best kick mic for alt/country folk rock

redddog · 30th January 2007, 03:56 AM

I'm sorry if this has been done to death but I have been searching and can't find much.

I have a beta 52. I have used it on a session and I was very unhappy with the results. I'm pretty sure that the kick drum results were more due to my incompetence but it brought up the question to me as to which kick mic I should be using. What do you think?

bartrose · 30th January 2007, 05:09 AM

I use the Beta 52 almost on a daily basis. I think it's best suited for modern rock and country. Sounds like you need something smoother/more mello. You should try a tube condenser mic. They sound smooth and fat. I use the AKG solid tube for this purpose. I think they go for $600.00 to $700.00 these days. But I believe you can get a budget tube mic for around $300.00, maybe a Studio Projects mic. And if you've got tons of dough, I've heard the U47 is great for this purpose, but don't quote me on that because I can't afford one.. Bart Rose TEXAS

Wayne · 30th January 2007, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redddog

I'm sorry if this has been done to death but I have been searching and can't find much.

I have a beta 52. I have used it on a session and I was very unhappy with the results. ...

How about we start at the beginning then? What is it not doing right. That's one from the super-scooped camp. ATM-25 less so (moderately hyped?), RE-20 less yet (more towards 'natural perhaps?)..
How about out front of the kick? Just being general, for examples..

TYY · 30th January 2007, 06:19 AM

I think getting "that" sound is more in the mic placement and the drum itself, but yes, you probably want to stay away from the real scooped, clicky mics like D112/D6/etc (or so I've heard).

I have had good luck with a 421 in the kick for the attack/thump and large condenser(s) out in front to get the roundness/softness. I'm talking about at least 3-6' back. Try to get it in phase with your overhead(s) on the kick. You can eq/compress the 421 to get whatever you need out of it, but keep the FOK (front of KIT, not front of KICK) relatively unprocessed. You can crush a distant room mic, add it in with everything else and then compress the whole thing to taste to glue it all together.

djui5 · 30th January 2007, 07:30 AM

jeff deff · 30th January 2007, 03:51 PM

I think an EV RE-20 yields the most natural sounding kick drum, hands down. I think it suits the alt country/folk genre perfectly, it is the opposite of the larger than life, fake kick sound typical in modern country (the evil arch enemy of alt country).
As a bonus, it is a good all around mic and not a specialty mic like an AKG D112. Use it on kick, floor tom, bass cabinet, guitar cabinet, horns, vocals, just about anything. As an aside, if you look at the cover of the vinyl version of Harvest by Neil Young, there is a photo where they are jamming out in a barn and they have an RE-20 on overhead! An all around useful mic.

*CISKO* · 30th January 2007, 05:36 PM

its gotta be an re20 for me, cause you can hear more of the lower mids, but they are not overbearing where you have to scoop the hell of them

max cooper · 30th January 2007, 07:33 PM

RE20 is a good call; also might try a D-12 (not D-112)

allencollins · 30th January 2007, 11:47 PM

the drum, tuning and the heads are more important than the mic
as is the room of course

But I don't think Ludwig or DW has a 'country' model
but then again niether does Sennheiser or Shure

Just sample a nice isolated kick drum on your favorite
Travis Tritt or Rascal Flatts cd. Then youll always have a great kick sound
at the drag and drop of your mouse.

Just like country performers Country music engineers/producers
should have no pride. If Country 'Artists' can cop out and buy their filler and hit songs
then Im sure using samples would not be any less respected in that industry

ronzie · 31st January 2007, 12:22 AM

Hey reddog, maybe you should think outside the box and instead of a different mic, change the beater on the kick pedal to Allen's head. That might give you the

' tone you need.

Ron Allaire, Skyline

TYY · 31st January 2007, 01:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by allencollins

Just sample a nice isolated kick drum on your favorite Travis Tritt or Rascal Flatts cd. Then youll always have a great kick sound
at the drag and drop of your mouse.

