what analog gear to warm up my digital world

[analographi]

Hi,

I'm looking for some analog gear to warm up my digital world.

It doesn't neccessairily need to be a compressor since I only need it to generally warm up and colour all kinds of material.

So it could also be a compressor which isn't a good compressor, but gives nice colour and sound on no or low compression.

Any good tipps around 1000USD or less?

Thanks

[manthe]

Very low cost compressor with great color = ART Pro VLA (NON-digital)

I know, I know...it's an ART, but do some research on the unit. You will see that many people really love these units

It sounds to me like what you REALLY need to do is analog summing. Ultimately, that is what will really 'un-digital' you digital recordings. If I were you, I'd take your budget and look for a nice summing box, or even just a great sounding mixer with as many inputs as you have outputs.

I've actually have a very cool little analog summing setup. It is a bit of a Frankenstein's Monster, but the 'sum of it's parts' (pun intended) sounds great! Here's what I do:

I have 2 Shure M67, 1960's 4-channel mic mixers. I have a total of 12 available outputs from my DAW, but I only use 8. I do my standard mix ITB. Then, I do my best to get everything down to either 8 mono, or 4 stereo busses (this is ALWAYS a very difficult task for me, but if you're creative, it can usually be done). I then take the 8 outs to an 8-port DI box (to change the impedance from line to mic), and from there to the 8 channels between both of the M67s. I then use the mic outputs from the M67s to go to the mic inputs on my GT Brick tube preamps. From there I go back into the DAW as a single, transformer drenched, tube drenched, analog gooified stereo pair!

Works for me!

[Brad McGowan]

This is probably not the suggestion you want to hear, but I would save up a little more and just buy yourself some better converters. A lot of what you perceive as "cold and brittle" will probably disappear and everything you record will sound much better. Other than that I enjoy using my FATSO on a lot of tracks.

Brad

[billgennaro]

you probably don't want to hear this either, but here goes. you might try a good ribbon mic like the r84 sometimes. there isn't a brittle bone in its body.

[analographi]

@brad and Bill, no problem, I can hear that, but it has NOTHINg to do how I work
quite some assumptions you made.

Why should I buy better converters, do you know which I have? Anyways so far I didn't need them so much, since most of my music is created IN the computer.
Every now and then I need a microphone, but it's 1% of my music.

I need something to warm up all the digitally generated stuff from my software synthesizers. ok, there are some channels from external synths that are being A/D converted, but I'm using the converters from the RME fireface 800, and a RME adi-2. It's not state of the art, and certainly on the clean, cold side, but not so much responsible for the digital sound as the digital (virtual analog) synths I'm using.


The summing thing: I thought about that.. I couldn't decide so far.. for that I may really need new converters...

No, for the moment, I just want one external unit, that I can use to colour signigicant tracks.

[Jazzpunk]

Originally Posted by analographi

It's not state of the art, and certainly on the clean, cold side, but not so much responsible for the digital sound as the digital (virtual analog) synths I'm using.

You just answered your own question. Replace those virtuals with real analog synths

[c.gymer]

PSP Vintage Warmer? Granted, its a plugin, but damn does it warm up my world.

Other than that, maybe the Portico 5042 'True Tape' line driver. I've heard good things about that.

[raal]

Originally Posted by analographi

No, for the moment, I just want one external unit, that I can use to colour signigicant tracks.

i would take a look at fatso - very nice box. if you decide to get converters, HEDD has some very nice analog like processing, so you could kill 2 birds with one stone so to speak. as for software, phoenix plugs by cranesong and the massey tape emulator may do the trick for you.

[joshelevator]

Originally Posted by Jazzpunk

You just answered your own question. Replace those virtuals with real analog synths

i use both soft synths and hardware synths.the soft-synths just sound cold/thin compared to the analog. get some analog into your mix and you will def start to warm up the mix. less convenient, but necesaary for that warm sound imo. almost forgot, samples from vinyl is good. hardware samples will help even more but you can warm stuff up nicely enough with come vinyl samples alone. your converters are fine.

[mixerguy]

FATSO rocks. I love mine.

[Brad McGowan]

Originally Posted by analographi

@brad and Bill, no problem, I can hear that, but it has NOTHINg to do how I work
quite some assumptions you made.

Why should I buy better converters, do you know which I have? Anyways so far I didn't need them so much, since most of my music is created IN the computer.
Every now and then I need a microphone, but it's 1% of my music.

I need something to warm up all the digitally generated stuff from my software synthesizers. ok, there are some channels from external synths that are being A/D converted, but I'm using the converters from the RME fireface 800, and a RME adi-2. It's not state of the art, and certainly on the clean, cold side, but not so much responsible for the digital sound as the digital (virtual analog) synths I'm using.

