Multiple Amps, 1 effects loop, please help!
Old 21st December 2012
  #1
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Multiple Amps, 1 effects loop, please help!

Ok guys, I need your help!
I use 2 amps, a Vox AC-30 and a Mesa Lonestar.
In a rack I have a Little Labs PCP which is how I run both amps.
Since the Mesa has an effects loop, and the AC does not, what would be the best way to run my time based effects? At the moment, I am running my delays/choruses through the effects loop of the Mesa. I've tried this on stage, and it sounds good. This is sorta W/D except I'm still getting dry signal through the Mesa. Would it make more sense to take a line out from the mesa into a Suhr line out box into my effects into a poweramp into a couple of 1x12 cabs. (This would technically be w/d/w right?) Only thing with this is I'm still not using the AC-30 to power the effects, so this seems like just a more elaborate version of what I'm already doing.

Is there an easier way to do this? Keep in mind, the AC-30 does not have an effects loop, or a line out.
Thanks for all advice!
Old 22nd December 2012
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rivieraguitar View Post
Ok guys, I need your help!
Would it make more sense to take a line out from the mesa into a Suhr line out box into my effects into a poweramp into a couple of 1x12 cabs. (This would technically be w/d/w right?) Only thing with this is I'm still not using the AC-30 to power the effects, so this seems like just a more elaborate version of what I'm already doing.

Is there an easier way to do this? Keep in mind, the AC-30 does not have an effects loop, or a line out.
Thanks for all advice!
I'd do the wdw set up as you described.. If you don't mind lugging around the extra gear, the WDW is heavenly, and will keep your FX consistent when switching amps. To me it's either that, or you run everything in front of the amps. Depending on what delays and mods you're using that could be very hit or miss, probably miss.......or you just use your Mesa with the Loop and call it a day.

ps- for tracking I wouldn't mess with any of this. I'd just record amps dry and monitor/insert FX through Pro Tools
Old 24th December 2012
  #3
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I have a Radial Bigshot ABY at the end of my pedalboard so that I can use time and modulation effects on either or both amps.

Can't think of a way to incorporate an effects loop on 1 amp; I'd try just going out into both amps and see if you can live with the sound. None of my amps have effects loops, so I don't know what I'm missing...
Old 25th December 2012
  #4
I prefer to run all my effects the old fashioned way in front of the amp. Try it first before you start lugging new gear around.
Old 25th December 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catfishmusic View Post
I'd do the wdw set up as you described.. If you don't mind lugging around the extra gear, the WDW is heavenly, and will keep your FX consistent when switching amps. To me it's either that, or you run everything in front of the amps. Depending on what delays and mods you're using that could be very hit or miss, probably miss.......or you just use your Mesa with the Loop and call it a day.

ps- for tracking I wouldn't mess with any of this. I'd just record amps dry and monitor/insert FX through Pro Tools
Catfishmusic---that makes sense. In this sort of setup, would you recommend a solid state poweramp like a Carvin, or should I go tube like a VHT or Mesa?
Old 25th December 2012
  #6
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iskandns's Avatar
 

Why do you want to avoid running effects in front of the amps?
Old 26th December 2012
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rivieraguitar View Post
Catfishmusic---that makes sense. In this sort of setup, would you recommend a solid state poweramp like a Carvin, or should I go tube like a VHT or Mesa?
If you can swing the $, the VHT or Mesa is the way to go. I have the Mesa 2/90, and it rocks. You'll be psyched the first time you hook up the WDW and stand in front of your rig with the stereo delay going!
Old 30th December 2012
  #8
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Actually you can use both amps for this:

Signal goes to pedalboard then to amp switcher the to the AC30 and the Mesa. The AC30 needs a load box to produce a line level signal. The output from the Mesa effects send and the AC30 load box goes to the inputs of your W/W effects and stereo power amps (probably best to have a little mixer to combine the signals before the effects).

So switching the amp switcher changes the sends to the amps which drives the w/w rig from either or both.
Old 31st December 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iskandns View Post
Why do you want to avoid running effects in front of the amps?
Well,typically running tone and boost pedals before the amp is fine, but time-based EFX you want to run after the preamp. Reason being that if you are driving the front of the amp, you may not want distorted reverb or echo.
Old 3rd January 2013
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travisbrown View Post
Well,typically running tone and boost pedals before the amp is fine, but time-based EFX you want to run after the preamp. Reason being that if you are driving the front of the amp, you may not want distorted reverb or echo.
In that case, the only thing I can think of (in addition to the wdw solution and "just live with it" solution, or having the amp modded to include a loop) would be to add a hot plate to the ac-30. Then you could run the line out from the hotplate after the preamp and power amp into your time based / reverb effects, then direct to the board.

Disadvantages: you lose the speaker breakup element of your tone at the board, and the live sound from the speakers will still be dry.

Then you'd have to use a/b/y to integrate the other amp.

So basically I'm saying it might be possible but I am not recommending it.
Old 3rd January 2013
  #11
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Old 3rd January 2013
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iskandns View Post
In that case, the only thing I can think of (in addition to the wdw solution and "just live with it" solution, or having the amp modded to include a loop) would be to add a hot plate to the ac-30. Then you could run the line out from the hotplate after the preamp and power amp into your time based / reverb effects, then direct to the board.

Disadvantages: you lose the speaker breakup element of your tone at the board, and the live sound from the speakers will still be dry.

Then you'd have to use a/b/y to integrate the other amp.

So basically I'm saying it might be possible but I am not recommending it.
I had the same problem with a MusicMan 65-112 - no EFX loop. Since that amp is a SS front end, wasn't disastrous as I didn't drive the amp; however, I did look at putting an EFX loop in. Wasn't difficult - just break the circuit and put a buffer in. between the preamp and power stages.

Another amp I had, a Boogie DC-2, I ended up modding because it had a summing circuit as a EFX loop instead of replace.

Now I'm faced with another problem with my Matchless DC-30 - it has separate EFX loops for each channel. I'm in the process of building a switcher, a sort of dual ABY switch, but trying to work out how that will work with jumpering the inputs.
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