Pre for 500 format- Desert island Pre

wanderlust8 · 24th August 2007, 12:28 AM

Well... finally did it and have an empty BAE lunchbox and i'm itching to put my first pre inside! But... I can only afford one.

It needs to be utilitarian: Vocals (female-me!), Bass DI, Synths/keys, and acous/classical gtr. NO Live drums. Ofcourse I'm looking for deep bass, smooth mids, and open highs. My main mic is a C-1.

So far, it seems the BAE 312a, Purple Biz, or a OSA may do it? I visited the wonderful Listening Sessions site and the API 3124 'sound' didn't make me quiver.... am I a bad girl??? thanks!

kmade · 24th August 2007, 12:34 AM

shadow hills gamma three in one and amazing sound quality BIG BANG FOR THE BUCK . you can get other flavors later but if only one this one kills jmo

gm5k · 24th August 2007, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wanderlust8

Well... finally did it and have an empty BAE lunchbox and i'm itching to put my first pre inside! But... I can only afford one.

It needs to be utilitarian: Vocals (female-me!), Bass DI, Synths/keys, and acous/classical gtr. NO Live drums. Ofcourse I'm looking for deep bass, smooth mids, and open highs. My main mic is a C-1.

So far, it seems the BAE 312a, Purple Biz, or a OSA may do it? I visited the wonderful Listening Sessions site and the API 3124 'sound' didn't make me quiver.... am I a bad girl??? thanks!

from your description of what you want i say Buzz Elixir or A Designs P-1. P-1's mids are more forward, but both have very smooth mids. i like the Elixir's low end more, the best of any 500 pre ive heard. in the highs the P-1 is a little airier while i think the Elixir is more natural. they both have very open highs

id use the Elixir for bass DI, the P-1 for synths/keys, and for acoustic/classical gtr. id have to go w/ the Elixir again. id be very happy to have just one of these preamps handling all these sources. having both of them is just awesome

thenoiseflower · 24th August 2007, 01:14 AM

512, no doubt.

BUT, on an island youd have atleast 5 other slots to bring with it! or else you wouldnt be able to use it.....

but if you are asking for big bass , smoth mids and open highs, I'd say elixir too.

Daedalus77 · 24th August 2007, 01:21 AM

Great River. All of the pres in this format are great—and fairly versatile—but in my opinion, the GR (in 500 form or standard rack size) is the best all-arounder available in "higher-end" preamps, bar none. (And we've got API, BAE, and Purple here, as well.)

Best of luck.

wanderlust8 · 24th August 2007, 01:34 AM

thanks for the feedback

The P-1 gets tons of raves out there- for good reason I'm sure. I think it may do best as my 2nd pre?

I thought the Purple Audio Biz would be a great fit since it can have different tones between the 3 amps. Supposedly wicked on bass di too...

elixer eh?... that mono-gama justplains looks like a gorgeous beast.

wanderlust8 · 24th August 2007, 01:45 AM

I forgot to mention, what about the API sound I didn't like (might help)... it sounded a little mid-heavy. I'm looking for something sounding 'bigger'. Music is mostly synth based with vocals and guitars.

Anyone out there with the Averill 312a and the 512? please chime in to compare... Averill would be great option since they are close by. But what should be my first and only work horse... on my desert island.

h-man · 24th August 2007, 03:24 AM

Well, I will chime in because I own the P1, Buzz, and GR. It's really hard to say which one, because they all sound amazing.

The Buzz is very sweet in the low-end and sounds amazing on bass. It really sounds great on everything. The P1 does have sweet mids and a different sounding low-end than the Buzz, but very nice sounding in its own right. The GR sounds great on everything too. So you see, I'm not much of a help, but there is one pre I own that I did not mention. I think it sounds amazing on all sources, but really seems to shine when I use it on female vocs.

That pre is...the A Designs Blue. It sounds great on female vocs and everything else.
All in all, you aren't going to lose with any of the 500 pre's. In case you're wondering, my first pre in the box was the Buzz, and I couldn't have been happier with that purchase.

