All Advertisers
| All Advertisers |
| |||||||
Similar Threads | ||||
| Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
| Studio owner needed | djui5 | So much gear, so little time! | 0 | 15th January 2007 07:07 AM |
| from 1 studio owner to the next | Killah_Trakz | Music computers | 1 | 30th March 2006 05:33 AM |
| Studio owner vs Freelance-engineer | Lectra | So much gear, so little time! | 14 | 12th December 2004 06:30 PM |
| A Question For The Studio Owner/Engineers Here. | Mark | So much gear, so little time! | 36 | 5th December 2003 03:30 AM |
 |
| | Thread Tools | Search this Thread | Rate Thread | Display Modes |
22nd December 2007, 09:30 AM
| #1 |
| Gear Head Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 61
| Disastrous Meeting with Studio Owner I'm scouting out a studio to track a couple of songs for a band I'm producing so I went to a studio to meet the owner, check out the room and discuss rates. I have a pretty well equipped home studio but don't want to spend a day in my tracking/control room with a cranked Dual Rectifier and a drum set, plus all the other reasons one leaves a home studio to pay for time in a commercial facility. The conversation between us started going south very quickly. At every opportunity he turned it into a pissing contest, a big dog/little dog thing. OK, I get it, he has better than a million in the place, but **** that, there was absolutely no reason for the condescending, argumentatitve shit he was spewing. No joke, he said "You just can't mix in the box. It always sounds like shit. You need us to mix for you." Plus, his product knowledge had gaping holes in it. I have a day job that has up and down busy cycles, and during downtime, I scour the internet for articles, reviews, and opinions. I've bought and sold a boatload of gear, too. I think I'm pretty well informed. So what do I do? Act like a pro, smile and leave? Noooo sir. I engage the little MFer in verbal sparring! I actually still can't believe it. That's the worst I've behaved in a long time. My wife went with me and she was mad at me for not leaving immediately and arguing with the guy. Can't say I blame her, but he has a nice place and a decent intro rate. I thought he would eventually stop yanking my chain but he never did. Later we were talking about what a jerk he was and then she apologised for getting mad at me because he clearly had an agenda to try to show how little respect he had for me practically form the minute we walked in. It was precisely this kind of treatment that made me shun commercial studios for years and put my own together. I don't know how he stays in business. |
|  |
|
22nd December 2007, 09:39 AM
| #2 | |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: So Cal
Posts: 3,833
| Quote:
 | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 09:42 AM
| #3 |
| Gear maniac Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 152
| I don't even entertain shit like that. In audio, there are constant variables and infinite possibles. A guy like that will probably be arguing with you during tracking and mixing as well, insisting that his approach is the best and only approach. the kinda guy that will want producer credits . . . |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 09:45 AM
| #4 |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Orygun
Posts: 6,067
| That decent intro rate suggests that he has problems getting or keeping clients. Doesn't seem very professional - if you want to rent the room to track, that's what you want to rent the room for. If he really wanted to talk you into hiring him for some mixing, then talking to you once you set up the tracking deal might have been a better way to go. The music biz is full of head cases and egoes. The quote Blood Diamond: "T.I.A. (this is audio). -tINY |
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 09:55 AM
| #5 |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Germany
Posts: 1,373
| You want to rent the room and not marry the mofo ! Who cares what hes saying ? And why are you arguing ? When you go nuts, he reached his goal  All those games people play are kinda wired, but they exist, no doubt, dont let em waste your nervs ! " i want that room for x days, how much ? deal, no deal ? " over & out, good luck |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 09:56 AM
| #6 |
| Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: West Haven, CT
Posts: 1,161
| Do yourself a favor.....make nothing of it and waste no time questioning it. Not your fault...not your problem. Every second spent on it is negativity. |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 11:00 AM
| #7 | |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: m a n h a t t a n
Posts: 5,576
| Quote:
just want to respectfully point out that it sounds like you treated him identically to how he treated you, so by the transitive property of equality if he's a jerk... and if you come back with some variation of "but he started it" so help me i'll turn this car right around! gregoire del ubk .
__________________ . . m i x _ a r c h i t e c t . . __________________ | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 12:05 PM
| #8 |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 624
| Just keeping the riffraff out. hey i'm on his side! who needs clients? they might be musicians and how annoying are they? they might start playing MUSIC!!! or track some dirt in off the street. they might start drinking the tea and ask for milk, if you can believe that! in a beautifully soundproofed room such as his it does seem a shame to welcome noisy guitar players in. maybe he LIKES doing voice-overs?  audio dogmatism is almost as bad as religious dogmatism! 
