do you need the same type of sub with your monitors

bigbaby987 · 31st July 2004

i have a pair of genelec 1030a's and i was wondering if i ever decided to get a sub, should it be a genelec sub? i really like dynaudio's subs right now because they have a footswitch to turn them off and on. what do ya think?

MASSIVE Master · 31st July 2004

I'm a "whatever works" type. Go for it.

bigbaby987 · 31st July 2004

thanks dude!!! i'm pretty much the same way. i just wanted to see what others thought.

C.Lambrechts · 31st July 2004

no rules ... although usually the same brand is 'optimised'.

bigbaby987 · 31st July 2004

thanks chris!! you da man!

mattoxxx · 31st July 2004

I've used a cambridge sound works sub with genelec 1031's and it sounds fine. No reason you have to buy a genelec sub for genelec moniters. Any sub should work fine.

-Matt

barefoot · 1st August 2004

Well, the consensus so far seems to be "any old sub will do". I guess that's true. Any old sub will make sound. It will probably generate a lot of distortion, and the crossover region will be totally inaccurate, but it will make sound.

Why is it that people would never consider just grabbing any old woofer and tweeter, throwing them into a box, and calling them a studio monitor, but they're perfectly comfortable doing the same with satellites and subs? No, you can't just mix and match speakers and expect them to work well together. Unless you have about 3 octaves of flat response overlap between the sub and monitor, you really need a crossover that is specifically designed for the system. Unfortunately, this is rarely ever done with off the shelf subs - even those from the same brand as the monitor. Furthermore, generating low distortion sub frequencies is a rather difficult task. It doesn't come cheap.

And we haven't even talked about the shitty electronic circuits that go into many subs. How would you feel knowing that your $1000 DAC is driving a $20 crossover circuit? IMO, for high performance monitoring, you need a pair of high quality subs and an outboard crossover custom tailored to match them up with the monitors. Otherwise, you're just toying around.

Thomas

De chromium cob · 1st August 2004

I think its more like most high quality subs will work but ANY sub wont work. I had a Tannoy sub that was a total peice of shit and didnt have the response the specs said it had. Sold it- Then I went totally over board and got a Velodyne HGS-18II servo driven sub for close to 3 grand and I've been in low end heaven ever since. It barly bats an eye at normal listening levels- works well with my ProAcs, and is flat down to 15Hz! Another thing I like is that it has a remote- so I can listen to the ProAcs by themselves or with the sub filling the bottom octave. Moral of the story- cheap subs suck.

LumenStudio · 3rd August 2004

Check out REL subwoofers at your local audiophile store. I added one of these to my Quested F11 nearfields and my mixes translate perfect to my ears (still working on individual sounds though) . I should also note I mix in a very small room and this sub has caused me no issues.

Jay Frigeletto who was also a Quested user suggested the REL sub to me back on RAP:

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...net%26rnum%3D5

Also note the REL is optimized to hook up straight to your power amp (even though the REL is powered!). Look at the models and what their inputs are. In my case I bought the REL Strata III, the cheapest high end REL, which had stereo inputs from a power amp, one balanced input, and two unbalanced inputs (one that was +12db with a free atenuator to bring it down to 0) Since my Questeds have a line through, I took the line through from the left and right Questeds and then went unbalanced into the REL sub. The REL sums these signals actively thus not causing mono to be fed back into my mains. The sub also has phase adjustments and an adjustable crossover to integrate very easily into your system.

It works for me and was the best imrovement I added to my studio last year with about $11,000 in upgrades. Hence why I wrote this verbose responce, because I highly recomeend a REL.

Regards
-Jon

bigbaby987 · 3rd August 2004

thanks everyone for your advice. it has been very valuable.

31st July 2004	#1
bigbaby987 Lives for gear Joined: Dec 2003 Location: Dallas Posts: 534 Thread Starter	do you need the same type of sub with your monitors i have a pair of genelec 1030a's and i was wondering if i ever decided to get a sub, should it be a genelec sub? i really like dynaudio's subs right now because they have a footswitch to turn them off and on. what do ya think?

1st August 2004	#7
barefoot Lives for gear Joined: Jan 2004 Location: Portland Oregon Posts: 1,270	Well, the consensus so far seems to be "any old sub will do". I guess that's true. Any old sub will make sound. It will probably generate a lot of distortion, and the crossover region will be totally inaccurate, but it will make sound. Why is it that people would never consider just grabbing any old woofer and tweeter, throwing them into a box, and calling them a studio monitor, but they're perfectly comfortable doing the same with satellites and subs? No, you can't just mix and match speakers and expect them to work well together. Unless you have about 3 octaves of flat response overlap between the sub and monitor, you really need a crossover that is specifically designed for the system. Unfortunately, this is rarely ever done with off the shelf subs - even those from the same brand as the monitor. Furthermore, generating low distortion sub frequencies is a rather difficult task. It doesn't come cheap. And we haven't even talked about the shitty electronic circuits that go into many subs. How would you feel knowing that your $1000 DAC is driving a $20 crossover circuit? IMO, for high performance monitoring, you need a pair of high quality subs and an outboard crossover custom tailored to match them up with the monitors. Otherwise, you're just toying around. Thomas __________________ Thomas Barefoot Barefoot Sound

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31st July 2004	#2
MASSIVE Master Lives for gear Joined: Mar 2004 Location: Chicago (Schaumburg / Hoffman Est.) IL Posts: 2,710	I'm a "whatever works" type. Go for it.

31st July 2004	#4
C.Lambrechts Lives for gear Joined: May 2002 Location: Ans (Liege) Belgium Posts: 3,286	no rules ... although usually the same brand is 'optimised'.

31st July 2004	#6
mattoxxx Gear maniac Joined: May 2003 Location: boston Posts: 173	I've used a cambridge sound works sub with genelec 1031's and it sounds fine. No reason you have to buy a genelec sub for genelec moniters. Any sub should work fine. -Matt

1st August 2004	#8
De chromium cob Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 3,659	I think its more like most high quality subs will work but ANY sub wont work. I had a Tannoy sub that was a total peice of shit and didnt have the response the specs said it had. Sold it- Then I went totally over board and got a Velodyne HGS-18II servo driven sub for close to 3 grand and I've been in low end heaven ever since. It barly bats an eye at normal listening levels- works well with my ProAcs, and is flat down to 15Hz! Another thing I like is that it has a remote- so I can listen to the ProAcs by themselves or with the sub filling the bottom octave. Moral of the story- cheap subs suck.

3rd August 2004	#9
LumenStudio Gear addict Joined: Jul 2003 Location: Jersey Posts: 402	Check out REL subwoofers at your local audiophile store. I added one of these to my Quested F11 nearfields and my mixes translate perfect to my ears (still working on individual sounds though) . I should also note I mix in a very small room and this sub has caused me no issues. Jay Frigeletto who was also a Quested user suggested the REL sub to me back on RAP: http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...net%26rnum%3D5 Also note the REL is optimized to hook up straight to your power amp (even though the REL is powered!). Look at the models and what their inputs are. In my case I bought the REL Strata III, the cheapest high end REL, which had stereo inputs from a power amp, one balanced input, and two unbalanced inputs (one that was +12db with a free atenuator to bring it down to 0) Since my Questeds have a line through, I took the line through from the left and right Questeds and then went unbalanced into the REL sub. The REL sums these signals actively thus not causing mono to be fed back into my mains. The sub also has phase adjustments and an adjustable crossover to integrate very easily into your system. It works for me and was the best imrovement I added to my studio last year with about $11,000 in upgrades. Hence why I wrote this verbose responce, because I highly recomeend a REL. Regards -Jon