Goddamn I hope you're joking.

djui5 · 31st January 2007, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TYY

Goddamn I hope you're joking.

If you think it hasn't been done a million times your wrong...

redddog · 31st January 2007, 02:34 AM

AC,

It seems I wasn't clear when I described my type of stuff. It's ALT country which is about 180 degress different then pop country. I honestly have no idea what Rascal Flats sounds or looks like. I'm sure though that he has flaired jeans and very pointy little cowboy boots with some kind of sparkly stuff on his shirt. LOL

Seriously, I hear you about the tuning and the room. I think rather than lay down some cake to get another mic, I'm gonna take Ronzie's advice and make the Beta 52 work.

I'm thinking about getting a well known engineer in town to come into my studio and school me with my gear for a couple of hours. That may be better money spent.

octatonic · 31st January 2007, 02:51 AM

Neumann 147 has the weight you are looking for- it's like a velvet enema.

jhg · 31st January 2007, 02:59 AM

Re-20 is great, I've been really happy with the new(er) Heil PR30 on the kick, among other things. This horse has been flogged, but it's really a great versatile mic, will set you back less - like half - of an Re-20 and wlll be used. If not, it'll last 23 seconds on the classifieds at a good price.

Regards,

jhg

Tubetone99 · 31st January 2007, 03:03 AM

Fet47 on the outside, and RE-20 inside.

Also, if you have a decent speaker or spare monitor place the woofer part in the upper corner of the drum head. It really gives a nice, round low end that seems to mix well with an RE-20.

TYY · 31st January 2007, 03:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djui5

If you think it hasn't been done a million times your wrong...

I know people "steal" samples all the time. I was actually referring to the poster's suggestion that Travis Tritt and Rascal Flatts recordings had kick tones that fell under the umbrella of "alt.county/folk rock". They are about as modern country "product" as you can. I'd be shocked if rascal flatts wasn't using kick samples for their own recordings. I don't think that is what the OP is going for...

djui5 · 31st January 2007, 03:23 AM

oh yeah...

back to my hole

allencollins · 31st January 2007, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TYY

Goddamn I hope you're joking.

Just like country music................ I'm joking

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30th January 2007, 03:56 AM	#1
redddog Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,273	best kick mic for alt/country folk rock I'm sorry if this has been done to death but I have been searching and can't find much. I have a beta 52. I have used it on a session and I was very unhappy with the results. I'm pretty sure that the kick drum results were more due to my incompetence but it brought up the question to me as to which kick mic I should be using. What do you think?

30th January 2007, 07:30 AM	#5
djui5 Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Phoenix Posts: 6,679	D-12 __________________ _________________ "What is a crossfire hurricane & why wasn't I born in one?" Randy Wright http://www.myspace.com/djui5

30th January 2007, 05:36 PM	#7
CISKO Gear nut Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: bogota colombia Posts: 128	its gotta be an re20 for me, cause you can hear more of the lower mids, but they are not overbearing where you have to scoop the hell of them __________________ silly rabbit, trix is for kids!

31st January 2007, 02:51 AM	#14
octatonic Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: London Posts: 4,772	Neumann 147 has the weight you are looking for- it's like a velvet enema. __________________ Regards, Jim Richmond "I don't go to mythical places with strange men." Douglas Adams

30th January 2007, 05:09 AM	#2
bartrose Gear Head Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 35	I use the Beta 52 almost on a daily basis. I think it's best suited for modern rock and country. Sounds like you need something smoother/more mello. You should try a tube condenser mic. They sound smooth and fat. I use the AKG solid tube for this purpose. I think they go for $600.00 to $700.00 these days. But I believe you can get a budget tube mic for around $300.00, maybe a Studio Projects mic. And if you've got tons of dough, I've heard the U47 is great for this purpose, but don't quote me on that because I can't afford one.. Bart Rose TEXAS

30th January 2007, 06:19 AM	#4
TYY Gear addict Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 325	I think getting "that" sound is more in the mic placement and the drum itself, but yes, you probably want to stay away from the real scooped, clicky mics like D112/D6/etc (or so I've heard). I have had good luck with a 421 in the kick for the attack/thump and large condenser(s) out in front to get the roundness/softness. I'm talking about at least 3-6' back. Try to get it in phase with your overhead(s) on the kick. You can eq/compress the 421 to get whatever you need out of it, but keep the FOK (front of KIT, not front of KICK) relatively unprocessed. You can crush a distant room mic, add it in with everything else and then compress the whole thing to taste to glue it all together.

