Gearslutz.com
All Advertisers

Go Back   Gearslutz.com > The Forums > So much gear, so little time!

So much gear, so little time! General recording equipment discussion + session & music biz politics. Moderated by Jules, London, UK & James 'LA' Lugo - the Vocal Asylum, Los Angeles, USA

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 30th May 2004, 11:30 PM   #1
dreamaudio
Gear nut
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 121
Need Snare Sound Help

hi everyone!

so im having a bit of a problem getting the snare sound i need...for a rock project.

I'm using 2 57's...one top/bottom, with phase flipped on one, running the top through a meke purepath made by mr. neve himself.

I can get the EQ'ing close to what I want....but it's lacking a bit of attack, and body...it's very weak compared to the toms(micd with 421's), and the bassdrum(d6 audix, 414 on outside)...I was thinking of using a large diaphram on the top...like a nt2000 for shitz and giggles to see if it would make a difference...but i dunno...any input would be great.. :)

thanks all!
brian.
dreamaudio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th May 2004, 11:50 PM   #2
Scinx
Lives for gear
 
Scinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Northeast USA
Posts: 505
Send a message via AIM to Scinx
What kind of drum are you using, how new are the heads, what kind of heads are on it?

Additionally - how are you placing the mics?
__________________
.
W H A T • I S • S C I N X ?
http://www.myspace.com/scinx
Scinx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 02:15 AM   #3
dreamaudio
Gear nut
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 121
Actually...just figured out the sound by using a Rode NT2, mixed with the 57 on top and bottom...has the crack..and the body...not using too much compression going in...i think compression will do the trick on getting the exact sound we need.

Any comments on how you guys get your big snare sounds would be awesome...

especially on tight snares..how do you keep the crack, with the body...??


thanks.
brian.
dreamaudio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 02:18 AM   #4
DanV
Lives for gear
 
DanV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Brooklyn NYC
Posts: 696
Quote:
Originally posted by dreamaudio

especially on tight snares..how do you keep the crack, with the body...??
MULTS. Compress liberally - then mix that with the dry signal 'till you get the best of both worlds. I once heard someone call this "New York Compression".....wonder why...
__________________
easy there tiger, your paper is showing
DanV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 03:54 AM   #5
djui5
Lives for gear
 
djui5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 6,671
Send a message via Yahoo to djui5
Quote:
Originally posted by dreamaudio
Any comments on how you guys get your big snare sounds would be awesome...

especially on tight snares..how do you keep the crack, with the body...??


thanks.
brian.
First is the drummer, then the snare being used, then the mic choice and position, then the pre-comp/eq (if used) input channel, then multing and eq'ing/compressing in the mix if necessary.

But the biggest thing beside the drummer and the snare is the room......very important to have the right room and placement in that room...

So many variables are what seperates engineers/producers/songs/artists/albums......
__________________
_________________

"What is a crossfire hurricane & why wasn't I born in one?"

Randy Wright
http://www.myspace.com/djui5
djui5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 06:41 AM   #6
ixnys
Gear addict
 
ixnys's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 324
Most of it has to do with the player, snare drum, and tuning. Tune the snare so it's fat...put gels on if you want less crack/ping and strike that mofo hard in the middle.
ixnys is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 06:54 AM   #7
DirkB
Lives for gear
 
DirkB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 1,448
Well,

Of course the drum and the player are a big part, but with the snare drum in particular, mixing is a big, big part IMHO. With the snare, I normally have at least one mult, I use compression to get snap, shape transients, use reverb to add tail, use quite some EQ if necessary.

It's really about shaping the sound and see how it blends with the overhead / room mics.

During tracking, if the drummer really hits a decent rimshot, the most important thing is how we tension the snaredrum. I tend to like a very high tension. It's easier to get some meat and body back in the sound that make it crisp if the sound was deeper to start with. New coated ambassador every 10-15 takes or so (depending on drummer) and one single SM57 into a chandler TG2 is all I normally need.

Of course, YMMV.

Greetings,
Dirk
__________________
-progress takes away what forever took to find- Dave Matthews
DirkB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 07:00 AM   #8
hammer
Gear maniac
 
hammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Gold Coast, Australia
Posts: 164
Use the force, I mean room...........


__________________
"Love one another and you will be happy. It's as simple and as difficult as that."
-- Michael Leuning
hammer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 07:24 AM   #9
syra
Lives for gear
 
syra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: L.A.
Posts: 1,320
I usually spend an hour placing a 57 on the top...less than an inch can make it or break it...many people underestimate how important placement is...down to less than an inch! And of course, every time you use a different snare its a whole different animal...
syra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 08:02 AM   #10
natpub
More cowbell!
 
natpub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 1,709
Try Fletcher's deal of pointing a single 57 (or whatever) at the side of the body, rather than doing the top n bottom thing.
__________________
Vibrational Arts, Inc.
Blue Sky Way
Sonic Sorcery Studios
Austin, Texas/Columbus, Ohio
natpub is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 10:59 AM   #11
dreamaudio
Gear nut
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 121
Hey guys thanks so much for the info, i appreciate it, and so do my partners :o)

So the large diaphram(RODE NT2) worked to get that fat body, and fullness, ran through the amek pure path(designed by neve)..tuned that snare down pretty low...and it's rockin. Also used a picolo...and after tuning that down a bit..it had great attack, and great body(weird), without reverb. It's 4am and the session is still going! We are way excited at the sounds we are getting.

