Kick and Bass via Sidechain Compression as well as general Low End Theory

Umlaaat · 21st July 2004, 06:32 AM

Since reading about sidechain compression for kick to bass, i've been experimienting with this and wonder:

Is this the norm for mixing low end?

The basic premise of this is that the kick triggers the compressor to work on the bass, thereby making a clearing for the kick.
I've tried it the other way around and can't really seem to hear any kind of change.

A problem I've got with this method is the pumping that happens to the bass after recovering from a kick trigger.. Is this avoidable at all?

I guess this wouldn't be used in all applications, so another method that i've gathered is have each on its own freq. plane, scoop low out of the kick and have it made up on the bass...

But as far as sidechaining goes... what other ways would it be used for?

jtienhaara · 21st July 2004, 07:00 AM

As far as kick / bass ducking I can't help. I hate the very idea of it.

Sidechains are infinitely useful though.

Mult the signal out to EQ back into the sidechain to squash down nasty low or high frequencies extra hard.

Mult stereo signals to mono, route to a pair of mono comp side chains for stereo compression without left-to-right shifting. Try it on hard-panned overheads, for example.

You can use it to fatten up tone. Someone recently posted a great tip for kick drum: feed a sine wave into a gate. Send the "real" kick drum into the side chain. Mix the output of the gate in with the original "real" kick. The sine wave should be around 150 Hz for a huge kick, 250 for a jazzy kick. Fast attck, fast release. (Apparently longer release works for a hip hoppy sound, but I wouldn't know). I can't remember who posted the idea or what thread it was, but to somone: thanks! Great tip!

I'm sure there are loooots of other uses for sidechain...

Have fun with it!

Cheers,

Johann

DirkB · 21st July 2004, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Umlaaat
Since reading about sidechain compression for kick to bass, i've been experimienting with this and wonder:

Is this the norm for mixing low end?

Definitely not the norm, more of a 'first try fix' when the kick and bass really aren't loving eachother.
But that's my view, YMMV.

Greetings,
Dirk

**Jules** · 21st July 2004, 09:22 AM

"Definitely not the norm, more of a 'first try fix' when the kick and bass really aren't loving eachother. But that's my view,"

I agree

Ifa bass player is so bad that his timeing has a negative effect on a song it sometimes HELPS to lose the attack of the bass with this trick and let the kick dominate.

faeflora · 21st July 2004, 09:40 AM

Depends on the genre and source sounds.

With rock this "trick" will sound stupid.

warhead · 22nd July 2004, 03:57 AM

Done right it's a wonderful effect with kick / bass g.

I've had some fun ducking guitars out of the way when vocals kick in on dense mixes. Nothing crazy...too obvious and it starts sounding like somebody's being paged.

War

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
About the Low End Theory moderators	Jules	Low End Theory	17	15th September 2008 11:12 PM
Phat low end studio theory - pictures wanted!	Darth Fader	Low End Theory	23	15th July 2006 04:50 AM
Low End Theory vs. Midnight Marauders--Production Differences	sasha222	So much gear, so little time!	0	7th July 2006 12:28 AM
No Low End on Low End Theory Speakers	EngineEars	Low End Theory	0	12th February 2006 04:48 AM
sidechain bass and kick thing....	sadworld	So much gear, so little time!	6	2nd July 2004 06:56 PM

21st July 2004, 06:32 AM	#1
Umlaaat Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 783	Kick and Bass via Sidechain Compression as well as general Low End Theory Since reading about sidechain compression for kick to bass, i've been experimienting with this and wonder: Is this the norm for mixing low end? The basic premise of this is that the kick triggers the compressor to work on the bass, thereby making a clearing for the kick. I've tried it the other way around and can't really seem to hear any kind of change. A problem I've got with this method is the pumping that happens to the bass after recovering from a kick trigger.. Is this avoidable at all? I guess this wouldn't be used in all applications, so another method that i've gathered is have each on its own freq. plane, scoop low out of the kick and have it made up on the bass... But as far as sidechaining goes... what other ways would it be used for?

21st July 2004, 09:22 AM	#4
Jules Gearslutz.com admin Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: London, UK Posts: 11,813	"Definitely not the norm, more of a 'first try fix' when the kick and bass really aren't loving eachother. But that's my view," I agree Ifa bass player is so bad that his timeing has a negative effect on a song it sometimes HELPS to lose the attack of the bass with this trick and let the kick dominate. __________________ Jules "...there are some amazing deals to be had in this right now. it brings battleship mixing closer to the jilted generation" - reptil

22nd July 2004, 03:57 AM	#6
warhead Jai guru deva om Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: South Carolina Posts: 8,328	Done right it's a wonderful effect with kick / bass g. I've had some fun ducking guitars out of the way when vocals kick in on dense mixes. Nothing crazy...too obvious and it starts sounding like somebody's being paged. War __________________ Warren Dent Email: warren (at) frontendaudio (dot) com Front End Audio Sells Gear Tuesday Testers: Hear the Gear Shootouts Product Videos on YouTube: Overviews of Gear

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search
Display Modes	Rate This Thread
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode	Rate This Thread:

21st July 2004, 07:00 AM	#2
jtienhaara Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Victoria, Canada Posts: 545	As far as kick / bass ducking I can't help. I hate the very idea of it. Sidechains are infinitely useful though. Mult the signal out to EQ back into the sidechain to squash down nasty low or high frequencies extra hard. Mult stereo signals to mono, route to a pair of mono comp side chains for stereo compression without left-to-right shifting. Try it on hard-panned overheads, for example. You can use it to fatten up tone. Someone recently posted a great tip for kick drum: feed a sine wave into a gate. Send the "real" kick drum into the side chain. Mix the output of the gate in with the original "real" kick. The sine wave should be around 150 Hz for a huge kick, 250 for a jazzy kick. Fast attck, fast release. (Apparently longer release works for a hip hoppy sound, but I wouldn't know). I can't remember who posted the idea or what thread it was, but to somone: thanks! Great tip! I'm sure there are loooots of other uses for sidechain... Have fun with it! Cheers, Johann

21st July 2004, 09:40 AM	#5
faeflora Lives for gear Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: washington dc Posts: 2,010	Depends on the genre and source sounds. With rock this "trick" will sound stupid.