Yamaha n Series

[trock]

yeah its funny you ask, i just looked at it last night while recording.

i find when i mix i get some pops and crackles at 128 so setting it to 256 or mostly 512 takes all that away to.

[soundrage]

Originally Posted by trock

yeah its funny you ask, i just looked at it last night while recording.

i find when i mix i get some pops and crackles at 128 so setting it to 256 or mostly 512 takes all that away to.

Same here. I'll set mine to 512 to mix then forget to set it back and I really don't notice the latency at 512 during tracking.

[trock]

see thats funny, its because of the latency i get at 512 that i am reminded to set it back to 128 for tracking :)

especially when i record a guitar part thru my POD

[wakestyle]

Originally Posted by trock

yeah its funny you ask, i just looked at it last night while recording.

i find when i mix i get some pops and crackles at 128 so setting it to 256 or mostly 512 takes all that away to.

crackles and pops are BAD.

Perhaps your cpu is being stressed too much?

what about 64 buffers anyone try it?

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by wakestyle

crackles and pops are BAD.

Perhaps your cpu is being stressed too much?

what about 64 buffers anyone try it?

You CAN use 64 but I don't think you will really hear the difference between
64 and 128. Good question though.. :-)

[trock]

i sure hope not, its a quad core q6600 oc'd and audio tweaked with 4 gigs of ram and fast HD's

hey george do you still have those pics of 2 n12's? they seem to be taken down when i go back to that thread, i am close to getting another one.

that being said, if/when i get the other one, can you give me the exact steps to configure it to work with the first one? which driver? how to maybe setup a template in cubase etc? and what will work on the first and not on the slave? such as cubase transport ettc?

with 2 can i use 4 heaphones? or 4 sets of speakers? not that i would but how does the aux work with 2 etc?

does yamaha have any instructions on using 2 or even 3?

thanks!

[sirthought]

That's a good question, Trock.
If you have two n12's connected, do you have extra (different) Aux mixes available?

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by trock

i sure hope not, its a quad core q6600 oc'd and audio tweaked with 4 gigs of ram and fast HD's

hey george do you still have those pics of 2 n12's? they seem to be taken down when i go back to that thread, i am close to getting another one.

that being said, if/when i get the other one, can you give me the exact steps to configure it to work with the first one? which driver? how to maybe setup a template in cubase etc? and what will work on the first and not on the slave? such as cubase transport ettc?

with 2 can i use 4 heaphones? or 4 sets of speakers? not that i would but how does the aux work with 2 etc?

does yamaha have any instructions on using 2 or even 3?

thanks!

Originally Posted by sirthought

That's a good question, Trock.
If you have two n12's connected, do you have extra (different) Aux mixes available?

The AI driver only supports 1 n12 so you will need the mLAN Driver that supports more than 1 device.

PC Now
MAC end of AUGUST

That said..... Oh Boy... More routing .....

There is a component of the mLAN system called the Graphic patchbay.
It supports 32 Inputs and 32 outputs to the computer.
So 2 in parallel to the computer is all you can connect.
You can cross connect them in very creative ways... More later, maybe tomorrow (It's deep)

mLAN sees the 1st device the same as AI and connects all I/O and will light the Cubase Ready as before.

What other fine gifts do we have for playing along? .....

You could connect 6 Pairs of speakers...
Aux 1 and aux 2 ... You Bet
Dual transports in 2 different places... Yep

It's available and up to you what you want with the second set of Outputs 1-6
2 DAW outs to the n12s
2 Rec Buses
2 ST buses
2 Aux sends Analog which are tied to Aux send from DAW too

I am not sure about the "Wet" function on the second machine, I'll check tomorrow

That's a good starting place..

[cflo]

Great thread!

George,

I'm using Nuendo 4 with a Firestudio. I've been looking to upgrade for a while (or at least find something that doesn't hiss constantly) and thought the N12 would be a nice fit for me. Then I read about the new MR816 CSX coming out soon. Am I to understand that it's basicly the N12 in a rack (as far as pre's, sweet spot morphing, rev-x) with hardware based VST?

