About building an Iso-cab for electr. guit. recording...

**Geert van den Berg** · 2nd April 2004

Hello,

Has someone succesfully build an Iso-cab and doesn't mind to share his/her design?

I'd love to record some guitar at home but can't get enough level for a "clean" recording without bothering my neighbours, which I sometimes still do.

I am also looking at an Iso-cab of the Randall http://www.randallamplifiers.com/pro.../isolation.asp , but it's around 600 Euro and I find that a little too expensive for around 125 Euro I can buy a Celestion Vintage 30 and build something myself.

I could measure that cab since they probably have done some calculations. Allthough I don't know how it would look exactly from the inside.

I am also interested in making something to fit my 4x12" cabs, but that would take quite a lot of space, but I saw something like that once which belonged to Steve Vai. He didn't keep it so obviously it didn't really deliver.

Regards,
Geert

preben · 3rd April 2004

I am building one at the moment (takes a long time because I am SHIT at it and hate doing it) but I will post findings and possibly a couple of pics when I'm done.

**Geert van den Berg** · 4th April 2004

Thanks, every input is appreciated.

I also wanted to know if someone tried the Randall cab and if it's worth the money?

I still think it's quite expensive though.

Tim Halligan · 4th April 2004

You may want to have a look at the Smart Sound Direct "Hermit Cab". There is a review in the June 2003 issue of Sound on Sound. This may be just what you are after, or it may help you to refine your idea for building your own.

Cheers,
Tim

**Geert van den Berg** · 4th April 2004

That Hermit cab looks interesting.

It's about the same price as the Randall cab, but smaller, it has a smaller speaker and can handle less wattage.

djui5 · 4th April 2004

stick it in the fridge.......

Jay Kahrs · 7th April 2004

About five years ago I made an attempt at building an iso-cab. After that experience I'd just fork out the bucks unless you have a hell of a lot of time on your hands and your a good craftsman. I didn't make mine nearly thick or heavy enough and it was pretty massive...

preben · 7th April 2004

After about a week engulfed in glue, sawdust and Rockwool here are some photos of my (nearly) finished iso-box for guitar recording. I haven't used it in any projects yet but first impressions are that it sounds good and in any case a lot better than the volume I could record at before.

I decided to come at the iso-box thing from a slightly different angle. As you can see from the photos what I've done is more to build a 4x12" (3x12" + 1x10" actually) speaker with set-back baffle and a lid. This was done for various reasons: first and foremost I know myself well enough to realize that if there's to much hassle in changing amps when recording I will tend to use the same amp for more or less anything and that's not a great idea if your arrangement is just a bit dense. So it had to be easy to chop and change amps and speakers. Furthermore I am a bit reticent to leave my old AC30 going at full pelt inside of a decidedly NOT ventilated wooden box.

So this seemed worth a go for me. 4 speakers: Celestions '62 Blueback, '67 Greenback and Vintage 30 and a 10" Jensen Special Design C10Q. They're all wired up individually and then I've run 2 mogami mikr leads in there as well. You've got to be really careful not to turn an amp head on without a speaker load and also you've gotta be on your toes in relation to impedance.

The wood is 18mm MDF And all the dampening material is Rockwool. As I am really allergic to Rockwool I've covered it in old bed linen just to keep in the dust. Seems to work and gives the whole thing a very homely and 'sleepy' kind of feel.

I'm going to live with it for a while more or less as it it is and if it works out as well as I think/hope I'm going to maybe apply another layer of dampening and some sort of a finish

So there we are. It was a complete pain to do. Hopefully it will turn out to be worth it. There's some pics following on. I hope there's not to many and that they're not to big...

preben · 7th April 2004

pic

preben · 7th April 2004

and more

preben · 7th April 2004

w

ey....

preben · 7th April 2004

time to go to bed...

preben · 7th April 2004

nearly there...

preben · 7th April 2004

one more to go... (admin: delete at your peril)

preben · 7th April 2004

case closed... a big case...

bassmac · 7th April 2004

Nice job! Let us know how it sounds.

**Geert van den Berg** · 10th April 2004

I am not yet started to build, but am still thinking about it. Preben thanks for making those pics!

I am also interested in how it works out for you.

