different DAW sound qualities?

[andychamp]

All else being equal (computer, disk, audio interface), what makes a DAW sound better than another?
After all, seems to me that all they have to do is grab ones and zeroes from one place (disk) and take them somewhere else (audio interface). They also have to make sure that samples with the same time stamp get to their destination at the same time.

Are there really that many ways to do this correctly, some of which actually do sound better?

(@Mods: feel free to move this to geekslutz if you feel it's more appropriate)

[Mr.HOLMES]

Are there really that many ways to do this correctly, some of which actually do sound better?

DAW as you already wrote just capture sound as 0/1
I bet you will hardly hear a difference.

There are serious opinions that PT HD sounds better but no one made a serious test ever.

But with the right knowledge and talent in engineering you can let it rock anyway.
pack these stones of your back and go on making music...

So next DAW myth is that some sequencers are more tight as the others...
So all DAW you can get today do not sound bad and 20 years ago we would have given our right leg for such a sound.

[andychamp]

I'm not planning any purchase in that department anytime soon, nor do I fear I might be stuck with the wrong program.
I just read someone in another thread saying they thought Nuendo's audio engine sounded better than others.

My question mainly relates to wether this is technically at all possible.

[pootkao]

Your A-D converters will dictate the sound much more than the processing of your DAW.

[Mr.HOLMES]

Nuendo's audio engine sounded better than others.

What where the arguments?
This topic is so complicate in a technical way.
Internal BIT rates etc Float Fixed etc.

I just can tell you that I have worked with Logic as well as with PT (LE+HD) and I can hardly hear a difference that my mixes sound better on one of the systems.

This topic will end up with the term "cumulative truncation" which means the more tracks you have in your daw project the more you will lose fine informations such as tails of an reverb etc. Higher BIT rates work against this phenomena.

But if you ask me up to 40 tracks in Logic makes no difference for my ears.
And if there is truncation its like you are switching from a very good AD to a poor AD.

You can work against this with analogue summing boxes... but again if you ask me we have a great sound today in any way....

People which bring these topic up are mostly bubbling the marketing stuff after.
Steinberg is telling since years that Cu-base is sounding better as Logic because of that Cubase is rendering 32 BIT files. Both hosts are calculating internal with 32 BITs.

I hardly can hear any difference and just can tell you this seems to me as a hopeless selling argument.

I have read so many discussions about this topic that I can say.
Do not waste your time with it. It is not worth it.

[bgrotto]

Originally Posted by andychamp

All else being equal (computer, disk, audio interface), what makes a DAW sound better than another?
After all, seems to me that all they have to do is grab ones and zeroes from one place (disk) and take them somewhere else (audio interface). They also have to make sure that samples with the same time stamp get to their destination at the same time.

Are there really that many ways to do this correctly, some of which actually do sound better?

(@Mods: feel free to move this to geekslutz if you feel it's more appropriate)

There was a thread about this pretty recently. I've found Nuendo to sound the best. We did a test at a local studio using PT and Nuendo for playback only. There were eight tracks, each sent to separate faders on an analog desk, using the same D/A for both DAWs' playback. The difference was night and day. For the record, I'm a PTHD-only user; no axe to grind here!

Some people told me I was either crazy or stupid or deaf. I respectfully disagree.

Anyway, one REALLY obvious place in which DAWs all sound different is in their summing. Nobody's gonna really argue about that much.

Another, slightly unusual, potential difference is something a mastering engineer showed me earlier today while working on one of my records. INPUT mode in PT (y'know, when the green "I" light is on) sounds like ass compared to just listening back while the track records. Weird, huh? When A/Bing a couple version, he had me in QuickPunch mode punching in and out instead of taking the track in and out of Input mode. Whoda thunk?

I'd guess there are other factors like this in every DAW that some do better (sonically) than others, like aux sends, internal bussing, etc.

[andychamp]

Thanks to all that answered so far, I understand your points.
I will now try to take this thread back to where I originally intended.
Sorry if I wasn't very clear to begin with.

Originally Posted by andychamp

(...)
My question mainly relates to wether this is technically at all possible.

[Mr.HOLMES]

Anyway, one REALLY obvious place in which DAWs all sound different is in their summing.

And the myth is going on!!!!!!!

[BradD]

I have no way to explain this technically, but when I recently switched from Protools LE Version 5.2 to Samplitude 10.02, I noticed a fairly sizeable improvement in sound. Much more noticeable than when I ungraded from Digi to Apogee converters. I can't explain it, but I like it.

[brewery]

I know a lot of people will disagree with me on this, and I'm not saying it to start another big Pro Tools/Logic pissing match - but I think there is quiet a difference in the sound of DAWs, and Tools has a certain exaggerated bite to the top end that's just not pleasant to my ears. This is regardless of wether it's an in-the-box mix done in LE or HD with 192s running through an analog board.
The thing is a lot of people really seem to like that sound, so who am I to judge.
Logic always sounded better to my ears (with good converters that is), but not as good as Radar, and certainly not as good as a good analog recording.
I also really do think that Logic 8 sounds way better than the previous versions, and -although I agree that there are still a lot of bugs to be fixed- I like what I'm hearing when it doesn't crash on me.

[gainstages]

Originally Posted by andychamp

what makes a DAW sound better than another?

the user!

[bcgood]

Originally Posted by El Kuto

I know a lot of people will disagree with me on this, and I'm not saying it to start another big Pro Tools/Logic pissing match - but I think there is quiet a difference in the sound of DAWs, and Tools has a certain exaggerated bite to the top end that's just not pleasant to my ears. This is regardless of wether it's an in-the-box mix done in LE or HD with 192s running through an analog board.
The thing is a lot of people really seem to like that sound, so who am I to judge.
Logic always sounded better to my ears (with good converters that is), but not as good as Radar, and certainly not as good as a good analog recording.
I also really do think that Logic 8 sounds way better than the previous versions, and -although I agree that there are still a lot of bugs to be fixed- I like what I'm hearing when it doesn't crash on me.

Most stuff I hear done in pro tools does have THAT sound and it isn't good. Nothing beaths multi-track tape that's for sure. Radar for digital is the best that I've heard so far but again, not even close to the fidelity of tape.

[staudio]

Originally Posted by pootkao

Your A-D converters will dictate the sound much more than the processing of your DAW.

So true.

I think DAWS can sound different when you start doing non real time stuff like pitch adjustment/time stretching due to the different algorithms used by the different software.

[ALL*MYTEE]

This thread is asking for trouble, but I'll throw in my unscientific .02.

I started off with Live 5 and noticed a significant difference when I changed over to Logic. Some of that may be Logic's superior plug-ins but if pressed, I'd probably say that Live was missing something in the low mids when summing a bunch of tracks. I also noticed something similar missing on a friend's tracks mixed in Live.

I don't imagine there's a huge difference between the big four or five programs--Logic, Pro Tools, Nuendo and the like, but I haven't heard all of them. I'd suggest the one you enjoy working in and like the features of (and think is a stable, long-term solution).

By the way, I've listened to panels of mixing and mastering professionals (top industry names/Grammy guys) discuss the differences in different brands of CDs and hard drives. If they say they can hear the difference, who am I to say otherwise.

I know this won't fly with the 01 guys, but that's what I've got to report.

[SyncSailor]

i like the sound of Logic best... even if i am imagining it