Studio Start Up Advise(!)

[Messiah]

I am in the process of setting up a studio and was hoping for some advice. What started out as me getting some premises to house my gear has expanded into a full blown commercial venture.
I've been working as a freelance producer/engineer for 8 years now and feel I would like to work at 'home'. Not to mention wanting to further the 'Slutlust'(TM).

I have identified a good building, which is a shell at present, in a really good location and I'm about to make my move and seal it.

Obviously, I have many things to consider and I seem to be doing this 24/7 at present (a feeling I'm sure many know!).

I wanted to get some advise and help on what my priorities and focus should be on in the coming months, and see if other thoughts match what I'm thinking about.

I know this is quite an open ended question, but to get the ball rolling, I'm wondering specifically about things like marketing/promotion of the studio... when to start it... when everything is completed?, etc...

Projections? Can you base these on other (established) studios? Or is that foolish!?

Does anybody have any useful experiences they could share regarding business plans?

The studio is going to be in Liverpool, UK, for those who may be afraid of enlightening a future competitor!

It's at times like this when I'm glad to be here, and naturally, any advise/help is most appreciated.

[dumbleator]

It’s a money pit. The return on investment is simply horrible. A number of established studios in the States have gone under in the last few years. Many of the remaining are giving away studio time at ridiculously low rates just to try to keep busy.

I don't mean to sound negative, and I truly wish you the best, but unless you are independently wealthy or a famous producer with guaranteed built-in clientel, DON'T DO IT!

[lasso]

Hey Messiah...best of luck to you.

Keep expenses at a minimum and don't sell yourself too cheap...you can always lower your rates but nobody's gonna accept if your rates suddenly go up.

Secure yourself so you are not 100% dependent on the studio to provide you with your full income - maybe you still need to do some freelancing but this can keep you from doing wedding events and local song contests

Make deals with clients you have worked with before...for example, here in Denmark almost every music video made here is produced by the same person!!!! He makes deals with all the major labels and gets paid a fixed price every year to produce all of the labels videos!

Don't know if this is of any use to you? Again - best of luck..do it, but think it through.

[nelsons]

Carl

Check your PM

[natpub]

Hola, Messi,

I am in nearly the same situation as you, and have a very similar background. However, among our options, we have "building-from-scratch" as a high liklihood, rather than converting a shell. Main reason is that all the consultants we spoke with indicated that what ended up happening with most "shells" is that you wound up building a building within a building (phew, that is hard to spit out, lol). It is not as cost effective.

Anyway, for us, the top priority is the rooms and that they are sonically as perfect as we can get them. As a reult, weeks, hmm, now months of consulting has taken place.

We researched acoustic deisgners and engineers ranging from folks who basically just come into whatever you have and advise you on tuning it, to consultant architects who do complete design, drawings, tunings, decor, etc.

You still wind up with what is basically a pack of plans and some advice, followed by some tuning sessions. It remains up to you to either allow the consultant to seek contractors, or to do so yourself. Or, you can be primary contractor yourself, and just hire subs--though that would not be a wise idea if you are building from scratch.

For us, it turned out that pre-planned things like floor channels for cable, other wiring and plumbing concerns, wall placements, load bearing considerations, and local code law compliance, were more expensive if we convert a building, than if we just build from scratch. Besides, when building from scratch, we get precisely what we need and want. So, as you can see, that is our most likely choice.

Regardless of choice, you would be extremely well served to seek out competent consultation well before starting or buying anything. From several sad experiences, I learned that I hate nothing more than paying a bunch of money to get something, and then learn later that it wont do what I had hoped. It ends up being a massive waste of time and cash.

There are many very good designers and acoustic consultants all over the world. I would not know of the ones in your area.

Our studio philosophy is to work from the back of the recording chain, forward. So we are starting with the rooms, then monitors, and so forth. Interestingly, we have not even chosen a design, and already we have people asking us if they can rent our rooms :-)

Since we are planning a commercial facility, not just our own studio, things such as decor and modern interior/exterior design concepts must factor into our decisions. You may not have this limitation, depending on what you are planning, and your budget. Be very clear to yourself what your budget is, then, as always expect it to be very, very much in excess of that :-)

Some folks have noted that this is not a very good business investment, and that is very true. We researched the business plan worldwide, very carefully, and it is indeed a glutted industry besieged by home studios. That said, we personally will not need to care if we get business or not, so anything we do get will be fine. But, that is just our own situation. Take caution from what you read from others warinings here--if you have to eat and pay the bills from purely studio income, and have no current solid income stream, you may be in for nasty weather.

