Improving vocals - can I get some good info/tips on tracking with a compressor?

[perx]

I own several nice mics, and I usually have them going to the neve preamp then straight into the DAW. I now want to use my compressors, mainly the Neve Portico 5043, and tracking the vocals through that into the DAW.

Im having trouble finding good complete info on general guidelines or settings to use compressors when tracking (such as threshold, attack/release, ratio, etc)

So I thought I would try and get the kind souls on Gearslutz to help me out a bit.. ;-)

I guess my reasons to use a compressor when tracking is to maybe get some "colour" of the compressor - but mainly to make sure to tame the peaks and to make the vocals more even. My main female vocalist have a tendency to sometimes dip a bit too low and sometimes go up too high. Which (without a compressor) forces me to record at pretty low volumes to make sure those highs dont distort when going into the DAW.. And since she goes low at times, I need to work the vocals alot once recorded.. All with plugins. So I want to get started more with tracking with compression - to get some flavour of the compressor, more even levels, and to make things easier from the start instead of making me working harder ITB. :-)

So far it seems a ratio of 4:1 is recommended, along with fast attack, fast release and pretty low threshold. But can anyone here maybe give some more detailed info on:
1 - basic settings to tame levels and even the vocals out.
2 - general tips on how to approach tracking and compressing vocals, such as maybe how to work the compressor settings during her warming in order to set it up the best way.

It would be super to see this thread full of good tips and some of the knowledge alot of you have, and not only help me - but everyone searching for info like this in the future.

As always, my sincere thanks to any info/tips. :-)

[mattytrump]

I like the distressors, I do a lot of hip-hop recording and I don't usually have a fast attack and release. I set them to about 5, 4, respectively with a 3:1 or 4:1 ratio. This seems to work well because if the attack is to hard it might compress to much and increase your changes for distortion. If you are using something like a 1176 I usually have the input at 9 or 10 o'clock and the out at about 1. and the attack and release up the middle.
Anyway hope this helps a little, and as I'm sure u know these don't work for everything!!lol

[samwinston123]

I usually go with a fast attack/release and 3:1 or 4:1 ratio (depending on the dynamics of the singer, maybe higher) and then set the threshold so I'm getting about 3-4 db of reduction. If you've got someone who is alternately belting it out and whispering, don't be afraid to raise the ratio.

[bob katz]

Originally Posted by perx

I own several nice mics, and I usually have them going to the neve preamp then straight into the DAW. I now want to use my compressors, mainly the Neve Portico 5043, and tracking the vocals through that into the DAW.

(snip)


So far it seems a ratio of 4:1 is recommended, along with fast attack, fast release and pretty low threshold. But can anyone here maybe give some more detailed info on:

Hmmmm.... all of the above seem like dangerous "starting" settings for someone just getting started trying to compress vocals when tracking. My first suggestion, even before discussing any settings, would be that you patch your vocalist both through the compressor to one track and also uncompressed to another track. This will DEFINITELY ease your concerns and probably speed up the learning curve.

4:1 is a strong amount of compression for tracking a vocal, in my opinion. Fast attack? How fast? Digital compressor or analog compressor? Saying "fast" is like inviting the removal of too many transients from the vocalist and potentially taking away the life. Same with "fast release".... how fast? Too fast and you'll potentially take away from the life and the dynamics and invite breathing and/or pumping. "Low threshold"? How low? How much gain reduction?

I imagine someone has written a primer on how to adjust a compressor when dealing with tracking a vocalist who is a bit too dynamic, or to sweeten her sound. But I strongly suggest you look for that primer (perhaps here in the forum) before starting.

I would start with the question: "Why compress"? Is it:

---to protect from accidental overloads because this singer is known to be extremely dynamic (a very legitimate use for an analog compressor during tracking)


----to help smooth out her peaks and dips for the purposes of mixing (a not as legitimate use since it is probably better to wait during mixing so as to optimize the compression for the purposes of the mix)

----to smooth out peaks and dips for artistic purposes (see above)

----to capture the "sound" of a nice compressor while tracking as you know that compressor will really suit the sound of her voice (a potentially use for sure, but consider the double tracking suggestion above, in case you don't quite get the settings right.) Tracking a live vocalist is so full of variables that it is extremely hard to get the compressor right before hitting record, at least for a novice.

But since I haven't done this for a while and no longer do it regularly I'm fearful of suggesting numbers, though I must confess to having used a very nice LA-2A (tube) while tracking vocalists live in my day, mostly to help the later mixing, and survived quite well :-). The LA-2 was (is) a one-knob squeezer, and tends to sound nice on vocals no matter how you abuse it.