__________________ Originally Posted by adisc : I work more editing then listening , that's why I'm so impatient But I'm very faster . ------------------------------------- www.easternblocstudios.com |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 01:05 PM
| #9 | |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,571
| Quote:
__________________ "The main thing is to have a gutsy approach....but use your head." Julia Child "get really immersed." bogeyeater Orient.....Organize.....Decide......Act Lenny and The Scapers | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 01:19 PM
| #10 | |
| Gear Guru  Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Uterèg statsie woar!
Posts: 11,053
| Quote:
plus, sometimes it IS good to just throw out your frustrations --> at the person that caused it. (not at someone else, like persons close to you) It's maybe not professional, but we're all human.
__________________  | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 02:01 PM
| #11 | |
| Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,251
| Quote:
__________________ It looks just like a Telefunken U47 - with leather. You'll love it ... Jazz is not dead - it just smells funny. | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 03:21 PM
| #12 | |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: May 2006 Location: phallicdelphia
Posts: 2,586
| Quote:
__________________ I believe that we have to content ourselves with our imperfect knowledge and understanding and treat values and moral obligations as a purely human problem - the most important of all human problems"....alberta weintsein "The notes I handle no better than many pianists. But the pauses between the notes, ah, that is where the art resides." Artur Schnabel http://www.myspace.com/miketarsia http://miketarsia.com | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 04:04 PM
| #13 |
| Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Yorba Linda Ca.
Posts: 95
| Once I did a session of 5 of my originals only to find out the engineer had tracked the drums in mono. I called the owner of the studio he tried to play it down and insisted I pay anyway. On the other hand, I was given some free studio time by another studio for a favor I did for them, and we tracked drum tracks for 6 of my originals in 5 hours and the drums sounded amazing. Stuff happens both good & bad & ya gotta just roll wid it. |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 04:06 PM
| #14 |
| Gear addict  Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: London
Posts: 352
| The guy sounds insecure and desperate to me. I would HATE to have to run a pro studio now days but if I did I would encourage intergrating the modern "home" model rather than attacking it. Try and find someone/where with a better outlook, I wouldn't pay anyone with that attitude.
__________________ http://www.myspace.com/morcheeba "My advice for any one working in this business - lower your standards" - Randy Newman |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 04:10 PM
| #15 |
| Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,898
| You deal with this constantly in studios. I guess it is because of bunker mentality where guys build their own "forts" and then get all selective about who they let in the "clubhouse" to play. I have dealt with this over and over for years (Hey! Even here on GS!) In thge end, if you like the room and want it's sound or what it brings to your production then surrender to his ways. Use the room, pay his rate and then do what you want. It IS hard not to get sucked into audio pissing contests though. From his perspective, he is probeblt tired of competing with the millions of guys who have set up their own rigs. It cut deeply into studio revenues and makes it DAMN hard to keep a full tilt room afloat. You have to applaude him for being crazy enough to do it!
__________________ Danny Brown |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 04:12 PM
| #16 |
| Gear maniac  Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Toronto, ON
Posts: 152
| You know, I had a very similar situation about two months ago with a studio owner. It may not have been quite as bad as your situation but it was still frustrating. I just smiled and nodded while I was there and of course will probably never send him my business again. There are plenty of other places in town. The funny thing is the studio is obviously not very busy because the next day, when I told him I was going somewhere else, he offered me an insane deal for his room (an SSL room). Maybe if he treated people better, he wouldn't have to do that! |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 04:38 PM
| #17 |
| Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,898
| After all of the years that I have been in the biz why do you think my studio is in my F' ing GARAGE? It is insane trying to keep a commercial room afloat! God! I have seen SOOOO many come and go over the years. I know where seeral roms are sitting dark and the landlord would LOVE me to move in. NO WAY! Money pit. Then again... I recall a studio owner talking to me like I was too stupid to operate or use his room when I was 19 (1976?) I remember him saying how the console had circuits that could be blown up...???? Really Well, I bailed him out fourteen years later. That console (MCI 528B) sat in my shop for a year. I stored the guy's personal stuff in my garage for about six months. I had that room and left it and now another guy is hinting to see if I'd take it off his hands. It's the fourteen year curse? It is a great room though.
__________________ Danny Brown |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 05:51 PM
| #18 |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: May 2005 Location: Basel, Switzerland
Posts: 1,232
  | That guy probably has more equipment than his experience deserves, otherwise he wouldn't have been so protective about the future treatment of stuff tracked at "his place". I remember doing stuff where I had a blast tracking, because of the musicians and producers involved. It was a permanent discovery. Then came mix time and it was a nightmare, because of the musicians and producers involved. No direction, unable to stick to tracking decisions or to commit, anal about one detail, sloppy about another, permanently second-guessing every step. What I'm saying is: just tracking can be gratifying, too. I Love mixing like the next guy, but if I know I'll only do the tracking I'm not frustrated. It's their baby after all. @ OP: you also learned something about yourself that day. It's not what you bargained for when you went there, but don't let someone else's insecurity (and its effect on you) make you blind for your own progress.
