Gear on Electric Ladyland voodoo child (Hendrix)
Old 25th May 2007
  #31
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axisdreamer's Avatar
 

datamix

I saw some modules a few years back from one of the Datamix consoles for sale on ebay and I almost bought one but didn't have the money at the time. I remember they had some big inductors on the eq and the eq's had these sliders on them.

Hendrix was what inspired me to play guitar. I was 9 years old when I first heard his music in 1969.


Sorry,
carry on
Old 25th May 2007
  #32
Gear maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TAVD View Post
I've read somewhere that the reason for the purchase of the Datamix consoles for EL was because one was used previously in another NYC studio. So, did The Record Plant have one as well?
That would have been Mayfair (again the Kellgren connection). That tank of a console was used in the copy room at Mayfair (which still maybe in existence as Kamen Audio) @ 701 7th ave. (the same building Unique recording was in). But I have no idea if the Datamix was installed at Mayfair at the time.

Ron Allaire, Skyline
Old 25th May 2007
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axisdreamer View Post
I saw some modules a few years back from one of the Datamix consoles for sale on ebay and I almost bought one but didn't have the money at the time. I remember they had some big inductors on the eq and the eq's had these sliders on them.
I bought one of those. I also found another one later on from another source. At first glance, they're similar. When I started going through them, I discovered they are quite different. The face plates are sized slightly different. No biggie there. But inside, one has an all transitor gain block and the other has an IC/transistor hybrid. I posted a pic in the Guts thread, in the Geekslutz forum (post #99).
Old 25th May 2007
  #34
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max cooper's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 84K View Post

*EDIT* I know Kramer used Beyer M160 mics on the guitar cabs.

(hu-hmmm watch the M160s on ebay skyrocket this week)
M160 also used on Hendrix' vocals; at least on Watchtower.
Old 25th May 2007
  #35
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Silvertone's Avatar
Here's a shot of one of Joel's Datamix consoles (and his outboard gear to the left)
Attached Thumbnails
Gear on Electric Ladyland voodoo child (Hendrix)-datamix-console.jpg   Gear on Electric Ladyland voodoo child (Hendrix)-outboard-gear.jpg  
Old 25th May 2007
  #36
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T_R_S's Avatar
You gotta ask yourself is CLA boucing his head to the song? OR is he counting how much he going to make off the points?
Old 25th May 2007
  #37
Banned
 

I had never seen a complete DatMix console....
They look cooler than I though!

There were some modules on eBay a while back, too.

I have never heard that DataMix consoles SOUND that great.

DB
Old 26th May 2007
  #38
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kenevill's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_R_S View Post
You gotta ask yourself is CLA boucing his head to the song? OR is he counting how much he going to make off the points?
i'm pretty sure the thread you want to be on is this one

Chris Lord-Alge mixing on YouTube
Old 26th May 2007
  #39
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Thread Starter
mics and gossip

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvertone View Post
Eddie showed me his micing technique for Hendrix a couple of times when I worked with him. He always like to combine a Shure SM57, Beyer M160 and a Sennheiser 421 on a single cone (the best sounding one to his ear), centered with all 3 mic's just about touching. Although lately Eddie says he's using a Royer 121 in place of the M160.
.
Thanks Silvertone!

Now I want a M160 and a ROYER R-122 Ribbon Microphone.
The royer is exspensive! You think it will help, make me sound like Hendrix? (joke)

But serious... If you have more things to tell us that Eddy Kramer told you about the gear or productions tricks (or other gossip), please share. This is wonderfull fearrytale stuff to a lot of us.


greatings,
MIQER


Old 26th May 2007
  #40
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Jamz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenevill View Post
It's rumored that the Neve 8068 that resides at <a href="http://www.pachydermstudio.com/">pachyderm studios</a> was used on electric ladyland.
My understanding is the console at the original Record Plant in New York back in 1968 was an Electrodyne and the machine was a 12 track Scully.
Here is a blog posted by Ed Ackerson who purchased what he believes is that original Electrodyne console.
http://edackerson.com/blog/?p=26
Old 30th May 2007
  #41
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"DB"'s Avatar
 

How about some actual facts?

The Electric Ladyland album was started at Olympic Studios in London on a Helios board and Ampex 1/2in. 4 tracks. Engineering by Eddie Kramer. Gary Kellgren invited them to come record at his newly opening Record Plant Studio in NYC, and Hendrix was the first major project there. The board was a Datamix (I tried to attach some pictures, but it won't let me). Datamix was a company started by Bill Stoddard on Manhatten's upper westside that built consoles for several studios including Mercury East and West Coasts, Motown, and several for Record Plant NY, three of the later ones were still in service there when I started working there in '77. The four tracks (they had been bouncing 4 to 4, think Sg. Pepper's) were tranferred to 1in. 12track on a custom Scully machine. The standard at the time in the United States was 1in. 8track. Kellgren had a custom 12track headstack and four more channels of electronics added to the Scully, the idea was you would bring your "full" 8track to Record Plant and be able to overdub four more tracks on it. Of course the tracks don't line up perfectly but it worked ok, and locked you into finishing the project there. Kramer hated the Scully, and got Kellgren to get one of the first 2in. Ampex 1000 16tracks, and the album was transferred to, and finished in that format. All of Hendrix's vocals on the album were recorded in NY with Jimi singing into a Beyer M-160.
In my early days at Record Plant, Eddie Kramer would often use an empty mansion and the Record Plant White Truck to record basic tracks and overdubs for albums, and in that relaxed atmosphere he was generous enough to answer my many questions about recording Hendrix, Mad Dogs and Englishmen, Zep, and Woodstock among others. A great way to get an advanced audio education.
Old 30th May 2007
  #42
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I met Eddie today

I was sittin in a studio with Eddie Kramer himself in a studio here in Copenhagen just 5 hours ago!
He was in Denmark for a Jimi Hendrix art gallery he is opening...

