Inside versus Outside the Box, when is OTB Really OTB?

[psycho_monkey]

Originally Posted by Beyersound

I hear people preaching all the time about summing OTB through an analog console. Is it really that important? To play devil's advocate in asking this question, people also sum OTB into digital consoles. I have spent thousands of hours mixing on large and small format digitals, and they sum beautifully. But isn't this type of digital summing pretty much the same as summing ITB? An example of this is Steely Dan's "Everything Must Go". It was recorded into Nuendo and mixed on a Yamaha DM2000 digital. This is a reference quality record if there ever was one. Was this truly OTB? Your thoughts on this and the summing thing in general...........

OTB generally means mixed in the analogue domain.

Summing on a digital console is still ITB. It's using digital summing. Just a different box.

The only place it gets confusing is when people take a hybrid approach - using a summing box, or hardware inserts within a DAW.

As to whether it matters - that's a personal choice.

[Beyersound]

Originally Posted by psycho_monkey

OTB generally means mixed in the analogue domain.

Summing on a digital console is still ITB. It's using digital summing. Just a different box.

The only place it gets confusing is when people take a hybrid approach - using a summing box, or hardware inserts within a DAW.

As to whether it matters - that's a personal choice.

I take the hybrid approach with a 2 buss comp. Love the results.

[mkharvey11]

I did a test on this to comparing the following:

1. Using my Yamaha 01V96VCM to sum 5 stereo stems (10 channels) from Pro Tools 9 recorded back into Pro Tools (lightpipe routing) Channels panned hard L/R and faders at unity.

2. Summing in Pro Tools, but recording the output digitally routed through 2 channels of the 01V96, back into Pro Tools (lightpipe)

3. Bounce To Disk

Although the difference was almost negligible, I found that the fullest, warmest, detailed sound was the Pro Tools playback routed out and recorded back in. The 01V summed mix seemed a bit warmer, but less detailed. The bounce mix was most obviously different as it seemed to lack depth in the stereo image the other 2 had.

Small differences in digital summing, may have to do with the bit-rate and architecture of the processing: The Yamaha mix bus is 32 bit fixed point, whereas Pro Tools 9 is 32 bit floating point.

The source was an acoustic jazz trio of excellent New Orleans musicians
1935 Mason & Hamlin Model A Grand Piano
(2) Octava MK-12 & 1 TLM103
Mapex Drum Kit - Zildjian & Istanbul Cymbals
(2) Octava MK-12, AKG D-112, (5) SM57
Acoustic Bass
(2) CAD E-100
All 13 signals through Focusrite ISA preamps & ISA A/D cards lightpipe into 01V96, then MOTU 2408.

Stems were:
1-2 Drum bus (8 tracks)
3-4 Bass bus (2 tracks)
5-6 Piano bus (3 tracks)
7-8 Reverb 1 bus
9-10 Reverb 2 bus