Yall should try out that d6 audix, it rocks my world(ran through the avalon 737sp)...mmm and those grace channel strips..so sexy. ;o

oh and pro tools hd3 accel...that's sexy too ;)

thank all.
brian.
dreamaudio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 05:18 PM   #12
Musiclab
Lives for gear
 
Musiclab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Elmont NY
Posts: 2,900
Quote:
Originally posted by natpub
Try Fletcher's deal of pointing a single 57 (or whatever) at the side of the body, rather than doing the top n bottom thing.
The thing you have to be careful of is not getting enough of the smack of the stick. What works for me is to put the mic on the side as if I were micing the shell, but raise to mic so its above the rim. Move it down lower if you get too
much of the top head and not enough snare. I prefer to get the snare with one mike and this usually gets it for me. If I do use a mic underneath its because I'm using alot of room and I want to have the option of getting the snares in the sound, otherwise this is my snare technique.
__________________
Lou Gimenez
www.musiclabnyc.com
Musiclab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 06:33 PM   #13
LTA
Gear addict
 
LTA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 476
Re: Need Snare Sound Help

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamaudio
hi everyone!
I can get the EQ'ing close to what I want....but it's lacking a bit of attack, and body...it's very weak compared to the toms(micd with 421's), and the bassdrum(d6 audix, 414 on outside)...I
Learn to tune your drum. Or tune it if you know how.

If it doesn't have crack, body, and depth as picked up by the overheads, it doesn't have crack, body, or depth that will be picked up by anything other than a trigger and a sampler.




ProTool users fix it in the mix
LTA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 07:09 PM   #14
DirkB
Lives for gear
 
DirkB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 1,448
Re: Re: Need Snare Sound Help

Quote:
Originally posted by LTA
If it doesn't have crack, body, and depth as picked up by the overheads, it doesn't have crack, body, or depth that will be picked up by anything other than a trigger and a sampler.
Not necessarily. A well tuned snaredrum can sound nice and crisp through the overheads, but lack a little snap and punch. A well placed sm57, nicely compressed and perhaps a little eq can go a long way to complementing those overheads.
The overheads always will catch some or a lot of ambience, adding diffuse sound to the direct sound, which can be the reason for lack of snap / puch, but is great for nice depth .

Greetings,
Dirk
__________________
-progress takes away what forever took to find- Dave Matthews
DirkB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st May 2004, 09:59 PM   #15
Guest
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
If you are going to use a 57, try moving it away from the drum if possible.
I tend to find 57 lacking in the top end and prefer sm. condensers. A 451 to be exact works great for me.
It is easy to take away the crack,snap but, near impossible to create it if it isn't there.

Though it has been stated. the drummer is the biggest part of the equasion. I was getting drum sounds with some friends one time and the guy engineering was a great drummer I know. We were all thinking how bad the kit sounded and that the heads sounded dead, and you name it.....Well, he said "Watch this!" walked into the studio and proceeded to make that kit sound like "SoundGardens Super Unknown" instantly! Bam! Some of the best tones I have ever heard. I was floored.

You can never make up for this with gear.
Well, SoundReplacer comes close. he.he.

D
  Reply With Quote
Old 1st June 2004, 02:52 AM   #16
LTA
Gear addict
 
LTA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 476
Re: Re: Re: Need Snare Sound Help

Quote:
Originally posted by DirkB
A well placed sm57, nicely compressed and perhaps a little eq can go a long way to complementing those overheads.
Can't argue with that ;) Im still a STRONG supporter of GIGO though. Especially with drum sounds. If you can't get a good snare sound with an sm57 and a small bit of dynamics processing.... (Not that there aren't possibly more appropriate snare mics for the situation of course).
__________________
Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem
LTA is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sluttiest Snare Sound You've Gotten? studioman22 High end 76 31st December 2006 03:31 PM
what brand and what size of a snare can sound like Bon Jovi snare sound??? saikit_2003 Drums! 23 4th December 2006 05:42 PM
80's Snare Sound Almost Human So much gear, so little time! 43 13th January 2006 06:32 AM
How do i get a good snare sound Peyton So much gear, so little time! 46 24th May 2005 01:20 AM
snare sound dexter Q&A with Charles Dye 3 18th April 2004 12:32 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:43 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.0.0