What an honor! He is truely a cool guy! He knows what he wants when it comes to recording! Hehe

He told us about how he likes to record drums nowadays:
Kick: 3 mics: 2 in (SM91 + B52) + 1 out (47FET or similar)
Snare: B56 on top + KSM141 on the bottom or AKG 451
HH: KSM141 or similar
Toms: SM98 or 421 (more "standard"/boring I think he said)
OHs: 3 U47 (left, right, center) into 3 tube pultecs for top eq (I forget which version)!!!
Front of kit: C24
Room mic: U87, C12, 414 or any good condenser I think he said...

Oh, he liked the KSM32 on bass amps as well as the 47FET of course...

And like DB said: Recording tracks like "All Along the Watchtower" was done on an Ampex 1/2" 4 track to a Scully 1" 12 track (which he said sounded like sh*t, but Jimi loved it cause he suddenly had 8 more tracks to play with!) to an Ampex 2" 16 track.

Maybe I'll think of more later...

Last edited by Joemamma; 30th May 2007 at 11:23 PM.. Reason: I accidentally hit enter!
Old 31st May 2007
  #43
Old 31st May 2007
  #44
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Silvertone's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joemamma View Post
I was sittin in a studio with Eddie Kramer himself in a studio here in Copenhagen just 5 hours ago!
He was in Denmark for a Jimi Hendrix art gallery he is opening...

What an honor! He is truely a cool guy! He knows what he wants when it comes to recording! Hehe

He told us about how he likes to record drums nowadays:
Kick: 3 mics: 2 in (SM91 + B52) + 1 out (47FET or similar)
Snare: B56 on top + KSM141 on the bottom or AKG 451
HH: KSM141 or similar
Toms: SM98 or 421 (more "standard"/boring I think he said)
OHs: 3 U47 (left, right, center) into 3 tube pultecs for top eq (I forget which version)!!!
Front of kit: C24
Room mic: U87, C12, 414 or any good condenser I think he said...

Oh, he liked the KSM32 on bass amps as well as the 47FET of course...

And like DB said: Recording tracks like "All Along the Watchtower" was done on an Ampex 1/2" 4 track to a Scully 1" 12 track (which he said sounded like sh*t, but Jimi loved it cause he suddenly had 8 more tracks to play with!) to an Ampex 2" 16 track.

Maybe I'll think of more later...
Eddie is a Shure endorser so he uses quite a bit of them now. Last time I mic'd up a 7 piece drum kit for him I had 17 mics on the drums alone (well 5 were room mics). He'd just gotten those little SM98 mics from Shure and the studio liked them so much they bought some right after that session. He wanted 3 U47's on the overheads but we only had one so he used 2 U87 and the U47 in the middle on the OH's. He was using one of the Shure stereo mic's out in front ( I see this time he went for a C24, a much better choice). Other then that his mic's were pretty much the same as mentioned above.

Now when it came time to mix he had a lot of choices on how to "build" the kit for each song. In other words just because he had 17 mic's on the kit he did not use them all for each song. In fact he used different combinations for different songs. Which made the drums sound slightly different from one another even though all the tracks were cut over a two day period. The extra mic's are what I liked to call "safety nets" and with enough mic's on the kit you have more than enough safety nets. You don't use nearly as much EQ either but you do have to watch/listen for phase issues.

Same with the 3 mic technique on guitar, since they are printed to 3 tracks and all have there own sound there was really no need to add EQ just slide up the fader more on one over the other and you can make the amp sound liked it was mic'd differently for each track.

Just some "old school" tricks by one of the guys who were there to invent them.

Eddie is a great guy, just don't let his blood sugar go too low.

Thanks for the correction on the Datamix consoles (I didn't know so many were made). I believe it was Bill Stoddard that was Joel's neighbor. I'll have to ask him again next time I see him.
Old 5th June 2007
  #45
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Silvertone's Avatar
I just talked to Eddie this morning (he's in Tel A Viv right now), he called me looking for someone who has a Datamix console or the schematic, so I put him onto Joel. Joel has all the original schematic's as well as any modds done to them. The designer Gordon Clark was his neighbor and gave him everything before he passed away.

Funny that after all this time Eddie wants one of the modules himself (if not a stereo pair), Joel and I were talking about bringing the design back to the light of day. Think there would be enough interest? The EQ's on these things smoke as well as the mic pre's..
Old 5th June 2007
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvertone View Post
Funny that after all this time Eddie wants one of the modules himself (if not a stereo pair), Joel and I were talking about bringing the design back to the light of day. Think there would be enough interest? The EQ's on these things smoke as well as the mic pre's..
Bring it back in a 500 form factor. But seriously, the power requires are the same and the preamp section would easily fit one slot. The EQ might be tight if you decide to add in/out transformers and still use the inductors.

As I already mentioned, I have in my possession two channel strips with very different gain blocks, which begs the question, how many variations were there and which was used in EL or RP studios.
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