Good luck and let us know how your lunch box fills up.

TAVD · 24th August 2007, 04:46 AM

I'd have to go with the Biz. It's the most versatile one in my lunch box.
My favorites are:
BAE 312A for bass
EM Silver for amps
Great River with ribbons for anything
Elixir for acoustics
The biz is always either a tie or a very close second.

Brad McGowan · 24th August 2007, 05:00 AM

P1 would be my choice. Either that or something I've concocted myself using the Eisen Audio DIY kits.

Brad

wanderlust8 · 24th August 2007, 06:35 AM

Thanks for the great thoughts everyone! keep em coming...

The Buzz Elixer and the Purple Biz seems like strong contenders! What are their "Colors" ? I'm looking for some color, and not too clean.

An Eisen with the St. Ives is on my big wish list (santa?)... that would be so cool, i'd never part with it.

i've saved my pennies, and i've got an itch to be a dirrty GS....

goldenlotus · 24th August 2007, 10:15 AM

I've been wondering basically the same thing too. I'm looking for my first 500 series pre, mainly for female vox, and was leaning towards the P-1. Does this one have the most open highend compared to the others?

analogjeff · 23rd November 2007, 10:18 PM

and, which 500-type pre do folks recommend for big, strong vocals??

thanks!

espen askelad · 23rd November 2007, 11:09 PM

I often want to get back into the 500 format just to get the Biz again. It's a great preamp. I also owned a few P1s and spent some time with Buzz and Averill 500 pres. The good news is, they're all really good units, and ultimately, I think you could choose any one of them and you'd be really happy. I think though that as a "desert island" sort of thing I'd choose the Biz, with the Buzz as my second choice. The P1 is great, but has a very distinct character and there are some things I didn't like it for - acoustic guitar and bass in particular - whereas other sources it's absolutely going to rock. The Averill and APIs are great but I can get most of what I like about them, and then some, from the Biz. The Buzz also had a tone that I thought would work on most sources, though I was partial to the character of the Purple.

ScumBum · 24th November 2007, 05:45 AM

A P I

drBill · 24th November 2007, 07:59 AM

Another vote for the Biz.

seaneldon · 24th November 2007, 08:29 AM

I dont know...the Biz is kinda...well, "the business". It's the kind of pre that no matter how many times I use it, and how many pres are available for the 500-series format now, I always find myself saying "this is one of the baddest mother-fathers on Sean's green earth."

The dual switch by itself has a tendency to be a one-and-done cherry on top for snare drums, overdriven guitars, and lead vocals. And, as you already seem to have heard, it's kind of nuts as a bass DI (I didn't like it with a Strat. The Great River kinda smoked it there. But the Great River doesn't do what the Biz does for a bass. Check it out in "Dual", input 95% of the way down, output cranked, easy compression after the pre).

pan60 · 26th November 2007, 04:30 AM

the A-Designs P-1 would be my first choice as well, very sweet, mid forward, i just love the upper mids, buttery :)~
if you want something with a bit more color, although not as mid forward, the LaChapell Audio 583s is very nice.

**James 'LA' Lugo** · 26th November 2007, 05:15 AM

The Avedis MA5 and EM Blue are my favs.

mattoxxx · 26th November 2007, 06:31 AM

I've used the Shadow Hills mono Gama on all the sources you have mentioned. It was easily one of my "go to" pre's because I knew it wasn't going to sound bad. It was great with keys/synths because of the different transformers and you could quickly change the sound but still keep continuity when layering multiple tracks...same goes with guitars. Vocals, it was sometimes a hit or a miss depeding on singer/mic but was usually always useable come mix time. I own a pair of API 512's and I'd say the Shadow Hills are just as versitile but a different sound. I also have a pair of Chandler Germ 500's but they aren't behaving too well with my BAE rack so I haven't had a chance to put 'em through their paces. All these are inexpensive enough to throw a few on your credit card try 'em out return what doesn't work for you.