Feel free to PM me if you need any other info. For now, I had best stop making such a long post:P


Cheers,

--KT

[Messiah]

jeesh...I may just stop now..

Seriously though, thanks for the responses. I'm re-reading them in a minute to try and take some more in...

I know the climate, I'm not naive, if I was looking to make cash I'd be doing something else, banking or something, I dunno. The point is, for me personally, I 'd rather make a living doing something I love than make a fortune doing something that I don't love.

Has anybody got any success stories though so those of us who are entering the snake pit can see a chink of light?

For the guys with studios up and running;
How many days per month is your studio booked?

[davemc]

Best advice I can give is to network the best you can.
People come for the people not the gear.
It really depends on how good you are in sales. Work up some clientelle, which will intern work up more clientelle, work out some niches in the area and see if you can push that..

Personally I am crap at the used car sales pitch and hence I still have day job which I live off. As I am paying off some of the last purchases and get more money doing IT I currently have only a couple of bands coming up.
I said this in our gerslutz get together this week, gear does not bringeth the bands. A hell of a lot think they can do it themselves now, a lot of estiblished bands are buying a HD rig and doing a lot a home now..

It all comes down to how good you are selling yourself..

[juniorhifikit]

This has already been stated, but I'll add to it.

If you don't already have a clientele and bu$ine$$ to support the need for a studio, it will most likely fail. I wouldn't recommend buying any gear you can't pay for outright, or at least with some (not all) of the profit from your next gig.

Actually, make that your LAST gig, as you may get stiffed on the next on and can't count on the payment until it's safely in the bank.

If you want to produce records, just bring the work to an already established (and probably hurting) studio. You can always get a cut rate from studios, since you're bringing in the client. If you are making electronic music, just buy Logic Audio and a coffee maker and have at it in your bedroom.

[Dave Martin]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Messiah
[B]
Has anybody got any success stories though so those of us who are entering the snake pit can see a chink of light?
QUOTE]

Define 'success'. I've kept the doors open so on one level, that's a success. But you don't hear my work on the radio and I'm not taking vacations to exotic locales...

[edyer]

Hey where were you guys when I went insane and spent all my money on gear ?

Mess,
Heres the thing. You said you were doing something tht you love. That is the most important part of anything. No one will lay on their deathbed and say" Gee I wish I could have spent more time shoveling cowshit in to a wheel barrow for $ 3 an hour. "
I just started up in a town that has a big music school thinking that would be a good idea but all those guys are poor starving students so there's no line at the door. Maybe I should have thought that out a little more. My strategy has been to go the the music stores and clubs and try to become part of the music scene around here. So far minimal payback but in a few years I'm sure things will change. Be realistic about what you will be doing don't go into debtto get started and give em hell!!
Eric

[cajonezzz]

Having just completed a new room and having moderate success ( we define that as breaking even even if by very little) over the last 6 months, I'll chime in a little bit.

Unless you have someone bringing the gigs, planting the seeds for the next gig and taking care of day to day biz,phone calls. Hanging out where the potential work is... You may find yourself with your ass in the chair so much as to not be able to do the things that are really important to the health and growth of the studio, and your own.

now, if your are indeed a producer, capable of bringing work to an already exsisting studio I would say that you should leave well enough alone...At the MOST , build an overdub room, a personal space that you can do the stuff that isn't critical to have the vibe and size/gear of an established place to work with. Maybe a mix rig ala/Stealth or e-que.

I think as a biz venture, one that can support a family....a studio, be it one man or larger is a very poor choice on many fronts. You've got to get brutally honest with the earning potential of a studio in YOUR market.

look around you at the competitinon (whether or not you view them as that, until clients just "gotta have you" you are in competition with them based on rates to some degree)

For instance, I'm in the greater San diego area. If you open the local rag (the reader) and look at studio's listed for hire, your'll see MANY rooms listed (10) with full on HD and 2 inch, tracking rooms, etc. The "going rate" is 3-500 bucks a day Including the guy in the chair trying to eek out a living.