30th January 2007, 03:51 PM	#6
jeff deff Gear nut Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Chicago, Ill. Posts: 124	I think an EV RE-20 yields the most natural sounding kick drum, hands down. I think it suits the alt country/folk genre perfectly, it is the opposite of the larger than life, fake kick sound typical in modern country (the evil arch enemy of alt country). As a bonus, it is a good all around mic and not a specialty mic like an AKG D112. Use it on kick, floor tom, bass cabinet, guitar cabinet, horns, vocals, just about anything. As an aside, if you look at the cover of the vinyl version of Harvest by Neil Young, there is a photo where they are jamming out in a barn and they have an RE-20 on overhead! An all around useful mic.

30th January 2007, 07:33 PM	#8
max cooper Lives for gear Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: tx Posts: 8,819	RE20 is a good call; also might try a D-12 (not D-112)

30th January 2007, 11:47 PM	#9
allencollins Lives for gear Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Manchester by the Sea, MA Posts: 3,561	the drum, tuning and the heads are more important than the mic as is the room of course But I don't think Ludwig or DW has a 'country' model but then again niether does Sennheiser or Shure Just sample a nice isolated kick drum on your favorite Travis Tritt or Rascal Flatts cd. Then youll always have a great kick sound at the drag and drop of your mouse. Just like country performers Country music engineers/producers should have no pride. If Country 'Artists' can cop out and buy their filler and hit songs then Im sure using samples would not be any less respected in that industry

31st January 2007, 12:22 AM	#10
ronzie Gear maniac Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 211	Hey reddog, maybe you should think outside the box and instead of a different mic, change the beater on the kick pedal to Allen's head. That might give you the ' tone you need. Ron Allaire, Skyline

31st January 2007, 02:34 AM	#13
redddog Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,273	AC, It seems I wasn't clear when I described my type of stuff. It's ALT country which is about 180 degress different then pop country. I honestly have no idea what Rascal Flats sounds or looks like. I'm sure though that he has flaired jeans and very pointy little cowboy boots with some kind of sparkly stuff on his shirt. LOL Seriously, I hear you about the tuning and the room. I think rather than lay down some cake to get another mic, I'm gonna take Ronzie's advice and make the Beta 52 work. I'm thinking about getting a well known engineer in town to come into my studio and school me with my gear for a couple of hours. That may be better money spent.

31st January 2007, 02:59 AM	#15
jhg Gear addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: nyc Posts: 368	Re-20 is great, I've been really happy with the new(er) Heil PR30 on the kick, among other things. This horse has been flogged, but it's really a great versatile mic, will set you back less - like half - of an Re-20 and wlll be used. If not, it'll last 23 seconds on the classifieds at a good price. Regards, jhg __________________ "Dung beetles with ostentatious horns tend to have smaller testicles" source unknown, as read in Harpers Findings, Dec. 2006.

31st January 2007, 03:03 AM	#16
Tubetone99 Gear interested Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 11	Fet47 on the outside, and RE-20 inside. Also, if you have a decent speaker or spare monitor place the woofer part in the upper corner of the drum head. It really gives a nice, round low end that seems to mix well with an RE-20.

31st January 2007, 03:23 AM	#18
djui5 Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Phoenix Posts: 6,679	oh yeah... back to my hole __________________ _________________ "What is a crossfire hurricane & why wasn't I born in one?" Randy Wright http://www.myspace.com/djui5

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