I found a review of the Randall Iso-cab at Harmony Central and it didn't gave it a very positive review. So I'd better try to make something myself. MDF and a Celestion aren't that expensive.

magnetic · 14th April 2004

I turned a 'spare' closet into a "CHAMBER OF ROCK"

Its got a floating floor/ 3 layers of drywall on all walls and cieling; and fits a 4x12 or even a person that you want to shut up. (or record vox) I cut 'lil holes for spkr/mic cables. I can crank up most except for the loudest amps and still track in the next room as long as I'm wearing extreme isolation headphones. It works pretty darn good. I'll post pics as soon as I can figure out how to.

cost me a few hundred bucks and now all i have to do is hang my clothes in the shower

but clothes are for sissies, right?

doorknocker · 14th April 2004

To my ears, a speaker inside a small box produces a.... boxy sound. Getting a great electric guitar sound (player aside) is all about the interference between the pickups and the amp plus the ambience of the room, even when close micing at ball-busting levels. I never could get a really good sound by not being 'in the line of fire'. An o.k sound perhaps, but there's a completely different thing happening with the upper harmonics. IMHO, this is true not just for 'singing', sustained tones but also for cleaner sounds.
I read an interview with Daniel Lanois where he talked about this and mentioned Neil Young as a prime example.
It's also way more fun.

Andi

Screws · 14th April 2004

Quote:

Originally posted by djui5
stick it in the fridge.......

Actually, Randy, your post made me start to think (a terrible thing, I know) that an old freezer that you can get for a few dollars at the local dump might work really well for this. They have nice, thick, insulated walls, a place to pass cables though and a door.

Hmmm...

zenfreud · 16th April 2004

Preben, thanks for the pictures and explanation about your guitar iso cab. Man, every time I think I'm a total gear fiend, I see something on this site or elsewhere on the internet that blows me away with the level of thought and expense that went behind it. Way cool.

I owned a Folded Space brand Micro Room iso cab and it just did not work for me. For those who don't know this box, it used a small woofer (6", 8", don't remember) but otherwise was similar in concept to the Demeter iso cab. The designer padded down the level and used the smaller driver for the sake of keeping the box really quiet to the outside world. Perhaps they went too far in that direction. Though it allowed for true speaker breakup and output section/speaker mojo, there was a 'honkiness' in the mids that I just could not dial out with eq. The other thing that others have already pointed out is that the player totally loses the speaker/string feedback interaction.

Preben, have you had a chance to use your creation yet? If so, does it deliver the tone? I guess I'm wondering how big the internal dimensions of an iso cab need to be to minimize or eliminate the boxiness I experienced with my tiny iso cab. I mean, if you've got the room, it would be just as easy to make the thing another foot or two deeper, right? I also don't want to bother the neighbors so am wondering how loud this box is on the outside. I may build a box within a box if the tone warrants the trouble.

I really want to be careful about exposure to high spl's for the sake of tone, so an effective iso box would be a godsend. Any others who have built even larger iso cabs care to chime in? Thanks to all.

magnetic · 23rd April 2004

Okay, here's the photos (in no particular chronological order)of my closet turned into an iso-chamber.

shikawkee · 23rd April 2004

I built a computer iso box recently and it can be a challenge (though it works). Eric 'Roscoe' Ambel uses a compact little guitar iso box that sounds boss. I think he built it himself. Maybe at his studio site ? (Cowboy Technical Services or EricAmbel.com probably)

preben · 31st July 2004

I have now lived with and used my iso-box for quite some time now and I will be posting a 'state of affairs' statement very shortly. Did anyone else go ahead and build something similar and what are your experiences..??

Kyle Ashley · 31st July 2004

I hung moving blankets around my mic'd Marshall cab back in the 80s when playing small clubs and it burned up all 4 speakers. That's when I learned the expensive lesson that ventilation is very important when running at high levels for a period of time.

Looking at your iso box, and for that matter, any iso boxes, makes me wonder how the speakers can survive long sessions.

remo · 1st August 2004

heres a link on iso booths i found
http://www.amptone.com/isolationboxes.htm

theres always the option of really small but sweet sounding amps that you can crank and not worry about complaints and blowen ear drums... check out the vox brian may.. this is a little screamer (ignore the mp3 demo), and it's prob cheaper than buying the wood etc for an iso cabinet. You can stick it in a room so you can experiment with mike placement (hard in an iso cabinet). You can also stick some ambience mikes around etc..

http://www.voxamps.co.uk/products/brianMay.htm

there are heaps of boutique recording amps around as well...