Sobering huh? Point is, do the math. figure out what you ate "worth" then figure out what you can actually demand in your area, estimate down on the # of days you can book per month, and start crunching numbers. allow for 3 "dead months" , ghost town months. Allow for gear upkeep, insurance... etc. etc.

I admire anyone that has taken the leap to do this commercially and as a main income. It takes dedication and a love for the craft for sure...whether or not your at Slippys size joint or mine.

all this doom aside...we have a place that is staffed by working muso's, we all write, record, gig,(and currently I am teching on the road) and circulate with folks that need our services. It is a group effort. We're establishing a "niche" thru creative spec deals and having a "residential studio" near the beach. it all helps. Gear (sorry gearslutz) is secondary to good biz chops, good experiences for the clientele. (providing your best work at all times is a given)
We operated at a loss for the first year BTW.
We have an owner who committed to flating us through the first 3 years. this is a rarity, and we are blessed in that regard.

There's lot's of other stuff you can do to generate biz....more on that later.

good luck, and think HARD before you make this move. and , if you have a significant other to put in the picture...make sure they are on board. You won't be home much.
craig


(re read your post to add) :

a good month has been 30 days booked.
a bad month was 4 days
day rate with engineer+ 750.00
we have sliding rates for packages/all in albums

average booking since we opened 15 days a month....that is losing money.

The only advice I can give is in my climate you can succeed by doing one thing.

Rap and lots of it.

I did this for a few years and opened my doors fairly unknown locally. Rappers kept me booked!

The crowds sucked!
The music sucked!
Valium made it ok.

3 years of this and I went private and became a Network Engineer to have a real paycheck.

It was fun and I would do it again. In fact, I am on track to retire early and I will with no need for he income.

Ahhhhhh, can't wait.

Until then, I slut!


D

[cajonezzz]

Originally posted by dpasch
Rap and lots of it.

I did this for a few years and opened my doors fairly unknown locally. Rappers kept me booked!

The crowds sucked!
The music sucked!
Valium made it ok.



D

I did rap for about a year in the early 90's. I got sick of wanna be badass's treating me and the room like shit. Not to mention coming to the session strapped. No thanks.

[davemc]

Originally posted by juniorhifikit
If you want to produce records, just bring the work to an already established (and probably hurting) studio. You can always get a cut rate from studios, since you're bringing in the client. .

And thats what I would do now, use someone else gear, they have up keep, rent, upgrades etc. For the $'s you get studios for now a days its the way to go. Yes it might not look like you make as many $'s in a day although you take out the costs and you are way in front. If you work regually at a place they will do you deals.
Around 50% of work that comes in my place no is freelancers.

[LTA]

Originally posted by davemc
Around 50% of work that comes in my place no is freelancers.

Hey, you talkin' to me?

I've got a great situation as a freelancer right now. There is a recording studio with a good live room and decent stuff in the control room. They are actually making their money off of monthly rehearsal rooms in another nearby building (farms rock, especially when the city grows in around them).

I think their whole concept was to have a personal recording studio the owners could use whenever they wanted, and still pay the bills. Honestly, i think they are happy if they turn on their studio lights 4 days a week. I can save more by using their place for larger things like band tracking, than i could ever reasonably hope to make by building my own studio.

Someday, i do hope to build a reasonable-sized live room in my home large enough to record drums and pretty much anything else that can be overdubbed. But i don't kid myself that i personally could keep a commercial studio afloat, even if all i had to pay was utility bills. I do enjoy my day job, but not as much as i like making and recording music/sound.

Boats will always be more expensive, and have far fewer lasting returns. Although i have run into a few people whose 2 happiest days were the day they bought their studio, and the day they sold it. This pair of owners sold their studio in frustration, and yet the studio basically came with a good booking of commercial jingle clients keeping the place busy for at least 60 hours a week. I think they may have been really lenient on the collection of outstanding balances though. Get a big bouncer/thug with tatoos to work for you as an engineer, just to make people think twice before they pass on the tab.

Just having some fun, none of this is too serious in terms of advice.

"I did rap for about a year in the early 90's. I got sick of wanna be badass's treating me and the room like shit. Not to mention coming to the session strapped. No thanks."

