My hi end audio confession.
no ssl yet
#1
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #1
no ssl yet
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My hi end audio confession.

Guys I have a confession to make and perhaps I'll learn something from you all in the process. I hear alot of guys talk about the sound of an EQ or this EQ (or comp) vs. That EQ (or comp).

I don't know if my audio knowledge is just weaker or perhaps it's my hearing. I'm just not one who can judge this unless it's an obvious difference. I think I kinda cheat. When I'm in a session I throw something on a source and fiddle with it. If I can get what I want. I stay with it. If I don't get what I want I fiddle with a different piece (or combination of pieces), till I get what I like.

From this process, I develop certain favorite combinations that I try first when I'm in a tight spot.

But, still I couldnt have a definitive answer for why one piece is better than another. I only know what pieces I've had success with.

Does this make sense?
#2
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #2
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makes perfect sense. no worries man!
#3
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #3
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gainreduction's Avatar
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no ssl yet View Post
Does this make sense?
Yes. Sounds like you focus on getting the results you want instead of beeing overly analytical about the gear you choose to use.

The end result is all that matters, many ways to get there.
#4
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #4
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Peter Simonsen's Avatar
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no ssl yet View Post

Does this make sense?
Yep, it sure does ;-)

Kind regards

Peter
#5
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #5
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from what i can tell, you are clearly insane. and desperately in need of counseling. this is the gear SLUTZ forum - if you are not interested in debating the esoteric minutia of GML vs manley pultec, you have no business here.

"I know 'no ssl yet', and he's no slut..." fletcher

:-)
#6
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #6
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meymia's Avatar
 
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I...DO....THE SAME THING...i love feeling...sometimes more then thinking
#7
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no ssl yet View Post
<SNIP>

But, still I couldnt have a definitive answer for why one piece is better than another. I only know what pieces I've had success with.

Does this make sense?
I think this is perfectly correct and bravo ssl for admiting the truth about it. Everyone starts somewhere! Listening is an art that is learned and practiced, not "given". Some people learn it quicker than others. Some people are born to it, others stuggle to hear details that are obvious to their peers. Its all OK, its about the music anyway and great music usually wins out over the quality of an EQ (I always think of Alanis Morisette's first record as proof of this-good music wins!).

Once you have a room or system you live with for 5 years, using the same stuff everyday, all day, you get to know it in ways you can't imagine. You hear things, small things and big things that you didn't notice the other 4,000 times you used that unit. You get to the point where you can tell instantly if phase is off a bit, a cable is going, a tube in that preamp is acting up, or if that EQ sounds different on the 1K boost setting than this other EQ. Then you can hear details that elude others IN THAT ROOM. That's how the golden ears get golden, they just know THAT system inside out and recognize even tiny changes made to it (new piece of gear, new cable, etc).

The other skill that aids in getting to this point is the ability to listen in a way that isolates one thing from everything else. Can you follow and hear JUST the one backing guitar (out of the 8 you used) for the entire song when listening to complete mix? And that subtle fret buzz on that one note that happens every now and then? That technique helps you zero in and listen critically.

I remember doing a demo with George Massenburg once for his dynamics controller and few in the audience could hear it work yet it was obvious to everyone doing the demo....

Critical listening will come with practice!
Brad

Last edited by Brad Lunde; 10th May 2007 at 06:14 PM.. Reason: sp
#8
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #8
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The differences between compressors and EQ's are much more obvious at extreme settings.
#9
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #9
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My Recordings/Credits

Quote:
Originally Posted by jnorman View Post
from what i can tell, you are clearly insane. and desperately in need of counseling. this is the gear SLUTZ forum - if you are not interested in debating the esoteric minutia of GML vs manley pultec, you have no business here.


:-)
You beat me to the joke.
no ssl yet
#10
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by max cooper View Post
The differences between compressors and EQ's are much more obvious at extreme settings.
Dont get me wrong I can hear the difference in when one piece isn't working on something and another is working.

I just don't have the abilities I see expressed here.