Matt Hayes

Autocrat · 26th November 2007, 06:37 AM

Another vote for GR 500NV or MA5, makes things sound B I G.

**Tim Farrant** · 26th November 2007, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autocrat

Another vote for GR 500NV or MA5, makes things sound B I G.

mmmmmm, whatever happened to "makes things sound real"?

roger · 26th November 2007, 09:24 AM

i wouldn't get the p-1 for female vox specifically......there would be the possibility for a little too much top-end. i recorded a gal a couple weeks back who almost had a bit of a lispe in her delivery and it sounded great BUT it could get a little bright on some ladies.....i would go for something a little more neutral in the top-end.....the p-1 does the sheen-thing way more than my api and GR pres - depends on your vocal sound/style. it shocked me when i first heard it and took some getting used to.....i mainly use it on acoustic g's and with my R84.....anyway have fun on your hunt......there are lotsa great flavours to chose from!

futur2 · 26th November 2007, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattoxxx

I also have a pair of Chandler Germ 500's but they aren't behaving too well with my BAE rack so I haven't had a chance to put 'em through their paces.

Matt Hayes

how comes? never heard of new modules not behaving well

superburtm · 26th November 2007, 11:30 AM

API 512's! I keep coming back to them ater the hype dies on newer pres

roger · 26th November 2007, 02:19 PM

yeah - what's the story with the germ500s??? am i mistaken or do you have to shell out more cash for the recommended PSU from chandler to get it to 'behave' in a 500 frame?!.....if so then (let me do the math).......it is more costly to get a germ500 than the rack version of the pre??!!

drBill · 26th November 2007, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Farrant

mmmmmm, whatever happened to "makes things sound real"?

Awwww, come on Tim. "Real", "Transparent"??? That went the way of the dinosaur. Now we want smashed color. OK??

(j/k)

mds · 26th November 2007, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roger

yeah - what's the story with the germ500s??? am i mistaken or do you have to shell out more cash for the recommended PSU from chandler to get it to 'behave' in a 500 frame?!.....if so then (let me do the math).......it is more costly to get a germ500 than the rack version of the pre??!!

Totally agree...if I need a PSU anyways I'd rather just have the rackmount....

yrlk · 27th November 2007, 03:01 AM

For the versatility and assured musicality on any source, I cannot imagine a more useful pre than the Purple Biz. I just got one, and I am very, very surprised. I have 512c's and an Eisen with St. Ives. Both work better than the other for different things, but I'm telling you... the Biz just works for everything PERFECTLY. The sound you want is literally just a twist of two knobs and maybe the push of one button away. It can be ultra up-front or just smooth and balanced.

Haven't heard anything that doesn't sound GREAT... vocals included.

Purple Biz for my vote.

wanderlust8 · 11th December 2007, 12:53 AM

all wonderful input. i looove natural, but sometimes, a girl likes it big too!

as an update... since the post, i spent time with the P-1, which I thought was a bit too mid forward and not 'deep' as I'd hoped. Next came the Great River which I friggin love, but as my only dessert island pre, I had to let it go b/c it wasn't working for my vocals (if I had more $$ and mics, the GR should swim back to my island one day). However, it is a BAD arse pre, definitely BIG and ruled bass and elec gtrs.

Now, i'm alone on my 6 slot BAE lunchbox with just an Eisen "nevish" Pre (St. Ives transformer)... which by my tastes is suiting most everything very well! I really do love this thing and Mr. Eisen was kind enough to sell me his last personal unit!

Next up.. Purple BIZ, LaChapell 583e, and a compressor should fit nicely.
Does anyone think the Biz is similar to a GML sound at all???

The 500 format does rule!

