Login / Register
 
Outboard gear for the master buss with Protools.
New Reply
Subscribe
jameslugo
Thread Starter
#1
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #1
Gear maniac
 
jameslugo's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 174

Thread Starter
jameslugo is offline
Outboard gear for the master buss with Protools.

I'm tracking & mixing with a Protools Mix 6 (1 core, 5 Farm cards) with an apogee convertor. I have a nice bunch of pres for tracking, Chandler LTD-1, BA 312's, Avalon 737's etc.. and we are getting good sounds. We mainly do modern rock, John Mayer style to Korn and everything in between.

I want to get the mixes harder and warmer sounding, would a 2 track unit on the master bus be good: ala Fatso, Hedd, Alan Smart. I want to get a better sound but I'm not in a financial position right now to go down the analog summing highway.

My producer used a matched pair of 737's on the master bus last week, for some compression and EQ, and did not like it, he said it sounded soft. Right now we are using plug-ins: TC X5, +L1, C4.

Is it not worth messing with this thought and just waiting till I can move into an analog summing situation or Protools HD?

p.s. I have a pair of Distressors, would they work on the master bus? Click here to see what I have going on gear wise: http://www.jameslugo.com/recording_studio.shtml

This website has really helped me to learn and make good choices on buying gear, Gearslutz works! Thanks
__________________
James Lugo
Vocal Asylum
6381 Hollywood Blvd. Suite 700
Los Angeles, CA 90028
323.462.4722
http://www.VocalAsylum.com
#2
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #2
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: New York City
Posts: 14,175

thethrillfactor is offline
Not to be the bad guy, but definitely do a search on this.

Its been beaten to .


jameslugo
Thread Starter
#3
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #3
Gear maniac
 
jameslugo's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 174

Thread Starter
jameslugo is offline
I did do a search, it just didn't really clear it up. Maybe I'm not getting what's being said. I think this maybe a job for some one on one consultation? Sorry about this subject...
#4
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #4
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: New York City
Posts: 14,175

thethrillfactor is offline
Quote:
Originally posted by jameslugo
I did do a search, it just didn't really clear it up. Maybe I'm not getting what's being said. I think this maybe a job for some one on one consultation? Sorry about this subject...
Its cool.

Look under 2 buss comp, favorite 2 buss comp. favorite mixbuss comp.

My personal opinion is if you want your mixes harder and warmer, a 2 buss comp,analog summing buss and 1/2" may get you only 5% there.

I think a great mixing engineer will get you to the other 95%.

But since nowadays so many people on the forumn are hell bent on doing everything themselves (right through the mastering), this kinda of advice falls on deaf ears.

That's where the market for all of these mixbuss solutions have become the fancy.
TML
#5
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #5
TML
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,088

TML is offline
Slugo-
I agree with Thrill. Most of the warmth and punch is from the mixing. The forums are a great help in one respect...you get to pick up some new ideas and validate some of your own. On the other hand they become a means for people to push products and spin gear so much you feel the need to buy the best coverters, pres and mics money can buy. That said...I think the Mayer/Korn stuff was done on Radar/PT(Mayer) PT(Korn) There was a good article a bunch of months back on John Algia...(check spelling) in eq. Mayer was done on Radar...there you go...the so called warm..fat converters....Korns latest...I think the beds were analog...check the Fillipetti thread...everyones bashing his mic technique but we all would B#@w him to work on a few of his gigs...or maybe that's just me............I like my ssl 384 for extra kick on mixes....just a little...its kinda brightens things alittle...I have used the fatso on the 2 bus to smooth out a mix that I may have gotten a little 6k heavy and there wasn't time to do a complete overhaul.....I also own a HEDD. They all do something to help...but they are not tape.....no freakin' way...they are nice tools..I did notice that my mixes opened up with a DAC-1. A benchmarh d/a converter that allows the mixe to open up..better field for making mixing decisions. You may wanna boot your 888 and get something better....ie..a/d converters.....also many folks are summing in analog...mixing out of a daw into an analog line mixer. Well..there you go...my pathetic opinion...back to time aligning drum overs and multiple snares for another pop punk band that will be an emo band next month...thanks "The Darkness".
Tim
jameslugo
Thread Starter
#6
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #6
Gear maniac
 
jameslugo's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 174

Thread Starter
jameslugo is offline
I'm not apposed to bringing in pros to mix, that's what I've been doing. I guess I just want to have the best gear for them to work with. Everytime we saddle up the horses and take our hard drives to a big studio, the studio has console problems (I f**kin' hate Trident 80B's) or something goes wrong. You know, studio owner on blow!fuuck

So I'm blessed with the etrepreneurial spirit, so I go nuts buying gear.

I guess the truth is I want that major label sound but I know my studio has been successful because I've not leased a console and gone that route. My over head is managable. I see my buddies with the big rigs and they are hurting bad. S**t Elektra and Universal have been working in my little one horse studio because it's affordable to develop mid priority artists. For every Alicia Keyes there's 1000 acts they don't want to send to Paramount. There's probably no point to all this, just the caffeine kicking in!!!

Thanks
thrillfactor
#7
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #7
Gear Guru
 
thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: New York City
Posts: 14,175

thethrillfactor is offline
Quote:
Originally posted by TML
Slugo-
That said...I think the Mayer/Korn stuff was done on Radar/PT(Mayer) PT(Korn) There was a good article a bunch of months back on John Algia...(check spelling) in eq. Mayer was done on Radar...there you go...the so called warm..fat converters...."
Tim
Didn't JJPuig mix John Mayer's stuff?
jameslugo
Thread Starter
#8
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #8
Gear maniac
 
jameslugo's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 174

Thread Starter
jameslugo is offline
Tim,
You rock! Thanks guys, that's what I needed! Until my next obsession...

