Mixing Kick (909) and Bass (Juno-ish)

[passionmax]

I am having trouble mixing the low end in my mixes. Lets say I am mixing a 909 kick with a Juno bass that does not have much of a click topend to it. I have read alot about using waves max bass for the kick. I add the max bass to the kick and the kick sounds awesome. How do I add the bass not. A lot of othere people in the forums have said to drop the kick from 60hxz and below and emphasize the bass around 40hz. This seems to make the bass sound warmer but muddier and if I loose 60hz and belowe then the kick does not have the same balls once I adde the max bass. I am producing and mixing Pop R&B and Dance music. Also some people talk about side chain compression. also Multi the tracks. Can you guys help me out Let me know thanks

[matucha]

1. you have a bassline

2. search for prominent bass freqs (root and harmonic freqs) with sweeping hi-Q EQ

3. search for prominent kick freq

4. are they at the same freqs? yes? need to tune the kick somewhere else, there is almost always a place

5. add another acoustic type of kick for midrange tune it too

6. insert sample delay plug on both of the kicks and try to dial to the most sweetest place (this does miracles).

7. mult anything if you need more definition with bass roll off

8. too much bass under 60Hz isn't good thing, I found using low shelf to attentuate it a bit and something compensating in 60-100Hz area pretty useful.

9. Check it in "whole-mix-low-pass" at for ex 250hz. Can you hear both, bass and kik? try it at 100Hz, still works?

10. route both to a group and compress it to taste to lock them together.

That was my last procedure getting these thing to work, YMMV as alllllllwajs.

Matous

[passionmax]

Hi when you say harmonics from the roots aare you talking about overtones. I guess it is the same. I am trying to remember the overtone series from college. Is it a 5th above the root firest or and 8ve up first. thanks
also everyone talks about multies. do you use the original when you multi or do you copy the original 2 or 3 times for examploe. take the original kick and eq it to taste. then copy it twice. take the first copy and roll off everything above 150hz. thae the second copy and getrid of everything from 150 and belowe and 5000k and above. compress the shit out of the multies and then spread them stereo . sneak them in under the original to you baberly hear them. let me know if this is right
thanksx

[joeq]

Your perception of how much Bass there is is influenced by those overtones even if the fundamental is missing.

the Juno is a pretty simple synth- one or two oscillators I think. A lot of the sounds are short on overtones. some are little more than a sine wave. It could be huge at 60 Hz and have nothing going on above that.

You could try layering the bass line with another sound- from the Juno or from a sample based keyboard that had some of the higher overtones that the Juno might be missing.

Another thing that sometimes works is some distortion- from a plug in like Amp Farm or from reamping the signal and micing it up. Try it on one of the mults and gradually sneak it in.

Multing, Maxx Bass, layering are all ways to make sure that your low frequency instruments extend upward into the higher bass and low midrange so they can be heard as well as felt.

Listen to your mix on small crappy speakers- you are going to lose that 60 Hz sine wave, but there should still be something there to tell you that your bass track is going.

[matucha]

passionmax>

harmonics-overtones ... well I don't know, my english is not 100%, but I'm talking about freqs tied to root (multiples or so).

multing? it is sort of everything, for ex I have low kick and high kick. Tune them to fit the bass. Sampleslide (phase) them to the fattest point. And then finding kick is little lost in the whole mix, I multed the high kick, rolled off the bottom accentuate some 3-5kHz, listen, tweak, listen, tweak to the sweetest point.

Once you know about multing existance, you have your hands free "implementing" it ;-)))).

good luck