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24th August 2007, 12:28 AM	#1
wanderlust8 Gear Head Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Long Beach, Ca Posts: 37	Pre for 500 format- Desert island Pre Well... finally did it and have an empty BAE lunchbox and i'm itching to put my first pre inside! But... I can only afford one. It needs to be utilitarian: Vocals (female-me!), Bass DI, Synths/keys, and acous/classical gtr. NO Live drums. Ofcourse I'm looking for deep bass, smooth mids, and open highs. My main mic is a C-1. So far, it seems the BAE 312a, Purple Biz, or a OSA may do it? I visited the wonderful Listening Sessions site and the API 3124 'sound' didn't make me quiver.... am I a bad girl??? thanks!

24th August 2007, 03:24 AM	#8
h-man Gear nut Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 86	Well, I will chime in because I own the P1, Buzz, and GR. It's really hard to say which one, because they all sound amazing. The Buzz is very sweet in the low-end and sounds amazing on bass. It really sounds great on everything. The P1 does have sweet mids and a different sounding low-end than the Buzz, but very nice sounding in its own right. The GR sounds great on everything too. So you see, I'm not much of a help, but there is one pre I own that I did not mention. I think it sounds amazing on all sources, but really seems to shine when I use it on female vocs. That pre is...the A Designs Blue. It sounds great on female vocs and everything else. All in all, you aren't going to lose with any of the 500 pre's. In case you're wondering, my first pre in the box was the Buzz, and I couldn't have been happier with that purchase. Good luck and let us know how your lunch box fills up. __________________ Don't be a puppet on strings!

24th August 2007, 04:46 AM	#9
TAVD Lives for gear Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Maryland Posts: 1,070	I'd have to go with the Biz. It's the most versatile one in my lunch box. My favorites are: BAE 312A for bass EM Silver for amps Great River with ribbons for anything Elixir for acoustics The biz is always either a tie or a very close second. __________________ Tom Denyle Custom Guitars

24th August 2007, 05:00 AM	#10
Brad McGowan Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 3,054	P1 would be my choice. Either that or something I've concocted myself using the Eisen Audio DIY kits. Brad __________________ Little Red Wagon Studios http://www.myspace.com/lrws *Help sing on my band's record!* http://kni.songhole.org/LRWS/PAR.html How to integrate your analog tape deck with your DAW: http://www.youtube.com/user/redwagonstudio

24th August 2007, 12:34 AM	#2
kmade Gear Head Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 42	shadow hills gamma three in one and amazing sound quality BIG BANG FOR THE BUCK . you can get other flavors later but if only one this one kills jmo

24th August 2007, 01:14 AM	#4
thenoiseflower Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Boston Posts: 1,078	512, no doubt. BUT, on an island youd have atleast 5 other slots to bring with it! or else you wouldnt be able to use it..... but if you are asking for big bass , smoth mids and open highs, I'd say elixir too.

24th August 2007, 01:21 AM	#5
Daedalus77 Lives for gear Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Connecticut, USA Posts: 555	Great River. All of the pres in this format are great—and fairly versatile—but in my opinion, the GR (in 500 form or standard rack size) is the best all-arounder available in "higher-end" preamps, bar none. (And we've got API, BAE, and Purple here, as well.) Best of luck.

24th August 2007, 01:34 AM	#6
wanderlust8 Gear Head Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Long Beach, Ca Posts: 37	thanks for the feedback The P-1 gets tons of raves out there- for good reason I'm sure. I think it may do best as my 2nd pre? I thought the Purple Audio Biz would be a great fit since it can have different tones between the 3 amps. Supposedly wicked on bass di too... elixer eh?... that mono-gama justplains looks like a gorgeous beast.

24th August 2007, 01:45 AM	#7
wanderlust8 Gear Head Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Long Beach, Ca Posts: 37	I forgot to mention, what about the API sound I didn't like (might help)... it sounded a little mid-heavy. I'm looking for something sounding 'bigger'. Music is mostly synth based with vocals and guitars. Anyone out there with the Averill 312a and the 512? please chime in to compare... Averill would be great option since they are close by. But what should be my first and only work horse... on my desert island.