I noticed you said that it does not have the same drivers, and I also noticed that it's branding is Steinberg. Is it a Yamaha product? I guess I would feel a little better if it said Yamaha on it, but if it's all the same components inside, that's ok too. I know there is a bit of difference in the way you would route and mix (ITB vs OTB etc), but I'll look into all that more when I have all the information.

I like the idea of moving back to a board layout, but I've gotten pretty used to everything being in the rack too. Hmmm...

Any info you can shed on comparing the similarities, and differences of the two (N12 & MR816), would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Chris

[Geosync]

Am I to understand that it's basicly the N12 in a rack (as far as pre's, sweet spot morphing, rev-x) with hardware based VST?

Yes


I noticed you said that it does not have the same drivers,

Yes but the n series will eventually use the same.... More info on that near year's end

I also noticed that it's branding is Steinberg. Is it a Yamaha product?

Same designers, but the MR's primary role is to provide a very tightly integrated system
DAW system for Steinberg... But..... The MR will work with any DAW, As a Nuendo user,
You will love the integration of either.

It doesn't matter if you are a total ITB person or not, you still must have Hardware to get the sound in... and hardware to monitor the results the better those pieces work in concert the better. Eventually, you can start with eithe the N or the MR and expand with the other, up to 3 devices..

3 MRs,
1 N12 and 2 MRs,
2 n12s and 1 MR,
1 n12, 1 MR and 1 Motif XS or Motif Rack XS w/ 1394 card...

Whew......



Any info you can shed on comparing the similarities, and differences of the two (N12 & MR816), would be greatly appreciated.


That's not possible.. the MR has not shipped.

Why choose, get one each.. One now and the other for Christmas drivers will be available shortly after I hear ;-)

[MichaelPatrick]

George,

I'm thinking of feeding an external multitrack recorder that has 10K load on each channel's input.

Can each NS12 channel drive an external 10K load, in addition to the internal converter, when I tap the insert jacks?

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by MichaelPatrick

George,

I'm thinking of feeding an external multitrack recorder that has 10K load on each channel's input.

Can each NS12 channel drive an external 10K load, in addition to the internal converter, when I tap the insert jacks?

The insert path is high impedance, so it should work like a charm.

[MichaelPatrick]

Originally Posted by Geosync

The insert path is high impedance, so it should work like a charm.

Yes, the spec is 10K ohms, but since there are two ways to look at the same question, I'm also curious about the line driver's load capacity.

The total load to the n12's line driver would be 5K ohms (10K converter + 10K ext recorder). Assuming stable loads, how big a load (low impedance) can it go without problems?

[cflo]

Thanks George, that's good information.

I guess I hadn't really thought too much about using the MR816 with an N12, but that does seem like a good expansion option. And you are right, I love the idea of finally having hardware that integrates tightly with Cubase/Nuendo.

Now I'm interested to see the pricing on the MR boxes when they come out.

Chris

[MichaelPatrick]

One more Q: What is the analog gain in dB from XLR mic input to Insert Out?

I'm wondering if it'll handle low output mics, i.e. dynamics and ribbons.

[smoke]

Trying to do a HW mix from Cubase. Each N12 channel is a VSTi, but the send FX within Cubase are routed through the N12 Stereo L/R, since I ran out of busses. Is this possible? It sounds like it's accepting the FX signal through the Stereo buss, but when I record to REC BUSS, the FXs arent there? Does the REC BUSS record incoming signal to the Stereo Buss, while recording the N12 channels?

I also tried to set the audio input to the Stereo buss, but then the recording level depended on the Stereo fader, which I don't want.

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by MichaelPatrick

One more Q: What is the analog gain in dB from XLR mic input to Insert Out?