__________________ André ________________________________________ "keep it simple. get it right in tracking. record good drummers in good rooms. cake." mixman499 "no room, no boom!" Michael Wagener "every song is different." Dave Pensado "God dammit man! Just try! The best way to micing is the way that u will like!!!"mat1306 |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 05:53 PM
| #19 | |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 5,789
| Quote:
The people who have it are not the people who had the brains and good sense to earn it in the first place. And that frequently means that -- when left to their own devices -- they put their money to unproductive, wasteful use... (Just a guess at this studio owner's initial funding, mind you.) | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 05:55 PM
| #20 | |
| Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 5,789
| Quote:
Evolve or go extinct... | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 06:27 PM
| #21 |
| Gear Head Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 61
| A big thank you for all the responses. Gregoire, but he... uh, never mind. Just keep driving! LOL. Today I called a guy across town that I've worked with before. Tons of big name credits, lots of years in big name studios. He's farther away, but I had alot of fun tracking at his place. Paul_G, part of the fun was his enthusiasm about my wanting to record basic tracks in his studio, then overdub and mix ITB at mine. "Yeah man, come on over! We'll get some great tracks for you and then you can have a blast woking with them at your place!" He matched the other guy's intro rate, too. I really enjoyed working with him. Even though he clearly is senior to me in this profession, he never made me feel that I had to prove something to him. ANd he certainly didn't have anything to prove to me. He burned a CD of a project he produced and mixed, and asked me to check the mix for him. It was pretty gratifying to be asked, even if my opinion wasn't actionable for whatever reason. BTW, he agreed with my assessment.  |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 06:30 PM
| #22 | |
| Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: New York
Posts: 3,905
| Quote:
__________________ . “What you ask about is music. What you like is sound. Now music and sound are akin, but they are not the same.” — Confucius  | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 06:37 PM
| #23 |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Singing Beach, MA
Posts: 4,004
| what's his phone number? I'll call him and show what condescending really is all about. You can mix in the box with great results. Maybe OTB is bigger but who cares. |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 06:51 PM
| #24 |
| Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,898
| Yeah... I can see his point if you went in his place where he had put a lot of money, effort and time and then proceeded to tell him how you could do everything, but you only kind of needed him. If it is a good room AND he has a good staff it might actually be better.... who knows? It's hard to tell. And you really want the enjoyment of doing it yourself, so... On the otherhand he should be well aware of the track and mix at home scenario. It isn't anything new. The home studio and PT age didn't create thgis situation. I have seen MANY two month or longer major label, album projects where they used the $$$$ room for drums and then moved to a way less expensive room to do all of the ODs. Then back to real room to mix.
__________________ Danny Brown |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 06:56 PM
| #25 |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: USA
Posts: 957
| This reminds me of a guy at one of the local music "superstores" in the area. Nice guy, but every time I see him, we get into this huge discussion, and not in a friendly way. I think he is full of it, and he probably thinks the same thing about me... He brings out the absolute *worst* in me, even though I swear the next time I see him, I am just going to "smile and nod". I try to avoid getting into conversations with him, but it seems to happen every time. He has an opinion on *everything*, and it is usually 180 off from mine. My advise, avoid him in the future, you are never going to get along with this guy, just as I am never going to get along with this sales guy.
__________________ DH "Nobody goes there anymore; it's too crowded." -Yogi Berra |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 07:01 PM
| #26 | |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Basel, Switzerland
Posts: 3,618
| Quote:
__________________ Andi www.doorknocker.ch 'You'd be surprised how much it costs to look this cheap! - Dolly Parton | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 07:56 PM
| #27 | |
| Gear Head Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 61
| Quote:
If anything, I left a few of his comments unchallenged. One is classic, have to share it so you can get a better feel for the conversation. Clients are in the control room, we're in the tracking room, and he's just gotten done telling me that mixing ITB is shit. Him: So why don't you want to mix here and use my outboard, is the band on a tight budget? Me: Yeah, aren't they all? (rimshot, please) Him: No (snidely), not the bands I get here. Take a guess what was going on in the control room?? The mix engineer had a PT session up, mixing ITB for a band on a tight budget! The studio owner told me so only a few minutes later!! It was a bit surreal... Between the condescension and the glaring inconsistencies, jumping into it with him was more than I could resist. He might just as well have said "Yeah, the L.A. scene just got me down but I used to love watching the sun come up over the Pacific when I was doing my morning yoga." | |
|
| |
|
22nd December 2007, 08:26 PM
| #28 |
| Lives for gear  Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,732
| Yeah, but you get th |