24th August 2007, 06:35 AM	#11
wanderlust8 Gear Head Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Long Beach, Ca Posts: 37	Thanks for the great thoughts everyone! keep em coming... The Buzz Elixer and the Purple Biz seems like strong contenders! What are their "Colors" ? I'm looking for some color, and not too clean. An Eisen with the St. Ives is on my big wish list (santa?)... that would be so cool, i'd never part with it. i've saved my pennies, and i've got an itch to be a dirrty GS....

24th August 2007, 10:15 AM	#12
goldenlotus Lives for gear Join Date: May 2007 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 716	I've been wondering basically the same thing too. I'm looking for my first 500 series pre, mainly for female vox, and was leaning towards the P-1. Does this one have the most open highend compared to the others? __________________ http://www.myspace.com/nickbrandes http://www.thebreweryrecordingstudio.com/nick.html

23rd November 2007, 10:18 PM	#13
analogjeff Gear maniac Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Ithaca, NY Posts: 288	and, which 500-type pre do folks recommend for big, strong vocals?? thanks!

23rd November 2007, 11:09 PM	#14
espen askelad Gear addict Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 432	I often want to get back into the 500 format just to get the Biz again. It's a great preamp. I also owned a few P1s and spent some time with Buzz and Averill 500 pres. The good news is, they're all really good units, and ultimately, I think you could choose any one of them and you'd be really happy. I think though that as a "desert island" sort of thing I'd choose the Biz, with the Buzz as my second choice. The P1 is great, but has a very distinct character and there are some things I didn't like it for - acoustic guitar and bass in particular - whereas other sources it's absolutely going to rock. The Averill and APIs are great but I can get most of what I like about them, and then some, from the Biz. The Buzz also had a tone that I thought would work on most sources, though I was partial to the character of the Purple.

24th November 2007, 05:45 AM	#15
ScumBum Gear addict Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: San Fransisco , BayArea Posts: 477	A P I

24th November 2007, 07:59 AM	#16
drBill Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: So Cal Posts: 3,833	Another vote for the Biz.

24th November 2007, 08:29 AM	#17
seaneldon Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Foxboro, MA Posts: 2,102	I dont know...the Biz is kinda...well, "the business". It's the kind of pre that no matter how many times I use it, and how many pres are available for the 500-series format now, I always find myself saying "this is one of the baddest mother-fathers on Sean's green earth." The dual switch by itself has a tendency to be a one-and-done cherry on top for snare drums, overdriven guitars, and lead vocals. And, as you already seem to have heard, it's kind of nuts as a bass DI (I didn't like it with a Strat. The Great River kinda smoked it there. But the Great River doesn't do what the Biz does for a bass. Check it out in "Dual", input 95% of the way down, output cranked, easy compression after the pre). __________________ Sean Eldon Mercenary Audio sean@mercenary.com "Sean Eldon of Mercenary audio either has some trickery with Velcro going on or is put into his jeans surgically. 'Rock and Roll skinny jeans' begins and ends with Sean"- Jules

26th November 2007, 04:30 AM	#18
pan60 500 series nutjob Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: 500 series Guru SKANK! ; ) Posts: 6,251	the A-Designs P-1 would be my first choice as well, very sweet, mid forward, i just love the upper mids, buttery :)~ if you want something with a bit more color, although not as mid forward, the LaChapell Audio 583s is very nice. __________________ www.pan60.com A CHARTER MEMBER OF THE LA, MAFIA where is LA? IF YOU ARE NOT INTO THE 500 FORMAT, THEN YOU'RE JUST JEALOUS! quote: your secret identity is safe with me superman! Peter Montessi it is easy to sound as though one was endowed with great intelligence, whilst speaking amongst a crowd of total morons