Okay I was making some assumptions. But my recommendation still stands. I did a direct comparison using the exact RME converter you mention and some Mytek 8x96 converters and the difference was night and day. To be honest, IMO the RME sounded like poop. If you are monitoring through less than stellar converters that reconstruct those 1's and 0's in a mediocre manner, then you will be hearing things in a colored way and reacting to it. And I'm not talking about the good coloration either. I'm talking about harsh high end and bloated undefined low end that may not actually be there. You can still make music using average sounding converters, but just be aware that you aren't hearing things accurately.

The FATSO is pretty good at turning synths and VST instruments into something more pleasing to the ear. I'm getting ready to do a record with a band that has a lot of tracks created with Reason, and I'm planning to just run the entire virtual track submix through the FATSO.

Brad

[Capstan Cappy]

an analogue console
different converters sure but still digital , compressor sure unless its used on total and a good one , but the only thing realy warmping up your total stereo image is an analogue console, but for 1000 u wont find a good sounding one unfortunatly

[undermind]

A few questions/ comments after reading this thread..

c.gymer, you mentioned the PSP Vintage Warmer, are there any go-to settings or presets you like in certain situations? Do you like to use it on individual tracks or the whole mix?
I've got it and use it a little bit. It's one of those things where I don't know if I'm really making the music sound better though because just about everytime you've engaged it, you're making the part or mix louder. And you what they say, louder usually makes you think better.

Also, regarding the Fatso. I was planning on picking up a Distressor as my next purchase. But now I'm teetering after seeing the comments on the Fatso here. I know there are probably a lot of threads on this exact issue, but is the Fatso used more on complete mixes and the Distressor on individual tracks? For those of you who have used both quite a bit can you comment on which one you reach for in which situation?

Thanks.

[valver]

Crane Song HEDD ...

The End !

(over budget but, worth selling gear to get)

[undermind]

Oh yeah, I forgot the comment I was going to make.

I think the best thing to do for pro sounding results on projects recorded at home is to rent studio time at the best studio in your area and run your in the box mixes through their console and big dollar analog equipment. I read an interview with the guy who recorded Ray Charles on all of his big stuff. He actually uses (and did with Ray) a DAW and mixes it the best he can in the box. Then he'll rent studio time and mix on the consoles through the summing amps for the final product. A lot of major recordings are done this way. It all depends on what type of project you're doing and if you can have enough things ready at the same time to justify renting studio time.

[analographi]

Hey thanks a lot for the many inputs.

Analog mixing, no chance Too inconvinient. I want just a little more analog sound, not the full package.

Buying analog synths - stupid comment

Fatso, heard about it, will have a look,

PSP vintage warmer - hell NO!!! I tried it, it's cute, but far from what I want. I use it a lot on anystuff, but it's not giving the warmth I'm looking for. I had a TL-audio C1 giving much more warmth, but still not enough.

all the others, thanks will check the stuff out.

RME ADI-2
there are highend freaks around who say it's DA conversion is among 5000USD highend converters quality.. there was a review around.

I think my Dynaudio BM6A wont be able to tell me the difference between RME and all above anyways.

For the moment all I know is, that if I send a signal over my SPL tube vitalizer i get a little of what I want. Just not coloured enough. I want more of it. !!

[undermind]

Originally Posted by analographi

Hey thanks a lot for the many inputs.

Analog mixing, no chance Too inconvinient. I want just a little more analog sound, not the full package.

Buying analog synths - stupid comment

Fatso, heard about it, will have a look,

PSP vintage warmer - hell NO!!! I tried it, it's cute, but far from what I want. I use it a lot on anystuff, but it's not giving the warmth I'm looking for. I had a TL-audio C1 giving much more warmth, but still not enough.

all the others, thanks will check the stuff out.

RME ADI-2
there are highend freaks around who say it's DA conversion is among 5000USD highend converters quality.. there was a review around.

I think my Dynaudio BM6A wont be able to tell me the difference between RME and all above anyways.

For the moment all I know is, that if I send a signal over my SPL tube vitalizer i get a little of what I want. Just not coloured enough. I want more of it. !!

It kind of seems like you want to ask the questions but don't want to hear the answers. I think possibly the best answer for your situation is to buy real analog synths, which you said is a "stupid comment". When it comes down to it, you're trying to fatten up your digital synth sounds, make them sound more analog. Using true analog synths is a pretty obvious (and not stupid) answer. There's no substitute for the real thing.

And as far as RME conversion among $5000 units, you can find these comments about anything. And they probably came from someone who bought one and are justifying it. I'm not saying that the RME converters are bad, they are quite good for the money. But you will always find someone who says product x costing $800 sounds just as good as product y costing $5000.

[2012]

Originally Posted by analographi

For the moment all I know is, that if I send a signal over my SPL tube vitalizer i get a little of what I want. Just not coloured enough. I want more of it. !!