4:1 sounds like a tremendous amount for a tracking session, depending on the model of the unit and the aggressiveness and unevenness of the singer, I would recommend starting out with something under 2:1.

"Fast" attack is too general. If it's an analog compressor I'd say "40 to 100 Ms". Fast release is too general, for an analog compressor I'd say "250 ms". Just as guides and starting points!

Threshold---set so that the maximum gain reduction on the unit's meter is no more than about a dB or so! Anything more than that is more safely applied during a mixing session when you have foreknowledge of how much you need and there are no mysteries, unlike tracking, which is the time, in my opinion, to be most conservative, and not paint yourself into a corner.

Hope this helps!

[perx]

Originally Posted by bob katz

Hmmmm.... all of the above seem like dangerous "starting" settings for someone just getting started trying to compress vocals when tracking. My first suggestion, even before discussing any settings, would be that you patch your vocalist both through the compressor to one track and also uncompressed to another track. This will DEFINITELY ease your concerns and probably speed up the learning curve.

4:1 is a strong amount of compression for tracking a vocal, in my opinion. Fast attack? How fast? Digital compressor or analog compressor? Saying "fast" is like inviting the removal of too many transients from the vocalist and potentially taking away the life. Same with "fast release".... how fast? Too fast and you'll potentially take away from the life and the dynamics and invite breathing and/or pumping. "Low threshold"? How low? How much gain reduction?

I imagine someone has written a primer on how to adjust a compressor when dealing with tracking a vocalist who is a bit too dynamic, or to sweeten her sound. But I strongly suggest you look for that primer (perhaps here in the forum) before starting.

I would start with the question: "Why compress"? Is it:

---to protect from accidental overloads because this singer is known to be extremely dynamic (a very legitimate use for an analog compressor during tracking)


----to help smooth out her peaks and dips for the purposes of mixing (a not as legitimate use since it is probably better to wait during mixing so as to optimize the compression for the purposes of the mix)

----to smooth out peaks and dips for artistic purposes (see above)

----to capture the "sound" of a nice compressor while tracking as you know that compressor will really suit the sound of her voice (a potentially use for sure, but consider the double tracking suggestion above, in case you don't quite get the settings right.) Tracking a live vocalist is so full of variables that it is extremely hard to get the compressor right before hitting record, at least for a novice.

But since I haven't done this for a while and no longer do it regularly I'm fearful of suggesting numbers, though I must confess to having used a very nice LA-2A (tube) while tracking vocalists live in my day, mostly to help the later mixing, and survived quite well :-). The LA-2 was (is) a one-knob squeezer, and tends to sound nice on vocals no matter how you abuse it.

4:1 sounds like a tremendous amount for a tracking session, depending on the model of the unit and the aggressiveness and unevenness of the singer, I would recommend starting out with something under 2:1.

"Fast" attack is too general. If it's an analog compressor I'd say "40 to 100 Ms". Fast release is too general, for an analog compressor I'd say "250 ms". Just as guides and starting points!

Threshold---set so that the maximum gain reduction on the unit's meter is no more than about a dB or so! Anything more than that is more safely applied during a mixing session when you have foreknowledge of how much you need and there are no mysteries, unlike tracking, which is the time, in my opinion, to be most conservative, and not paint yourself into a corner.

Hope this helps!

Great info. Thanks!! all your points are the reasons I would like to try and start using analog compression when tracking - to avoid her highs (possible distortion) and lows (to even her performerance out), and to get some "colour" from the compressor. The compressor I will be using mostly for this is the: rupert neve 5043

together with the Neve 5012 preamp..

Not sure how I can double track since the mic goes to one channel of the preamp, then to one on the compressor and then straight into one input on the MOTU soundcard.

Im trying to get as much info as possible to make sure things go as smooth as possible, since I only have access to her fantastic (but a bit unpredictable) voice once a week and pay her a good amount of $$$ per session. Need to really make the most out of each session. Im eager and excited to get started with analog compression when tracking - but at the same time a bit cautious since I dont want to waste valuable studio time, money and work.

thanks again for the info!

[Oldone]

I split my signal before the preamp to get one side clean and the other side into the channel with compression. This on the 5012. Another approach is to split the signal after the Portico and run it into both sides of the 5043 and bypass one side. Take both channels to the Motu. Just some suggestions.

Also, if you are looking for vibe, put the 5043 in FB mode.