NIN: Super Stereo Chorus Sound?

DarkEcho · 19th June 2007, 07:25 AM

Two songs in particular that I am going to refer to, the song "Wish" on the NIN album "Broken", and the song "We're in this together" off of the first of the two "Fragile" disks. The guitar (possibly synth) sounds enormous, very wide, but not like two signals panned, it sounds like its all encompasing, like from every angle. I am not sure what this effect is, or how to reproduce it... does anyone know?

also, are those even guitars, or synths? or a combo of both?

what do I need to buy to do this.

narco · 19th June 2007, 07:44 AM

I don't have a copy on me so I can't help, but that "broken" ep is one of the few recordings that I really consider a work of art

if you buy trent reznor you could probably do it

narco

Paddlepop lion · 19th June 2007, 02:03 PM

Yeah I can't help you there mate, but I also love that sound.

cheers mate!

bobwarren · 19th June 2007, 02:38 PM

I beleive in those days Trent used a guitar directly into a Zoom 9030 and layered his gtr's with synths.

On a side note: Why doesn't D.O.D. or BOSS make a TREZNOR or T-REZ or 9" SNAIL stomp box that does the same thing? Hmmm, I wonder if Line6 has a NIN model to download on the user website for the good ole PODxt?

blakeq · 23rd June 2007, 06:46 PM

It's probably guitar layered with synths.

He also processed his signals with alot of gear, in particular I remember reading an interview with him where he was talking about layering tons of guitar tracks and processing them in Turbosynth to get those awesome guitar sounds on Broken...

Froombosch · 23rd June 2007, 06:52 PM

plaes post a small clip so we can hear what you are searching for...

jDresnin · 25th June 2007, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkEcho

Two songs in particular that I am going to refer to, the song "Wish" on the NIN album "Broken", and the song "We're in this together" off of the first of the two "Fragile" disks. The guitar (possibly synth) sounds enormous, very wide, but not like two signals panned, it sounds like its all encompasing, like from every angle. I am not sure what this effect is, or how to reproduce it... does anyone know?

also, are those even guitars, or synths? or a combo of both?

what do I need to buy to do this.

I can't find the interview, but i remember reading that the chorus of Were In This Together had literally 46 tracks of guitars, or something ridiculous like that, i know it was over 40... For the Broken sound, just google "Broken guitar interview nin" - that topic has been beaten to death.

If you want to sound like Trent, just do what he does.. have a pristine high quality signal chain, hire an unbelievably talented producer and send your records off to world renowned mastering facilities.. Oh, and don't forget to write brilliant music.

Here's a start:

http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_alan_moulder_trident/

bcgood · 26th June 2007, 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobwarren

On a side note: Why doesn't D.O.D. or BOSS make a TREZNOR or T-REZ or 9" SNAIL stomp box that does the same thing? Hmmm, I wonder if Line6 has a NIN model to download on the user website for the good ole PODxt?

Nice!

You should be their head of marketing.

bcgood

WestBerliner · 13th July 2007, 08:28 PM

you mentioned We're In This Together. from what I remember, they layered some insane number of guitar tracks for that song.. I think it was somewhere around 70 or 90... i'll look around and try and find that interview... :)

JDN · 14th July 2007, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobwarren

I beleive in those days Trent used a guitar directly into a Zoom 9030 and layered his gtr's with synths.

bingo...you're totally right...I still have my 9030 and I remember trent was always a big fan of direct amp sims(as I was too) WAY before the pod. It cracks me up the way nobody caught on to any of this pre pod...there were plenty out there.

anyway, in several interviews trent talks about the 9030 for broken and if you own one it's instantely obvious. FYI, I also think he had a trick of recording layering guitars at either double speed or half speed for a thicker sound....(Pro tools can at least record at half speed...not sure about double). with pretty much all NIN guitars though...it's all about layering...there was no magic guitar or magic amp sim for any one song

DarkEcho · 15th July 2007, 07:43 PM

what do you mean recording at double or half speed?

if you recorded at half speed, wouldnt your guitar shift up an octave if you doubled it, and conversley, if you recorded twice as fast and slowed it down, it would shift the octave down?

MikeMitchell · 15th July 2007, 08:00 PM

Correct. I've got the interview around here somewhere saved, it was on 'broken'. Guitar was recorded at double tape speed and octave up. Once slowed down it sounds stunted and fked up, pretty cool. Really noticable on the second track.
mike

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkEcho

what do you mean recording at double or half speed?

if you recorded at half speed, wouldnt your guitar shift up an octave if you doubled it, and conversley, if you recorded twice as fast and slowed it down, it would shift the octave down?

DarkEcho · 15th July 2007, 09:56 PM

sounds really cool, but how would you ever be able to reproduce that sound live?

would it be possible to make some sort of patch out of it and play a midi guitar into it? haha

JDN · 16th July 2007, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkEcho

sounds really cool, but how would you ever be able to reproduce that sound live?

would it be possible to make some sort of patch out of it and play a midi guitar into it? haha

the last several years, trent hasn't been so interested in capturing the studio sound live, but rather hiring competent musicians to interprit and add new life to his songs...which is far different than the obsessive trent of the past that would bitch or fire a drummer if the fill wasn't played EXACTLY like on the CD.

I think Arron North, his current lead gtr player is awesome...great sound and stage pressence. you can certainly search for articles about his gear and philosophy with NIN

Daniel Antix · 16th July 2007, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jDresnin

I can't find the interview, but i remember reading that the chorus of Were In This Together had literally 46 tracks of guitars, or something ridiculous like that, i know it was over 40... For the Broken sound, just google "Broken guitar interview nin" - that topic has been beaten to death.