I always figured as long as my mixes sound good all was well.
#11
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #11
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How does one explain why they like apple pie better than cherry pie? Just know that you do.
#12
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #12
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NoSSL, your comments definately make sense. There's a lot of different hammers you can grab to drive a nail in and any of them will work. Over on your bench somewhere there just might be the "perfect" hammer, but if it's not handy, are you going to walk across the shop and dig thru a bunch of tools to find it - JUST - to drive in a simple nail? Of course not. We all tend to go to our tried and true favs or use what's readily available. What I sometimes try to do is go to something that I would normally never use and try it. That's the genesis of true learning and experimentation. Next time if you want to grow, try a different EQ and see if you can make it do what you want. You may be pleasantly surprised! If it's good - leave it. If it doesn't work, pull out your old standby. If you do one experimental EQ every time you need an EQ, you will end up becoming "intimate" with all your EQ's and will get a 6th sense for which EQ to use with any appropriate source.
#13
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #13
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There are probably people who swear they can tell, to the month, how old someone is by the sound of their farts

With gear and "sound" I think it is more important to know what you like and to trust that fact.
#14
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #14
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not_so_new's Avatar
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Lunde View Post
I think this is perfectly correct and bravo ssl for admiting the truth about it. Everyone starts somewhere! Listening is an art that is learned and practiced, not "given". Some people learn it quicker than others. Some people are born to it, others stuggle to hear details that are obvious to their peers. Its all OK, its about the music anyway and great music usually wins out over the quality of an EQ (I always think of Alanis Morisette's first record as proof of this-good music wins!).

Once you have a room or system you live with for 5 years, using the same stuff everyday, all day, you get to know it in ways you can't imagine. You hear things, small things and big things that you didn't notice the other 4,000 times you used that unit. You get to the point where you can tell instantly if phase is off a bit, a cable is going, a tube in that preamp is acting up, or if that EQ sounds different on the 1K boost setting than this other EQ. Then you can hear details that elude others IN THAT ROOM. That's how the golden ears get golden, they just know THAT system inside out and recognize even tiny changes made to it (new piece of gear, new cable, etc).

The other skill that aids in getting to this point is the ability to listen in a way that isolates one thing from everything else. Can you follow and hear JUST the one backing guitar (out of the 8 you used) for the entire song when listening to complete mix? And that subtle fret buzz on that one note that happens every now and then? That technique helps you zero in and listen critically.

I remember doing a demo with George Massenburg once for his dynamics controller and few in the audience could hear it work yet it was obvious to everyone doing the demo....

Critical listening will come with practice!
Brad
Great points Brad.

It took me many years before I could judge compressor attack and release settings and hear differences in ratios... hell, I still stumble on differences in ratios from time to time.

I think this is EXACTLY the reason why there are so many "what settings do you use" threads here at GS. There are lots and lots of folks who don't want to admit the just can't hear something in their room. It could be their gear, it could be their experience and it could be their room.... or all the above.

And how many people have never turned a knob or flipped a switch and things sound better only to find out that they have the unit bypassed?

LOL

Anyway, really getting to know your room and gear and putting years behind a console / DAW / set of speakers is where that last 1% comes from that separates the men from the boys. If it helps anyone reading, after 15 or so years of doing this I still feel like a boy most of the time.
no ssl yet
#15
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drBill View Post
NoSSL, your comments definately make sense. There's a lot of different hammers you can grab to drive a nail in and any of them will work. Over on your bench somewhere there just might be the "perfect" hammer, but if it's not handy, are you going to walk across the shop and dig thru a bunch of tools to find it - JUST - to drive in a simple nail? Of course not. We all tend to go to our tried and true favs or use what's readily available. What I sometimes try to do is go to something that I would normally never use and try it. That's the genesis of true learning and experimentation. Next time if you want to grow, try a different EQ and see if you can make it do what you want. You may be pleasantly surprised! If it's good - leave it. If it doesn't work, pull out your old standby. If you do one experimental EQ every time you need an EQ, you will end up becoming "intimate" with all your EQ's and will get a 6th sense for which EQ to use with any appropriate source.
I do this on the regular. I always experiment with new combinations. I'm always looking for new sounds.

But I'm simply not someone who can sit and try an EQ for a week and say another is EQ is a better EQ. I can say I couldnt' get anything to work with a particular EQ. But I very seldom get something that doesn't work. It may cause me to use something else with it to make it work, but I view this as doing what it takes to get the sound that's in my head.

Sometimes while in pursuit of that sound, a certain signal/gear combination will send me off to a tangent where I start searching for a different sound.
But I view this as akin to having a guitar player come in and play a part that has you changing some of the arrangement around it.

Again, (And forgive me but one of my favorite college professors always asked this question),
Does this make sense?

Sometimes, I read the guest mod spots and I get the feeling they don't have this professed ability either. It seems their stories add up to constant experimentation until they capture what they are chasing. (And these guys do some of the greatest mixes).
#16
10th May 2007
Old 10th May 2007
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no ssl yet View Post

Does this make sense?
That is how you develop the first thing you posted.
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