Control surface plus f/w interface vs. Mixer with f/w interface

Nexus · 29th January 2008

Hi Folks,

I currently have a pair of MOTU Ultralites (that I'm using with SONAR, ACID, SoundForge, WAVE Gold, GTR, etc.) and was thinking of adding a control surface such as the Mackie Control Universal Pro plus possibly the C4 for plug-ins). I prefer a more traditional, analog feel to recording so having a mixer feel and control is more intuitive and natural to me.

I'm curious as to what others see as the pros/cons to this approach vs. a mixer with a dedicated f/w interface such as the Yamaha N12. The Yamaha looks very appealing in it's design and simplicity and DAW integration. Unless I'm missing something, the main drawbacks for me would be the fact that I'd have to stay in the box (DAW) to do more than 8 tracks and for tweaking plug-ins.

Does anyone have any other comments, suggestions, considerations?

Thanks in advance,

-mark

obscure object · 29th January 2008

The N12 doesn't have automated faders .... instead, it functions as a digital mixer 'with analoge feel' ... it will sum and process tracks or stems coming back from the DAW, but it will not write automation like a Mackie MCU and u can't recall the settings for different sessions. You can simply use it as a stand alone digital mixer which is cool. The Mackie MCU is supposed to provide control over the Motu Cuemix settings, which is cool as well

.

So basicly u're looking at two different approaches ... both are nice but you have to decide which one fits u best.

T9c · 29th January 2008

Wow! That's a great question, but one I don't know if I could come up with an equaly great answer to. I have the older Mackie controller and love it. But the part I REALLY love is that dang scroll wheel.

Now if I didn't have the controller already, for about the same $ these days, I could get 8 ch of EQ, 8 nice pre's, 8ch AD, monitor switch, etc. Jeez, what's not to like about this thing? oh yeah, scroll wheel...how could they have missed that one?

I could have saved some serious coin with this mixer if it had been out a couple of years ago.

What I would do if I were you is to go over to the Sonar forum and ask if anyone else is using it and what are the limitations if using with Sonar.

That's my 2c, anyway.
Rick

sirthought · 29th January 2008

I'm sorta looking at the same questions. I'm not prepared to purchase anything at the moment, but once I get some funds together I want to pounce on the right piece.

I've been looking at the n12 for a while now.
* The lack of automation bugs me.
* And while I think it's strange they didn't put a jog wheel on there, the unit does allow for you to easily place and find location markers throughout a project, so you can jump around with a little effort.
* The Yammy people will tell me if I want automation I need to buy the O series, but frankly that's a higher cost and has more bells and whistles than I really want to take on.
The main selling point for the n-series, IMHO, is:
* the combination of their hyped pres (claimed to be Yammy's best ever -- haven't found a unit in stores yet) and the other gear that would enhance your home or project studio, but would cost a lot more to purchase separately. If you bought the control room/mix output features, a mixing board, interface, etc. it would all be a lot more expensive.
The n12 has EQ/Reverb/Compression effects, which I think is just bonus and NOT a big selling feature, since I would likely use plug-ins like Waves. You can monitor your plugs as you play on the n12 with no latency. It's a very convenient unit that seems to be getting a rep for sounding good.

You can mix more tracks than the number of faders on the board, but you have to approach them through your DAW. Mix the drum tracks, then assign those to a group fader on the board next to your guitar, bass, etc. It sounds very flexible.

The Mackie MCUP clearly has more DAW control for less ($1,200), but to get the n12's other handy features you'd need something like a Presonus Monitor Station ($300) and you still wouldn't have nice pres or an interface. Maybe your Motu would be good to hold onto if that's enough for your kind of tracking. Your extra $900 for the C4 would be thick icing, indeed. I really haven't followed the threads on these products to gauge satisfaction.

I'm kind of looking more at the new Euphonix MC Mix ($999) because you can not only mix with automation in most DAWs, but you can also control plug-ins with it. It does have transport controls, but I might look to add something like a Contour ShuttlePro V.2 ($99) for convenience. You have the Motu, but I'm looking to an interface with more pres. So I might need to go for something affordable like a Presonus FireStudio 26x26 or their brand new FireStudio Tube, which sounds very cool.