I'm wondering if it'll handle low output mics, i.e. dynamics and ribbons.

I do not have the tech specs you should get those from
our support guys HERE

They can give you the numbers. The preamps themselves have a lot of gain enough to drive old ribbon microphones like the RCA.

Quick Question?

Are you planning to use the insert returns as tape inputs?

Send me a PM with your number and maybe we can chat about it.
I assume this is for the school

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by smoke

Trying to do a HW mix from Cubase. Each N12 channel is a VSTi, but the send FX within Cubase are routed through the N12 Stereo L/R, since I ran out of busses. Is this possible? It sounds like it's accepting the FX signal through the Stereo buss, but when I record to REC BUSS, the FXs arent there? Does the REC BUSS record incoming signal to the Stereo Buss, while recording the N12 channels?

I also tried to set the audio input to the Stereo buss, but then the recording level depended on the Stereo fader, which I don't want.

Sent you a PM

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by Geosync

I am not sure about the "Wet" function on the second machine, I'll check tomorrow

.

The second n12 will act the same as it does with other non-Cubase DAWs.
Only the 5 transport buttons function

All of the audio capabilities are doubled

[lazi]

meant to chime in a while ago...

haven't had much time with them but i have both of my n12's up and running. i also have a 01v96 and xs6 both with the mlan cards. i haven't put the xs6 in the mix just yet but the amount of options is staggering. the fact that i can keep them all hooked up and just change my routing via the software is very nice. currently just the n12's but i did try a setup with the 01v96 and n12 as my input devices and the n12's as my output devices. hotness!!! still will want more inputs as quite a few pieces of my gear have multiple outs which i will want to use. well over 32...

so as i keep going my questions right now are if instead of the 2 device limit with the mlan driver will the mr driver allow for 3 device simultaneously and will there still be a patchbay program? how many inputs will the mr driver allow? will this driver work with the 01v96? i think that was answered a few posts back but i'm hopeful. i guess it'll still be nice to have the (2) n12's and the xs6 running together anyways so things are looking good. if the 2 n12's and mr are possible then i may get the mr and use 01v96 to send adat. another possibilty is a newer mac, adat card in the 01v, and a m-audio lightbridge so i could run m-powered protools if i wanted to.

i was tempted by logic but once i saw the integration between the n12's and cubase 4 i'm back on board. i have both cubase lights on my n12's but not both sets of transport controls working. they actually did at one point but i have no idea why. i would also like to use the 01v's control surface feature via mlan (without the audio) but i haven't thought far enough into how to accomplish this yet. i also haven't quite gotten a grip on the wet feature. i also hope the work mode buttons become user programmable at some point.

wish the n12's had a plate to attach them together. will probably drill out a plate that can attach to existing screws on the bottoms. i'd hate to just stick with velcro and leave a gap. will see....

and to top it off i will soon have my msp7's set up for 5.1. loving everything so far.

[soundrage]

Originally Posted by Geosync

The second n12 will act the same as it does with other non-Cubase DAWs.
Only the 5 transport buttons function

All of the audio capabilities are doubled

George,

How does the driver show inputs and outputs in Cubase? Will it show channels 1-12 on the first n12 then chan's 13 through 24 for the next n12?

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by soundrage

George,

How does the driver show inputs and outputs in Cubase? Will it show channels 1-12 on the first n12 then chan's 13 through 24 for the next n12?

No
1-16 on the first one Chan 1-12, Rec1(13-14), ST1 (15-16)
17-32 on the second one Chan 1-12( 17-28) Rec2 (29-30) ST2 (31-32)

[soundrage]

Originally Posted by Geosync

No
1-16 on the first one Chan 1-12, Rec1(13-14), ST1 (15-16)
17-32 on the second one Chan 1-12( 17-28) Rec2 (29-30) ST2 (31-32)

Ah yes, that makes sense. I wasn't thinking about the all important buses.

