Acoustic Guitar Mics - Shure SM81 vs. Rode NT5 vs. Studio Projects C4 or any others

[Steve7]

I'm trying to find the best small diaphragm condensors for recording acoustic guitars, in the price range of around $500 or less for both. Can anyone tell me how these three microphones compare with each other - SM81, NT5, SP C4?

Are there any others in this price range that I should be considering?

[warhead]

Oktava MK-012
Avenson STO-2
sE Electronics SE3

all excel in this application as well.

War

[studio freak]

I´m using
AKG 451 B and Oktava 012 (mod version) but the stock version is also Ok

[jnorman]

i like the akg c391b and AT4041 in that price range. both are great mics for many kinds of applications.

[Steve7]

I think the AKG 451 is out of my price range. I'm looking at around $500 for a pair.

By the way, here is a sound clip of my guitar. It's a pretty dark sounding guitar already and it can get boomy when strummed, so I don't want a microphone that will make it any darker. So I'm looking for mics that would complement the guitars sound but make it a little cleaner and less bassy. This clip was recorded with brand new strings with a Studio Projects B1 around 10 inches away from the 12th fret.

http://www.1000daysonline.com/audio/acoustictest.wav

Thanks.

[Omicron_9]

Greetings.

Timely post, as I just picked up a new SM81 last week; so far have used it on three acoustic guitar sessions. I used to have a 451-B (reissue); didn't like it. For SDCs, my current favorite in this application is a KM-184. I have to say I am just loving the SM81. Very good detail with not a trace of harshness; very full and rich. Just my opinion based on my aesthetics (or lack of). I'm already thinking of the SM81 as a "secret weapon" mic for acoustic instruments.

Regards,
-0.9

[gsqd]

Steve,

After listening to your example I'd say you need sparkle at the top and control in the lower mids.

I'd start off, if it were me, with a 451 and see how it goes. Transients will sit "in" better, the high end will lift and smooth out and those pesky lower mids should fall in toward neutral again. You can get a 451 used for not a lot of money. In fact I recently bought another matched pair for 750US!

SM81's are great if your basic tone and room are great. If not then the good ole' 451 will solve a lot of single mic issues.

GM

[Steve7]

gsqd,

The problem is with my budget, I could either get one 451 or two sm81, or similar price pairs. I was wanting to record with two SDC.

[666666]

I recently did a drum overhead shootout with an assortment of good condenser mics... including SM81s, KM184s, some Schoeps, ATs, etc. The SM81s did surprisingly well. They had a very "natural" unhyped character, where as most of the other mics had varying degrees of upper-end "hype". Some of the other mics had perhaps a tad more "depth" and clarity, but the difference wasn't large enough for me to think of the SM81s as "lesser" mics... especially considering their nifty inherent natural character.

Overall, I was extremely impressed with the SM81s, especially considering they are less than half the cost of most other good popular SDCs. I'd say SM81s are the ultimate choice for those who are not able to spend more than $350 for a SDC. I do not own a pair at the moment... I already have a drawer full of other very worthy SDCs... but these SM81s are so neat I might just have to buy a pair. "Secret weapon" might indeed be an appropriate description for SM81s, especially for the low-budget crowd.

Another quick tip... the Langevin (Manley) pres (as found in the DVC) are also killer on overheads... nice natural earthy sound, very dynamic... they turned out to be the first pick of three different engineers in a blindfold test (against several other very high-end pres). Only problem is the gain adjust knobs have no detents, too low an effort, too sensitive... if you could swap in some better gain pots, these pre units would be seriously happening. I wonder if Manley would mod these if asked. They still work fine as is, I'm just being fussy. I have new found respect for my DVC.... extreme dollar to value deal.

For those on a super tight budget... just go out and get a pair of SM81s and a DVC... that should be your first purchase if you want great sounding stuff at a super low cost... IMO.

[bexarametric]

I've never tried my SM81'S on overheads (though I'm dying to). On acoustic, it sounds amazing. I highly recommend the SM81. There's nothing as good in the price range.

[Mondo]

are you sure you even want a pair of mics? i always want to at the beginning of a song, but in the end i ditch the 2nd mic and just go with one.

[gsqd]

Sorry Steve I did see the budget thing. If you want new then the SM81's are probably a good bet but they won't give you the reinforcement that the 451's will. Just a different sounding mic all together.

Cheers,

GM

[GearGeek]

Another vote for the SM81. A total workhorse for the money. I use two in an XY configuration for solo acoustic stuff and it sounds amazing! I agree- a total secret weapon. I have a mic locker with Neumann, AKG, Royer and the SM81 gets used quite a bit. I'm even going to try to use them for my piano and see how it sounds.