2nd April 2004	#1
Geert van den Berg Mac Moderator Joined: May 2003 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 3,454 Thread Starter	About building an Iso-cab for electr. guit. recording... Hello, Has someone succesfully build an Iso-cab and doesn't mind to share his/her design? I'd love to record some guitar at home but can't get enough level for a "clean" recording without bothering my neighbours, which I sometimes still do. I am also looking at an Iso-cab of the Randall http://www.randallamplifiers.com/pro.../isolation.asp , but it's around 600 Euro and I find that a little too expensive for around 125 Euro I can buy a Celestion Vintage 30 and build something myself. I could measure that cab since they probably have done some calculations. Allthough I don't know how it would look exactly from the inside. I am also interested in making something to fit my 4x12" cabs, but that would take quite a lot of space, but I saw something like that once which belonged to Steve Vai. He didn't keep it so obviously it didn't really deliver. Regards, Geert

4th April 2004	#4
Tim Halligan Gear addict Joined: Nov 2003 Location: Perth,Western Australia Posts: 324	You may want to have a look at the Smart Sound Direct "Hermit Cab". There is a review in the June 2003 issue of Sound on Sound. This may be just what you are after, or it may help you to refine your idea for building your own. Cheers, Tim __________________ An Analogue brain in a Digital world.

7th April 2004	#8
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	iso box update (long post) After about a week engulfed in glue, sawdust and Rockwool here are some photos of my (nearly) finished iso-box for guitar recording. I haven't used it in any projects yet but first impressions are that it sounds good and in any case a lot better than the volume I could record at before. I decided to come at the iso-box thing from a slightly different angle. As you can see from the photos what I've done is more to build a 4x12" (3x12" + 1x10" actually) speaker with set-back baffle and a lid. This was done for various reasons: first and foremost I know myself well enough to realize that if there's to much hassle in changing amps when recording I will tend to use the same amp for more or less anything and that's not a great idea if your arrangement is just a bit dense. So it had to be easy to chop and change amps and speakers. Furthermore I am a bit reticent to leave my old AC30 going at full pelt inside of a decidedly NOT ventilated wooden box. So this seemed worth a go for me. 4 speakers: Celestions '62 Blueback, '67 Greenback and Vintage 30 and a 10" Jensen Special Design C10Q. They're all wired up individually and then I've run 2 mogami mikr leads in there as well. You've got to be really careful not to turn an amp head on without a speaker load and also you've gotta be on your toes in relation to impedance. The wood is 18mm MDF And all the dampening material is Rockwool. As I am really allergic to Rockwool I've covered it in old bed linen just to keep in the dust. Seems to work and gives the whole thing a very homely and 'sleepy' kind of feel. I'm going to live with it for a while more or less as it it is and if it works out as well as I think/hope I'm going to maybe apply another layer of dampening and some sort of a finish So there we are. It was a complete pain to do. Hopefully it will turn out to be worth it. There's some pics following on. I hope there's not to many and that they're not to big... Attached Thumbnails

7th April 2004	#9
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	pic Attached Thumbnails

7th April 2004	#10
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	and more Attached Thumbnails

3rd April 2004	#2
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	I am building one at the moment (takes a long time because I am SHIT at it and hate doing it) but I will post findings and possibly a couple of pics when I'm done.

4th April 2004	#6
djui5 Lives for gear Joined: Mar 2004 Location: Phoenix Posts: 6,664	stick it in the fridge.......

7th April 2004	#11
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	wey.... Attached Thumbnails

7th April 2004	#12
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	time to go to bed... Attached Thumbnails

7th April 2004	#13
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	nearly there... Attached Thumbnails

7th April 2004	#15
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	case closed... a big case... Attached Thumbnails

7th April 2004	#16
bassmac Lives for gear Joined: Jun 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 683	Nice job! Let us know how it sounds.

10th April 2004	#17
Geert van den Berg Mac Moderator Joined: May 2003 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 3,454 Thread Starter	I am not yet started to build, but am still thinking about it. Preben thanks for making those pics! I am also interested in how it works out for you. I found a review of the Randall Iso-cab at Harmony Central and it didn't gave it a very positive review. So I'd better try to make something myself. MDF and a Celestion aren't that expensive.

14th April 2004	#18
magnetic Gear Head Joined: Mar 2004 Location: Burbank, CA. Posts: 69	I turned a 'spare' closet into a "CHAMBER OF ROCK" Its got a floating floor/ 3 layers of drywall on all walls and cieling; and fits a 4x12 or even a person that you want to shut up. (or record vox) I cut 'lil holes for spkr/mic cables. I can crank up most except for the loudest amps and still track in the next room as long as I'm wearing extreme isolation headphones. It works pretty darn good. I'll post pics as soon as I can figure out how to. cost me a few hundred bucks and now all i have to do is hang my clothes in the shower but clothes are for sissies, right?