[Geosync]

instead of the 2 device limit with the mlan driver will the mr driver allow for 3 device simultaneously?

mLAN is not a 2 device limit...
Imagine sending 16 outs of the MotifXS into the 01v96's mLAN inputs (no computer inputs used)
Assign the 8 buses of the 01V96 to the Digital inputs of 2 N12s.
01V 4 Bus Outs 1-4 to n12#1 channel input 9-12
01V 4 Bus Outs 5-8 to n12#1 channel input 9-12
STILL NO COMPUTER INPUTS !!

Now connect the 2 n12s as normal (32 Inputs....)

When you toggle the DAW / A.IN button on the channel strip , you are switching between the 1394 input and the Analog Input. If you connect 24 Computer outputs to the channel strips, you will still have 8 outs to send any way you want to the 2 n12s.........

Whew...... That's VERY deep but possible....

We are trying to market the n12 as an easy-to-use
1 to 1 mixer with Cubase, but you see, it can get deep if you are patient and are willing to make your own templates for BOTH the Graphic Patchbay AND Cubase.
By reloading either your whole studio was just rewired with the click of a button.
or it can be a very simple 1-to 1 setup

Part 2

Yes the MR Driver will support
3 devices @ 44.1/48K
2 devices @ 88.2/96K

will there still be a patchbay program?
No parallel Ins and outs


how many inputs will the mr driver allow?
48 @ 44.1/48K
32 @ 96K

will this driver work with the 01v96?

No the MY16mLAN card is not compatible with the MR Driver, but the MR816 has ADAT I/O which CAN work with the 01V96 Built-in ADAT.

another possibilty is a newer mac, adat card in the 01v, and a m-audio lightbridge so i could run m-powered protools if i wanted to.

You can run the MR in stand-alone mode and use the Preamps and send them to the lightbridge....

i have both cubase lights on my n12's but not both sets of transport controls working. they actually did at one point but i have no idea why.

You simply add a second mackie control in your device setup, assign the correct midi in/out.... Done


i would also like to use the 01v's control surface feature via mlan (without the audio) but i haven't thought far enough into how to accomplish this yet.

Don't try mLAN .. The MY is an audio bus, just use USB.. done

I'm exhausted..... That's a deep system....

BTW...

We really appreciate you using Yamaha and will do our best to help you get the most from it.

Thanks...

[trock]

dang george, do you get any sleep?

i hope someone up top at yamaha knows what you have been doing here, the N series could have come out and died a slow death or never been nearly as exciting without you here supporting it. as it is, its such a great product and i think you are almost solely responsible for it taking off. so hopefully there will be a ncie xmas bonus in there for you

and thanks for all the great help, this kind of reminds me of Reaper with Justin or SAW with Bob, one person, supporting their product except.......ITS YAMAHA A HUGE CORPORATION!

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by trock

dang george, do you get any sleep?

i hope someone up top at yamaha knows what you have been doing here, the N series could have come out and died a slow death or never been nearly as exciting without you here supporting it. as it is, its such a great product and i think you are almost solely responsible for it taking off. so hopefully there will be a ncie xmas bonus in there for you

and thanks for all the great help, this kind of reminds me of Reaper with Justin or SAW with Bob, one person, supporting their product except.......ITS YAMAHA A HUGE CORPORATION!

Thanks for those nice comments.
Hopefully, you proud owners of the "n" will spread the word.

[wakestyle]

Originally Posted by Geosync

Assign the 8 buses of the 01V96 to the Digital inputs of 2 N12s.
01V 4 Bus Outs 1-4 to n12#1 channel input 9-12
01V 4 Bus Outs 5-8 to n12#1 channel input 9-12
STILL NO COMPUTER INPUTS !!

huh??

Is that a typo? Which digital inputs?

[Geosync]

Originally Posted by wakestyle

huh??

Is that a typo? Which digital inputs?

You need 2 mLAN devices... They will cross connect
the 1394 or DAW input is digital ;-)