26th November 2007, 05:15 AM	#19
James 'LA' Lugo Moderator Join Date: May 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 3,143	The Avedis MA5 and EM Blue are my favs. __________________ Vocal Asylum, 323.462.4722 6381 Hollywood Blvd. Suite 700 Los Angeles, CA 90028 http://www.JamesLugo.com http://www.WritingGiants.com http://www.myspace.com/jameslugo Clients Include: The Smashing Pumpkins, 311, A Fine Frenzy, The Veronica's, American Idol

26th November 2007, 06:31 AM	#20
mattoxxx Gear maniac Join Date: May 2003 Location: boston Posts: 166	I've used the Shadow Hills mono Gama on all the sources you have mentioned. It was easily one of my "go to" pre's because I knew it wasn't going to sound bad. It was great with keys/synths because of the different transformers and you could quickly change the sound but still keep continuity when layering multiple tracks...same goes with guitars. Vocals, it was sometimes a hit or a miss depeding on singer/mic but was usually always useable come mix time. I own a pair of API 512's and I'd say the Shadow Hills are just as versitile but a different sound. I also have a pair of Chandler Germ 500's but they aren't behaving too well with my BAE rack so I haven't had a chance to put 'em through their paces. All these are inexpensive enough to throw a few on your credit card try 'em out return what doesn't work for you. Matt Hayes

26th November 2007, 06:37 AM	#21
Autocrat Gear addict Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 337	Another vote for GR 500NV or MA5, makes things sound B I G. __________________ www.myspace.com/ofthe7

26th November 2007, 09:24 AM	#23
roger Gear maniac Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: London Posts: 249	i wouldn't get the p-1 for female vox specifically......there would be the possibility for a little too much top-end. i recorded a gal a couple weeks back who almost had a bit of a lispe in her delivery and it sounded great BUT it could get a little bright on some ladies.....i would go for something a little more neutral in the top-end.....the p-1 does the sheen-thing way more than my api and GR pres - depends on your vocal sound/style. it shocked me when i first heard it and took some getting used to.....i mainly use it on acoustic g's and with my R84.....anyway have fun on your hunt......there are lotsa great flavours to chose from!

26th November 2007, 11:30 AM	#25
superburtm Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 2,382	API 512's! I keep coming back to them ater the hype dies on newer pres

26th November 2007, 02:19 PM	#26
roger Gear maniac Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: London Posts: 249	yeah - what's the story with the germ500s??? am i mistaken or do you have to shell out more cash for the recommended PSU from chandler to get it to 'behave' in a 500 frame?!.....if so then (let me do the math).......it is more costly to get a germ500 than the rack version of the pre??!!

27th November 2007, 03:01 AM	#29
yrlk Gear addict Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 397	For the versatility and assured musicality on any source, I cannot imagine a more useful pre than the Purple Biz. I just got one, and I am very, very surprised. I have 512c's and an Eisen with St. Ives. Both work better than the other for different things, but I'm telling you... the Biz just works for everything PERFECTLY. The sound you want is literally just a twist of two knobs and maybe the push of one button away. It can be ultra up-front or just smooth and balanced. Haven't heard anything that doesn't sound GREAT... vocals included. Purple Biz for my vote.

11th December 2007, 12:53 AM	#30
wanderlust8 Gear Head Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Long Beach, Ca Posts: 37	all wonderful input. i looove natural, but sometimes, a girl likes it big too! as an update... since the post, i spent time with the P-1, which I thought was a bit too mid forward and not 'deep' as I'd hoped. Next came the Great River which I friggin love, but as my only dessert island pre, I had to let it go b/c it wasn't working for my vocals (if I had more $$ and mics, the GR should swim back to my island one day). However, it is a BAD arse pre, definitely BIG and ruled bass and elec gtrs. Now, i'm alone on my 6 slot BAE lunchbox with just an Eisen "nevish" Pre (St. Ives transformer)... which by my tastes is suiting most everything very well! I really do love this thing and Mr. Eisen was kind enough to sell me his last personal unit! Next up.. Purple BIZ, LaChapell 583e, and a compressor should fit nicely. Does anyone think the Biz is similar to a GML sound at all??? The 500 format does rule!