1. Reamp your synths through a tube guitar amp.

advantages:
You can mic the amp, use the room ambience, etc, etc, etc. You can use it for... (gasp) guitar & to reamp DI'd guitar tracks. You can reamp anything with it - vox, synths, drums, etc. You open the door for all your tracks to the world of stompboxes. You can score a good DI and a pretty good tube amp for around $500, OR you could get a DI and that 5-watt Epiphone for around $300!

2. Run your synths out & back in through something like the Solo 610 or GT Brick.

These techniques work wonders on sterile VIs, options galore. It sounds like you're already accustomed to running it out and back into your SPL... and it isn't cutting it for you. That's when I would reamp and marvel at how wonderful guitar amps, air, & microphones are.

[zimv20]

Originally Posted by analographi

Buying analog synths - stupid comment

if you're going to be so petulant, why should people even bother to help you? i'm embarrassed for you.

[Jazzpunk]

Originally Posted by analographi

Buying analog synths - stupid comment

You're a moron. Have fun trying to make your pretend analog synths sound more analog fuuck

[2012]

Originally Posted by zimv20

if you're going to be so petulant, why should people even bother to help you? i'm embarrassed for you.

IRONY (n.) analographi works completely ITB using VIs exclusively.

[Kiwiburger]

Reamping is definately your best option - maybe into a cassette recorder and back, or through some transformers or tubes, or whatever you've got.

Second best is convolution of impulses taken from good analog gear.

If you can host PC VST, the Voxengo Analog Flux suite has Tape bus, which has some impulses from well known tape machines. It also has some good saturation built in, to compensate for the fact that convolution isn't dynamic.

Some actual analog synths weren't that great in practice. A lot of the lush 80's synth textures required triple tracking and lots of processing to get a decent sound from those things.

[Brad McGowan]

Voxengo TapeBus is cool for adding some "vibe" to things like soft synths. That's one of the things I use it for specifically, especially if it's a scratchy string sound (try the Real Strings preset).

The reamp comment is a good one. I would get something like a A Designs REDDI and reamp through that. As far as I'm concerned it's bascially a clean guitar amp without tone controls. It's all tube and has a massive transformer. That's two things that will create musical harmonics for you.

You could also try running your mix through a nice colored preamp. If you hit it really hard you'll get some nice transformer saturation.

Brad

[analographi]

Originally Posted by Jazzpunk

You're a moron. Have fun trying to make your pretend analog synths sound more analog fuuck

Wow, such a little comment like "stupid comment" can piss off so many people??

So, possibly there has to be information given for all of you, who possibly are not into electronic music and sounddesign: (sorry I stupidly assumed that everybody is)

My Virus TI, or my nord Modular, absynth, FM7 can do sounds NO analog synthesizer so far can do, thats why I have them!! there is NO replacement. But they could need some "warming up". as for all the other freaky sounds I create from samples with all possible kinds of processing in the digital world that analog never can.

Furthermore, I have original, 20 and more year olds, Juno-106, SH-1000, a TB-303 and 3 new but selfmade, self developed analog 303 based synths for all the sounddesign, that can't be done with the virtuals. they do not need warming up.

Still feel justified with your comments? I'm an embarassed moron? Ok, well. your problem.

Recording over guitar amp.. hmm, I have none, and have no idea of that stuff. So you really mean out - amp - speaker - mic? or what?

Go over a mic preamp, that sounds interesting too, since I want to buy a new one anyway, any recommendation of nice "colouring ones"?



BTW: RME review, was in a HighEnd mag.

[arpodthegreat]

get a good guitar amp or if you must an amp simulator. really though get a good tube amp. try and find a used fender of some kind i don't know there is too much out there to recommend one thing but i would say that if you can find a decent guitar amp, running your synths through that help out a lot. using the reverb, EQ, gain and volume on the amp you can really dial up a lot of sounds. turns a korg triton into something that actually is useable. especially helps with the organ and string sounds

[sleestack]

What abou the ALTEC 436C compressor?

http://www.tfpro.com/products/p8_info/p8_testing.php

[analographi]

PS: "analog"-raphi comes from "analog thinking"

opposed to "digital (black and white) thinking" like: everything new is good, or everything expensive is good, or everything analog is good.

[kedbear]

hi,
You can get full warm sounds using your digital gear if you know how. Just a question of practice. Read the Autechre article in sound on sound, very interesting. There's so much crap about digital being cold, but so many people just haven't got the most out of it for whatever reason.

[Mastering101]

empirical labs fatso jr...thats what you need..its quick and easy then you play music...set it forget it

[The True Buck]

I also think the fatso is your best bet! Sure, it's a bit more expensive than 1000$, don't know how much they are on ebay. But from what you've told us about how you work, I think you would really love it!