I did not mean to imply I liked it. Just that it worked out finacially.

however, did not have any that were strapped. They all paid and paid well. I even had one guy who would miss sessions and when he came back the first thing he would do is pay up for the time he booked and missed. We would always start working on something when he session began and if he showed we would stop. it was nice like that some times cause we would get payed for some "on-hold" music AND the session that didn't show.

Funny thing is....This guy would be the only rapper I would have back if I opened y doors. He was a nice guy...despite the lyrics.

"It's that red juice I thirst, when your head start to burst!"
Yikes!


D

[RichT]

Hi Messiah,

Just a couple of things to add to the melting pot.

Someone mentioned an alternative method of income to the studio ticking over - three words:

Rehearsals, Gear Hire (for use on premises only) and Consumables (Sticks, Strings, etc)

Ok, four words...

It's easy money and great advertising for your recording services.

We would barely survive without it - we have a minimum of two bands a day rehearsing, on weekends we have 8 bands a day. Brings in about 3k-4k a month which covers our outgoings, recording is then all 'profit' (yeah right hahahahah)

Of course it will depend on the availability of rehearsal rooms in your area but normally bands are jumping over each other to get into a rehearsal space.

On average a good month here is:

10 days recording
432 hrs of rehearsals

10 days doesn't sound like much but as I'm the only engineer and I'm concentrating on quality rather than quantity I tend to spread bands bookings out rather than pack them in.

Cheers,
Rich

[nelsons]

Originally posted by dpasch
3 years of this and I went private and became a Network Engineer to have a real paycheck.

I'm a network engineer (ccie R&S, Security) and now have enough cash to open a decent facility where I live, probably will end up spending something like 150k, I don't need to make a living from it so I guess I am lucky. I have been a working musician for more years than I care to remember so it should be a laugh.

Hopefully we'll end up making enough to break even, that would be cool and then I could stop shelling out.

All the best and I hope it works out for you.

Steve

[Messiah]

Originally posted by RichT
Hi Messiah,

Just a couple of things to add to the melting pot.

Someone mentioned an alternative method of income to the studio ticking over - three words:

Rehearsals, Gear Hire (for use on premises only) and Consumables (Sticks, Strings, etc)

Ok, four words...

It's easy money and great advertising for your recording services.

We would barely survive without it - we have a minimum of two bands a day rehearsing, on weekends we have 8 bands a day. Brings in about 3k-4k a month which covers our outgoings, recording is then all 'profit' (yeah right hahahahah)

Of course it will depend on the availability of rehearsal rooms in your area but normally bands are jumping over each other to get into a rehearsal space.

On average a good month here is:

10 days recording
432 hrs of rehearsals

10 days doesn't sound like much but as I'm the only engineer and I'm concentrating on quality rather than quantity I tend to spread bands bookings out rather than pack them in.

Cheers,
Rich

Hi Rich,

You've hit the nail on the head and this is what I'm currently looking into.

I have the potential to firstly set up a rehearsal facility containing 10-15 rooms kitted out with a PA, mics, etc...
I've been doing the maths and I see this as the way forward.
So, now, my plan is to set this up first, get it up and running for 6-12 months and then use the income to subsidise/finance the recording facility, which will be located nearby, close enough to have the custom of these bands.

It's got me quite busy both physically and mentally at the moment! Hey, I'm even working today and it's my birthday!!! (...not that I'm one for celebrating the fact)

As I have a good amount of space, I'm also going to set up a cafe/lounge area, and, more importantly to me, a 'showcase room'. The latter, I'm hoping, will house a 5-10k rig, full backline, a stage, lighting rig, etc, and I will put some groovy furniture, coffee machines, etc.., for entertaining.
The idea is to set up a monthly showcase for local artists/bands and get industry people in for presentations/feedback/promo. As well as it being used for this monthly arrangement, bands could hire it out for private showcases/pre-tour productions, etc... I think it would make sense financially.

I know a lot of bands in the area and I know I can price competitively against other facilities.
I'm beginning to get excited at the prospect of being able to endulge more in the studio in the long term if I can get this right first.

Again, thanks for all the responses!
My thought process has changed considerably since I first posted the thread, which I'm very grateful for.

Some really good advise...I mean advice.