If you want to sound like Trent, just do what he does.. have a pristine high quality signal chain, hire an unbelievably talented producer and send your records off to world renowned mastering facilities.. Oh, and don't forget to write brilliant music.

Here's a start:

Alan Moulder: FROM TRIDENT TO NINE INCH NAILS

46 gtr tracks rings a bell with me too.

undermind · 16th July 2007, 08:53 AM

The tone itself doesn't come from 46 guitars.

It WAS done live and with a real guitar. Just check out that Woodstock (from '94 I believe) and watch their guitarist covered with mud. While Trent's kicking his ass and entangling him with cords he's making "the tone".

Kyle S · 16th July 2007, 09:06 AM

i used to play Last all the time through my V-amp with a SD JB birdge. Got pretty close i would say espeically if you layered it.

JDN · 16th July 2007, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by undermind

The tone itself doesn't come from 46 guitars.

It WAS done live and with a real guitar. Just check out that Woodstock (from '94 I believe) and watch their guitarist covered with mud. While Trent's kicking his ass and entangling him with cords he's making "the tone".

too bad woodstock 94 was 5 years before "we're in this together" or you might have a point. robin fink was the guitar player you are refering too, and even the song you are talking about sounds very different than the CD(you're probably talking about happiness in slavery, but you obviously aren't much of a NIN fan)

DarkEcho · 16th July 2007, 03:59 PM

I want to experiment with layering three guitar takes, one half speed an octave lower, one twice the speed an octave higher, and one normal, then speed up the half speed, slow down the 2x and layer all three and see what the hell happens!

do you think this will produce different results than if I just played the part an octave low and an octave high and pitch shifted it later? or is the actual wave lenghts being stretched and compressed where the interesting stuff comes from?

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19th June 2007, 07:25 AM	#1
DarkEcho Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: California Posts: 1,665	NIN: Super Stereo Chorus Sound? Two songs in particular that I am going to refer to, the song "Wish" on the NIN album "Broken", and the song "We're in this together" off of the first of the two "Fragile" disks. The guitar (possibly synth) sounds enormous, very wide, but not like two signals panned, it sounds like its all encompasing, like from every angle. I am not sure what this effect is, or how to reproduce it... does anyone know? also, are those even guitars, or synths? or a combo of both? what do I need to buy to do this.

19th June 2007, 07:44 AM	#2
narco Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Switzerland/New Zealand/guitar case Posts: 3,462	I don't have a copy on me so I can't help, but that "broken" ep is one of the few recordings that I really consider a work of art if you buy trent reznor you could probably do it narco __________________ The last thing for me to sell! FS: Mytek 896 D-A + exp card (located in new zealand) - will ship worldwide

23rd June 2007, 06:52 PM	#6
Froombosch Gear addict Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Froombosch Posts: 383	plaes post a small clip so we can hear what you are searching for... __________________ Harrie Munnik Studio Froombosch on My Space

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19th June 2007, 02:03 PM	#3
Paddlepop lion Gear maniac Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: middle of nowhere Australia Posts: 158	Yeah I can't help you there mate, but I also love that sound. cheers mate!

19th June 2007, 02:38 PM	#4
bobwarren Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 720	I beleive in those days Trent used a guitar directly into a Zoom 9030 and layered his gtr's with synths. On a side note: Why doesn't D.O.D. or BOSS make a TREZNOR or T-REZ or 9" SNAIL stomp box that does the same thing? Hmmm, I wonder if Line6 has a NIN model to download on the user website for the good ole PODxt?

23rd June 2007, 06:46 PM	#5
blakeq Gear Head Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 44	It's probably guitar layered with synths. He also processed his signals with alot of gear, in particular I remember reading an interview with him where he was talking about layering tons of guitar tracks and processing them in Turbosynth to get those awesome guitar sounds on Broken...

13th July 2007, 08:28 PM	#9
WestBerliner Gear Head Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: canada Posts: 35	you mentioned We're In This Together. from what I remember, they layered some insane number of guitar tracks for that song.. I think it was somewhere around 70 or 90... i'll look around and try and find that interview... :)

15th July 2007, 07:43 PM	#11
DarkEcho Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: California Posts: 1,665	what do you mean recording at double or half speed? if you recorded at half speed, wouldnt your guitar shift up an octave if you doubled it, and conversley, if you recorded twice as fast and slowed it down, it would shift the octave down?

15th July 2007, 09:56 PM	#13
DarkEcho Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: California Posts: 1,665	sounds really cool, but how would you ever be able to reproduce that sound live? would it be possible to make some sort of patch out of it and play a midi guitar into it? haha

16th July 2007, 08:53 AM	#16
undermind Gear addict Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Puget Sound, WA Posts: 434	The tone itself doesn't come from 46 guitars. It WAS done live and with a real guitar. Just check out that Woodstock (from '94 I believe) and watch their guitarist covered with mud. While Trent's kicking his ass and entangling him with cords he's making "the tone".

16th July 2007, 09:06 AM	#17
Kyle S Lives for gear Join Date: May 2007 Location: Tusc/Bham AL Posts: 647	i used to play Last all the time through my V-amp with a SD JB birdge. Got pretty close i would say espeically if you layered it.

16th July 2007, 03:59 PM	#19
DarkEcho Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: California Posts: 1,665	I want to experiment with layering three guitar takes, one half speed an octave lower, one twice the speed an octave higher, and one normal, then speed up the half speed, slow down the 2x and layer all three and see what the hell happens! do you think this will produce different results than if I just played the part an octave low and an octave high and pitch shifted it later? or is the actual wave lenghts being stretched and compressed where the interesting stuff comes from?