originally Posted by daveg62

It could very easily be a problem with your firewire card and have nothing to do with the Zed, but I'm no expert so hopefully tech support can give you some insight and you get it straightened out. I'd probably try it on a different pc if possible and then you'll know for sure if it's the Zed or not.

Except I never had this problem with my apogee firewire A/D

The folks on the apple forums for logic think it may be an issue
with the ZED driver. I emailed tech support and have not heard back from them.

Very discourged!

[arvproductions]

Originally Posted by echo44

Except I never had this problem with my apogee firewire A/D

The folks on the apple forums for logic think it may be an issue
with the ZED driver. I emailed tech support and have not heard back from them.

Very discourged!

But i see you have both an imac and a desktop mac. On both systems the same problems?

[Cheesehead]

Well, kinda. Hello everyone. After studying this forum I ordered and received a new Zed R16 mixer, which arrived yesterday. (Oddly, it was stamped "Made in Great Britain" for all you Anglophiles.) I installed the latest driver on my PC (Win 7/Quadcore/64 bit) and the driver saw the mixer, and then prompted me to upgrade the mixer firmware. I did this, it seemed to take, but then the driver stopped seeing the mixer, and all the kings horses haven't brought it back. A@H tech support suggested un-installing and re-installing both drivers and firmware, but still no go. I just get a blank driver screen and it won't let me update the firmware. I fear the firmware upgrade has hosed up the mixer enough to require it's needing to be sent back to the manufacturer...

Am hoping someone/anyone in the group can think of something/anything that can bring it back. The ZED works fine in the analog realm. Any ideas apart from shooting myself would be appreciated.

sincerely,

Jamie Haynes, CT

[Jungle Jazz]

I've been seriously considering getting an R16, but from the user stories it seems that some folks have zero problems while others have several. Is there any way to tell, before purchase, which boards might be buggy? I'd be using it with a Mac G5 Quad and a G4 Powerbook.

[echo44]

I did get an email from A&H they recommended
i try to update the mixers firmware from 1.2 to 3.5
I have been using the latest driver but there is new firmware released
2/24/10 .
I did this and tried recording 8 mics on a drum sent and did not hear any noise
after playing for 3 min. Hopefully the problem is solved will be a while but next time i try recording my band i will let you know how it goes

[lance135]

I feel that these companies making boards with firewire interfaces are really missing something by leaving out any digital connectivity. I have a keyboard and guitar effects unit, both with digital outputs, but this board, and others like it, such as the Onyx-i board and even digital boards such as the Presonus StudioLive, have no way to connect the digital devices to the system.

I would still need a different interface for recording from the digital outputs on these devices - major interruption to work flow. Recording from the analog outputs is just not an option - the sound quality is much better using the digital outputs.

[djmukilteo]

Originally Posted by lance135

I feel that these companies making boards with firewire interfaces are really missing something by leaving out any digital connectivity. I have a keyboard and guitar effects unit, both with digital outputs, but this board, and others like it, such as the Onyx-i board and even digital boards such as the Presonus StudioLive, have no way to connect the digital devices to the system.

I would still need a different interface for recording from the digital outputs on these devices - major interruption to work flow. Recording from the analog outputs is just not an option - the sound quality is much better using the digital outputs.

I agree....full digital connectivity is a real plus. The ZED does provide ADAT in/out which works very well. I think SPDIF in/out would have been nice as well as providing the Master channels 17/18 in/out digital somewhere too.

[lance135]

Originally Posted by djmukilteo

I agree....full digital connectivity is a real plus. The ZED does provide ADAT in/out which works very well. I think SPDIF in/out would have been nice as well as providing the Master channels 17/18 in/out digital somewhere too.

I forgot about the ADAT connections - that's a major plus. Most of the other boards with built in audio interfaces don't even have that.

I was speaking about SPDIF (should have made that more clear), since that's the only digital output on most keyboards. I also have an Apogee Mini-Me (preamp/converter) that only has AES and SPDIF outputs.

I think for someone that mainly works with analog equipment, this board looks like a really good deal - the right balance of price and quality. I'm sure you could make some great recordings with this thing.

[highsage]

I've had my R16 since it came out...zero problems at all, until i loaded Snow Leopard and went to Logic 9 a few weeks ago. Now...the Zed will work fine, then just 'go away' and not be seen by OSX. Then I have to quit Logic, restart the Zed, then restart Logic. The Zed will also 'go away' even without logic. The other day was showing an artist some tracks online, and hit the PLAY button in the browser, only to have the music trickle out from the Mac Pro's tiny speaker. Quite embarrassing given I was just bragging about the Barefoots sitting on top of the desk...

The few things I notice that are 'weird' lately, are that a lot of times, even though my Zed jumper is set for 44.1, OSX 'wants' to see it as 48 before it's happy. I'll open a Logic session and the music is bitcrushed sounding. Close logic, change my Audio/Midi OSX settings for the Zed from 44.1 to 48, then BACK to 44.1, and good to go again. The ZEDICE is at 44.1 the whole time during this too. It's as if OSX is trying to kick the audio rate up to 48 on its own.

The other odd thing is in the ZEDICE description of 'my' Zed device. There's a werid 'UNKNOWN YADA YADA' error in the naming of it that I've not see before upgrading to Snow Leopard. I'm using latest driver/firmware from the A&H site as of last Wednesday, fwiw. Running Mac Pro dual quad core 2.8 with 10GB ram, and L9 in 32-bit mode.

Hope this helps add any more 'context' to the situation...but I fear it will only muddy things more. Not sure who/what to 'blame'...but I don't care to blame anyone...both A&H and Apple are two of the highest quality companies I've ever worked with in music gear...and sometimes, the cookie just crumbles the wrong way when OSes get updated, etc. My gosh, I used to spend 10x the amount of time when I was on windows re-installing drivers, BSOD'ing, and doing software/security updates. Drove me batty!

Originally Posted by daveg62

Not so sure this has anything to do with the grounding issue. Mine had the grounding problem and it would just lose connection completely and not be seen by the computer. Un-plug and re-establish connection and it would be fine until it happened again randomly. Never had any noise at all, just either worked or would not been seen at all . Your problem seems quite different. It could very easily be a problem with your firewire card and have nothing to do with the Zed, but I'm no expert so hopefully tech support can give you some insight and you get it straightened out. I'd probably try it on a different pc if possible and then you'll know for sure if it's the Zed or not.

[arvproductions]

Originally Posted by highsage

I've had my R16 since it came out... [...] Drove me batty!

Hi Highsage, my Zed got repared last month but before that i remember similar things happening..