Making the most of ITB vs OTB mixing/tracking?

[DarkEcho]

I know a lot of you like the OTB physical faders and knobs and how fun it is, and the ITB guys like all the plugins, the cost benefit, the convenience etc..

but what are the scientific pros and cons between these mediums? I've been learning how both of these mediums react completely differently to certain things and want to know what everyone does to make the best of analogue and digital systems.

what are the objective pros and cons of analogue and digital? Not talking about what sounds better/warmer/etc.. the mechanical differences in how these systems treat audio and how, as an engineer, to make the most of either system.

[larry b]

The bottom line with all of this stuff is that if you spend enough money, and have talent, you can get great sound.

On the digital side, yes stock digi converters are crap, but an HD setup with Apogee or other outboard A/D's is going to sound pretty great mixing ITB, if you know what you are doing.

On the analog side, cheap gear is noisy and/or sounds like poo but i've never heard anyone complain about a Studer deck and a nice Neve

Again the bottom line is if you are interested in maximising what you can do with both, a hybrid analog/digital system may be what you need. Some people can deal with mousing around to make a mix. Most that you will find on here, myslef included, prefer to raise a fader and turn a knob, almost regardless of if its a real analog channel or a pro tools/DAW controller...

And then theres summing boxes and that whole deal of recording to digital medium and mixing/summing the signals through a very high quality mixer.

[DarkEcho]

I am looking more for info along the lines of thing like transients.. analogue saturation curve can help control transients by softening that part, almost like truncating the peak while leaving the rest of the sound unaffected, yet digital doesnt do this, or how in analogue systems, bass was more of an issue than in digital.

What other things are different between ITB and OTB and what steps can we take to correct the problems?

[James Meeker]

Ultimately it comes down to using the tools you have at your disposal to their fullest potential. LISTENING rather than going through the motions. Knowing what the sound of a "hit record" is and how to get something there.

It can be frustrating if your tools are limited. Very easy to get into the "if I only had X piece of gear and I'd get a good sound" mentality. Chances are you don't need most of that stuff, even if it is nice to have. The most important tools are one's skill, ears, taste and ability to work hard at getting and keeping the sounds.

Here's a story to illustrate the point: at the studio we have a lot of interns and new engineers come through the doors and many of them get a chance to engineer their own projects in off time to build skill and so on. They are working with a PT HD4 system to a SSL 4056 G+, great outboard, decent mic collection, great rooms....

Even with ALL that gear (I mean, you can't really ask for better stuff) their recordings always, always sounds like a home recording--because that's where their skill level is still at. There are guys around this forum working at home on modest rigs (Digi002, fairly basic plugs, Mackie mixer, some 200-400 dollar mics) doing stuff that ANNIHILATES what these younger guys do in the "big studio" because they have more skill, a better ear and so forth.

Expensive gear is like any other kind of high performance equipment--useful only in the hands of top guys. I mean, I drive a Saturn to work... I wouldn't get their any quicker in a Ferrari... heck, I'm not a very good driver so I would probably kill myself within a week if I even tried to get any more performance out of it than my Saturn.

Use the tools you got, upgrade as your skills increase, and focus more on developing the critical skills like listening and evaluating audio rather than worry about what stuff you have. When you can get your home recorded stuff to sound 90% of the way to a big CD mixed by the greats then it's time to start thinking about upgrading or getting a full time job at a bigger studio.

I just realized I totally didn't answer your question--sorry!

[DarkEcho]

No, you didn't. But your post was excellent regardless. Thanks!

Now how about that other answer....

I am curious about the fundamental differences between both systems and how some practices might work great for one but horrible for the other.. I want to make sure I am not accidentally treating my digital system like an anlogue one... know what I mean?

[Mr.HOLMES]

James....
If English would be my mother language I would have answered in the same direction.

I have friend he is a long time engineer with 24 yrs experience.
He usaly was mixing OTB but when DAWs Sound was getting better and better he switched over.

And if I listen to his mixes I can just say.


Maybe 10% is Equipment.
Never underestimate Experience and Talent....

[Unclenny]

Originally Posted by DarkEcho

how, as an engineer, to make the most of either system.

As with developing any skill I think you need to choose a set of tools, make a commitment to that choice and then let time and perseverance by your allies.