14th April 2004	#19
doorknocker Lives for gear Joined: Nov 2002 Location: Basel, Switzerland Posts: 6,206 1 Review written	To my ears, a speaker inside a small box produces a.... boxy sound. Getting a great electric guitar sound (player aside) is all about the interference between the pickups and the amp plus the ambience of the room, even when close micing at ball-busting levels. I never could get a really good sound by not being 'in the line of fire'. An o.k sound perhaps, but there's a completely different thing happening with the upper harmonics. IMHO, this is true not just for 'singing', sustained tones but also for cleaner sounds. I read an interview with Daniel Lanois where he talked about this and mentioned Neil Young as a prime example. It's also way more fun. Andi __________________ 'Ever since the Supreme Court overturned the Snare Act, it has been legal to use any mic you like on snare.' - joeq http://www.doorknocker.ch/

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16th April 2004	#21
zenfreud Gear Head Joined: Oct 2002 Location: USA Posts: 46	Preben, thanks for the pictures and explanation about your guitar iso cab. Man, every time I think I'm a total gear fiend, I see something on this site or elsewhere on the internet that blows me away with the level of thought and expense that went behind it. Way cool. I owned a Folded Space brand Micro Room iso cab and it just did not work for me. For those who don't know this box, it used a small woofer (6", 8", don't remember) but otherwise was similar in concept to the Demeter iso cab. The designer padded down the level and used the smaller driver for the sake of keeping the box really quiet to the outside world. Perhaps they went too far in that direction. Though it allowed for true speaker breakup and output section/speaker mojo, there was a 'honkiness' in the mids that I just could not dial out with eq. The other thing that others have already pointed out is that the player totally loses the speaker/string feedback interaction. Preben, have you had a chance to use your creation yet? If so, does it deliver the tone? I guess I'm wondering how big the internal dimensions of an iso cab need to be to minimize or eliminate the boxiness I experienced with my tiny iso cab. I mean, if you've got the room, it would be just as easy to make the thing another foot or two deeper, right? I also don't want to bother the neighbors so am wondering how loud this box is on the outside. I may build a box within a box if the tone warrants the trouble. I really want to be careful about exposure to high spl's for the sake of tone, so an effective iso box would be a godsend. Any others who have built even larger iso cabs care to chime in? Thanks to all.

23rd April 2004	#22
magnetic Gear Head Joined: Mar 2004 Location: Burbank, CA. Posts: 69	Okay, here's the photos (in no particular chronological order)of my closet turned into an iso-chamber.

23rd April 2004	#23
shikawkee Lives for gear Joined: Oct 2003 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 1,010	I built a computer iso box recently and it can be a challenge (though it works). Eric 'Roscoe' Ambel uses a compact little guitar iso box that sounds boss. I think he built it himself. Maybe at his studio site ? (Cowboy Technical Services or EricAmbel.com probably) __________________ "Lend me some sugar, I am your neighbor"- Andre 3000

31st July 2004	#24
preben Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 901	I have now lived with and used my iso-box for quite some time now and I will be posting a 'state of affairs' statement very shortly. Did anyone else go ahead and build something similar and what are your experiences..??

31st July 2004	#25
Kyle Ashley Lives for gear Joined: Oct 2003 Location: Tampa Bay/Cape Fear NC Posts: 1,041	I hung moving blankets around my mic'd Marshall cab back in the 80s when playing small clubs and it burned up all 4 speakers. That's when I learned the expensive lesson that ventilation is very important when running at high levels for a period of time. Looking at your iso box, and for that matter, any iso boxes, makes me wonder how the speakers can survive long sessions. __________________ Kyle Ashley www.kyleashley.com

1st August 2004	#26
remo Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2004 Location: Melbourne Posts: 548	heres a link on iso booths i found http://www.amptone.com/isolationboxes.htm theres always the option of really small but sweet sounding amps that you can crank and not worry about complaints and blowen ear drums... check out the vox brian may.. this is a little screamer (ignore the mp3 demo), and it's prob cheaper than buying the wood etc for an iso cabinet. You can stick it in a room so you can experiment with mike placement (hard in an iso cabinet). You can also stick some ambience mikes around etc.. http://www.voxamps.co.uk/products/brianMay.htm there are heaps of boutique recording amps around as well...