J
jameslugo
Thread Starter
#9
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #9
Gear maniac
 
jameslugo's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 174

Thread Starter
jameslugo is offline
Slugo?

I haven't heard that one in a while. Makes me feel a part of the gang! Nuggies to all!
#10
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #10
More cowbell!
 
natpub's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2003
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 2,481

natpub is offline
what's to prevent you from "trying" your Distressors (or whatever else you have) on the mix bus?

im sure all the folk here have opionions on this or that, but experimentation has always been a foundation of musical creation

besides, following too many tried n true suggestions is a great way to have things end up sounding like everyone else


k
__________________
Sonic Sorcery Productions
Austin, Texas
#11
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #11
Lives for gear
 
bassmac's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 682

bassmac is offline
Quote:
Originally posted by natpub
besides, following too many tried n true suggestions is a great way to have things end up sounding like everyone else
As an artist, I couldn't agree more. But for a lot of people around here, their job is to give the bands what they want. Translation: make them sound like everybody else.

#12
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #12
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: Suffern, NY
Posts: 10,481

Fletcher is offline
Re: Outboard gear for the master buss with Protools.

Quote:
Originally posted by jameslugo
I want to get the mixes harder and warmer sounding, would a 2 track unit on the master bus be good: ala Fatso, Hedd, Alan Smart. I want to get a better sound but I'm not in a financial position right now to go down the analog summing highway.
Pretty much any/all of those will be "a sound"... whether or not that sound meets your criteria is a subjective question only you can answer... that said... probaby the least expensive way to address what it is you seem to want to addres is with the Crane Song LTD. Phoenix plugin.
__________________

CN Fletcher

Professional Affiliation:

R/E/P Professional Recording Engineer and Producer forums


mwagener wrote on Sat, 11 September 2004 14:33
We are selling emotions, there are no emotions in a grid

Roscoe Ambel once said:
Pro-Tools is to audio what fluorescent is to light
TML
#13
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #13
TML
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,088

TML is offline
Quote:
"Didn't JJPuig mix John Mayer's stuff?"
Thrill- Yeah ...I think JJP mixed it. John Algia produced it. He also did Jason Miraz.
Tim
jameslugo
Thread Starter
#14
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #14
Gear maniac
 
jameslugo's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 174

Thread Starter
jameslugo is offline
I'm going to give the Distressors a test drive on the bus. Good words from everyone.
#15
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #15
Lives for gear
 
NathanEldred's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: West Coast Central Florida
Posts: 8,330

Send a message via AIM to NathanEldred
NathanEldred is online now
Distressors on two bus? No way. Who said that sounded good? But everybody's mileage varies too.

Love 'em on single tracks or sub busses though just to clarify.


Also, my $.02....but putting "color" on a pro tools bus is just a band aid.

In particular without extremely accurate D/A conversion (ala Lavry, dCs, Weiss) for the actual audio chain. Otherwise you are running into a serious bottleneck there and IMO wasting your time, and it's not the place to skimp. From there I'd go into a 1/4" or 1/2" tape machine, Ampex or Studer. Otherwise, your fixing one problem and creating another.
__________________
Nathan Eldred
Visit Atlas Pro Audio
HH
#16
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #16
Lives for gear
 
doug_hti's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Calabasas, California
Posts: 1,142

doug_hti is offline
James,
something like a C2 can really bring some excitment to the table... i highly reccomend trying it. I use it over the mix bus maybe 1/10th of the time and only put it on towards the very end of a mix and only tickle the meters...and for some tracks...it really just makes mix even better...and then for sub-buses, it's amazing.

i have never had good luck with distressors on the mix bus.

I'm sure the fatso is useful
i'm sure the hedd is useful

but i wouldn't want to spend that much money on something that I couldn't really have a lot of control and use for unless I had all the bread and butter covered

If you have descent converters, I wouldn't throw money on more, even if they are 10% better, until you have everything else covered...

If you don't have a highly versatile world class 2 channel comp in your arsenal, I would put that on the top...not just for level control, but tone shaping... and you may lose desire for "warming" devices...

Also, sorry to pry, ,but how is your monitoring. After I got good (midrange revealing) monitors, my life and mixes changed incredibly. I didn't think I needed to upgrade, because I knew people making great stuff and lots of money on Events, and Tannoys, KRKs, but when I did (from KRK V6s and MSP5s) my world changed. So your results may vary and the people I know probably just have more talent to find the midrange on those smiley monitors...
but I have absolutely no desire for any analog "warming" devices now, as it goes through enough stuff on the way in and on the mix.
__________________
doug
jameslugo
Thread Starter
#17
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #17
Gear maniac
 
jameslugo's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 174

Thread Starter
jameslugo is offline
Hey Doug,

We're neigbors, I live in Woodland Hills. My monitoring is suspect, I have a pair of Behrenger Truth's, they sound cool but my buddy says they sound harsh and too boosted in the mids. So the financial assault continues.

James
#18
9th March 2004
Old 9th March 2004
  #18
Lives for gear
 
doug_hti's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Calabasas, California
Posts: 1,142

doug_hti is offline
Hey Cool, how bout this heat in March...
yeah, I PROMISE a LOT of your problems will go away if you step up the monitoring...even if that is a used pair of NS-10s...which I still think have a lot to offer, especially for the price. But if you can step into $3k...you can explore a few quality options and be set...
New Reply Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook  Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter  Submit Thread to LinkedIn LinkedIn  Submit Thread to Google+ Google+ 
 
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
jnorman / So much gear, so little time!
0
SurfingMusicMan / So much gear, so little time!
24
Bruce Swedien / Bruce Swedien
18
pingu / So much gear, so little time!
245

Forum Jump

SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.