[DeeDrive]

I like the MKL 993 and MXL V67G on acoustic guitar better than the AT4050 / AKG C451 combo I used to use. I'm so confused now...

[pdlstl]

Originally Posted by jnorman

i like the akg c391b and AT4041 in that price range. both are great mics for many kinds of applications.

+1 on the 4041's!

[Steve7]

Seems like a lot of people like the Sm81's.

What about Rode NT5? Anyone have any experience with those?

[Classic]

I'm really happy with my Rode NT-5s at the price. Does the job well for acoustic guitar and drum overheads.

[Steve7]

I have heard that the Rode NT5 can sound dark. Can anyone confirm this?

What about the studio projects C4, has anyone tried that?

[Steve7]

Bump

Looking for a little more input on these mics before I pull the trigger on SM81's.

[bhp]

SM 81s are great mics. I guess the word is out.
This is one of the most under rated mics.
To me, they are a cross between a dynamic and a condenser.
In addition to acoustic guitar, they are great on acoustic bass for a very focused sound, great on percussion, and have amazing imaging as overheads.
budget is irrelevant, these are great mics.
They have much more body than a 451, etc.
(2) 81's are much better than (1) 451

SM 81s into Summit TPA-200B mic pres are a thing of beauty.
just a little yellow on the meter.

[uncle duncan]

For a dark guitar, the audio technica ATM450 would be good. It's less thick than my KM184, and brighter than my AT4051. Plus, it's got the side address thing happening, which seems to help rejection if you have it aimed right. And it's pretty darn inexpensive. Also has a lo-cut switch and a pad.

[Nu-tra]

I dig the NT4!!! perfect phase!

[stevie_vp]

I cant comment on the c4 but i do have the sp b1...
I really like this one.. bang for the buck..
heres a little clip.. with no eq and no mastering... only a little verb.
Did record with one mic but doubled up left and right as you can hear..
vocals are also b1...
/
s

http://www.switchbackmusic.nl/Stevie115.mp3

[blaugruen7]

the c4 mkII are brand new and still even not available here in germany.

i have ordered a pair.

they have a completly new inside and outside.

no sound reports from users.

warren? :-)

[magellan]

Originally Posted by Steve7

I have heard that the Rode NT5 can sound dark. Can anyone confirm this?

What about the studio projects C4, has anyone tried that?

not a fan of NT5's... found them to be somewhat harsh; don't recall them being dark; they were mainly used for drum overheads. i have a pair of C4s and think they are excellent mics for the money (acoustic guitars, cello, drum overheads, snare, room micing). my experiences with SM81's have always been good. if given a choice between these SDCs, i'd go with the SM81s. of course, i'm more of a fan of LDCs for most applications...!

[Steve7]

Originally Posted by stevie_vp

I cant comment on the c4 but i do have the sp b1...
I really like this one.. bang for the buck..
heres a little clip.. with no eq and no mastering... only a little verb.
Did record with one mic but doubled up left and right as you can hear..
vocals are also b1...
/
s

http://www.switchbackmusic.nl/Stevie115.mp3

Stevie vp,

That sounds amazing. What preamps are you using?

I have a b1 as well, I posted a clip of my guitar with a b1 on the first page of this thread. I am wanting to try 2 SDC mics.

[ThrillHo]

I think it's pretty non-controversial to say that good quality sounds are attainable from any number of these SDCs. I think anyone could take the mics mentioned previously, and with the right knowledge and ears, produce sellable material. And of course, source, source, source!!! That being said, I use the Peluso CEMC6 and like them.

-Ian

[mischultz]

You can also get the Shure KSM137 pair from Full Compass for *just* over $500. Little bit of a different sound from the 81, and I probably prefer it although I'd have a very hard time telling you why, exactly.

So 137, 81, 4041 would be a very safe grouping to choose from, depending on what floats your (sources') boat.

Michael

[stevie_vp]

Originally Posted by Steve7

Stevie vp,

That sounds amazing. What preamps are you using?

I have a b1 as well, I posted a clip of my guitar with a b1 on the first page of this thread. I am wanting to try 2 SDC mics.

Hey thanks! My preamps? e.. you dont wanna know.. is used a tascam us-122L I listended to your clip and it does sound nice but it has alot of "pressure" in the low mids... and misses the sparkle.. i saw that you miced
about 10 inches away? my clip was done about 2 to 3 inches from the 12th fret... but when i pull full chords like in your clip it also gets a little overpressured in the low mids...
must say that i do hear alot of good stories of the c4...
good luck with your search!
/
s

[Steve7]

Wow, I actually have a us122 laying around that I haven't used since I got my Firepod. That's pretty incredible that you are getting that sound out of a US122 and a SP B1. Good job.

What guitar are you using?