29th January 2008	#1
Nexus Gear interested Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 1 Thread Starter	Control surface plus f/w interface vs. Mixer with f/w interface Hi Folks, I currently have a pair of MOTU Ultralites (that I'm using with SONAR, ACID, SoundForge, WAVE Gold, GTR, etc.) and was thinking of adding a control surface such as the Mackie Control Universal Pro plus possibly the C4 for plug-ins). I prefer a more traditional, analog feel to recording so having a mixer feel and control is more intuitive and natural to me. I'm curious as to what others see as the pros/cons to this approach vs. a mixer with a dedicated f/w interface such as the Yamaha N12. The Yamaha looks very appealing in it's design and simplicity and DAW integration. Unless I'm missing something, the main drawbacks for me would be the fact that I'd have to stay in the box (DAW) to do more than 8 tracks and for tweaking plug-ins. Does anyone have any other comments, suggestions, considerations? Thanks in advance, -mark

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29th January 2008	#2
obscure object Gear maniac Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 233	The N12 doesn't have automated faders .... instead, it functions as a digital mixer 'with analoge feel' ... it will sum and process tracks or stems coming back from the DAW, but it will not write automation like a Mackie MCU and u can't recall the settings for different sessions. You can simply use it as a stand alone digital mixer which is cool. The Mackie MCU is supposed to provide control over the Motu Cuemix settings, which is cool as well . So basicly u're looking at two different approaches ... both are nice but you have to decide which one fits u best.

29th January 2008	#3
T9c Gear maniac Joined: Oct 2005 Location: Houston Posts: 285	Wow! That's a great question, but one I don't know if I could come up with an equaly great answer to. I have the older Mackie controller and love it. But the part I REALLY love is that dang scroll wheel. Now if I didn't have the controller already, for about the same $ these days, I could get 8 ch of EQ, 8 nice pre's, 8ch AD, monitor switch, etc. Jeez, what's not to like about this thing? oh yeah, scroll wheel...how could they have missed that one? I could have saved some serious coin with this mixer if it had been out a couple of years ago. What I would do if I were you is to go over to the Sonar forum and ask if anyone else is using it and what are the limitations if using with Sonar. That's my 2c, anyway. Rick

29th January 2008	#4
sirthought Gear maniac Joined: Dec 2007 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 254	I'm sorta looking at the same questions. I'm not prepared to purchase anything at the moment, but once I get some funds together I want to pounce on the right piece. I've been looking at the n12 for a while now. * The lack of automation bugs me. * And while I think it's strange they didn't put a jog wheel on there, the unit does allow for you to easily place and find location markers throughout a project, so you can jump around with a little effort. * The Yammy people will tell me if I want automation I need to buy the O series, but frankly that's a higher cost and has more bells and whistles than I really want to take on. The main selling point for the n-series, IMHO, is: * the combination of their hyped pres (claimed to be Yammy's best ever -- haven't found a unit in stores yet) and the other gear that would enhance your home or project studio, but would cost a lot more to purchase separately. If you bought the control room/mix output features, a mixing board, interface, etc. it would all be a lot more expensive. The n12 has EQ/Reverb/Compression effects, which I think is just bonus and NOT a big selling feature, since I would likely use plug-ins like Waves. You can monitor your plugs as you play on the n12 with no latency. It's a very convenient unit that seems to be getting a rep for sounding good. You can mix more tracks than the number of faders on the board, but you have to approach them through your DAW. Mix the drum tracks, then assign those to a group fader on the board next to your guitar, bass, etc. It sounds very flexible. The Mackie MCUP clearly has more DAW control for less ($1,200), but to get the n12's other handy features you'd need something like a Presonus Monitor Station ($300) and you still wouldn't have nice pres or an interface. Maybe your Motu would be good to hold onto if that's enough for your kind of tracking. Your extra $900 for the C4 would be thick icing, indeed. I really haven't followed the threads on these products to gauge satisfaction. I'm kind of looking more at the new Euphonix MC Mix ($999) because you can not only mix with automation in most DAWs, but you can also control plug-ins with it. It does have transport controls, but I might look to add something like a Contour ShuttlePro V.2 ($99) for convenience. You have the Motu, but I'm looking to an interface with more pres. So I might need to go for something affordable like a Presonus FireStudio 26x26 or their brand new FireStudio Tube, which sounds very cool.