Tracking a Mesa Quad preamp

[effitall]

The Boogie Mark series is very mid heavy. If you do a search here on GS, you can find some notes from Flemming Rasmussen about the recording of guitars with Metallica. In the effects loop of the Mark series amps they were using was an Aphex/B&B parametric EQ.

One thing I love about the older Mark series is the upper mid "crunch" that you can hear so prevalent on earlier Metallica records. I don't have any experience with Mark IV or V though so I can't speak to them.

I have a Mark III that I just picked up and am bringing back up to snuff. The "lead" channel is a little short on "sparkle" but definitely not short on "aggression." It will never sound like a Recto but you can get it to "chug" similar to one with the graphic and maybe something a little more in the loop.

[effitall]

Another note....On the graphic...Boost the 80 slider, drop the 240 slider, and see where that gets you. For the "sparkle" you're going to need something extra. I'm thinking about modding the "presence" circuit in my Mark III to dial that in. I find full boosts to suck....But the full cut on the 240 seems to be alright. The rest of the EQ bands don't seem to land where I want them to, but are decent for gentle shaping.

[nedorama]

Originally Posted by HSLand

When tracking a Quad preamp on either the Mark ii or Mark iii channels, I find that a parametric EQ after the preamp is absolutely necessary. The preamp - even with the graphic EQ making the classic smiley face - doesn't give as much roar as it should for high gain metal.

I can simply throw up a mic on my old dual rectifier and it instantly sounds bigger/more powerful than a Quad. So in turn I have to apply pretty extreme use of my parametric EQ to bring it up to par. Boost a LOT at 100-125hz, cut a bit wherever desired, and give it some sparkle in the high end somewhere at 10k or so. And remember, that's on TOP of the graphic EQ smiley face.

Anyone have similar experiences with tracking a Quad or Mark ii or Mark iii?

What are you running the quad preamp into, or are you just taking the output from the preamp into the board?

[HSLand]

Didn't realize anyone replied to this!

I'm running my Quad into a 295 Simul Class into a standard Mesa 4X12 cab. I've heard some people say that the Recording Outs on the Quad are much better than the main outs. I remember trying that one time and not hearing a difference, but maybe I'll the recording outs again and see what happens.

The Quad definitely has a lot of stuff going on in the upper range, it's VERY mid/treble heavy and that's been a problem for me. Sounds too 'crispy'. Though at about 7k-8k, it starts rolling off and there's basically nothing there. I looked at a spectrum analyzer and that 'sparkle' at about 8k is non-existent, so that's where my parametric EQ comes in. I need to tame the frequencies a bit below that.

And the EQ was used in the FX loop in the Metallica recordings? I thought they used it after the preamp going into the power amp. I have a hardware parametric EQ that I bought for the Quad and that's how I run mine. Maybe I'll hook up the EQ in the loop of the Quad and see how I fare with it.

These things are HARD to dial in right. One wrong move and you've got too much boom/mud, or too much 'crispiness'.

[effitall]

Originally Posted by HSLand

And the EQ was used in the FX loop in the Metallica recordings? I thought they used it after the preamp going into the power amp. I have a hardware parametric EQ that I bought for the Quad and that's how I run mine. Maybe I'll hook up the EQ in the loop of the Quad and see how I fare with it.

Yeah....That's where the loop is on the Mark series amps. In your case, putting the EQ after the pre and before whatever power amp you're using is pretty much the same.

All that high-mid, treble stuff is where that classic Metallica "chink" on the the pic attack comes from.

Right now on my MkIII I've got the V1 pulled (bright) and turned up to about 7-8, the treble pulled (shift) and around 7, Mids about 2-3, Bass pulled (shift) and about 3-4, R2 engaged, master pulled for "deep", Lead gain about 5-7, Lead master pulled or not based on overall volume.

If you try to get big bass response from this series with the bass knob in the tone stack, you're going the wrong way. That's what the graphic is for. Moving the tone stack bass knob up sends you straight to the mud-pit in a hurry.

I'm still learning the amp though.

[HSLand]

Heathen - Victims Of Deception [Full Album] - YouTube - as far as I know, this is 100% a Mark III with a parametric EQ in the loop. I wonder if I can get this same tone out of the Quad on channel 2, the Mark III-based channel.

I think this Heathen tone is the best thrash metal tone I've ever heard. The Justice tone is a close 2nd.

[effitall]

I would think you could get close to those sounds with the Quad. A couple of notes...If you haven't already...spend some time with the manual. There are some interesting interactions on the Mark/Studio preamps. Also...I would bypass the extra EQ and get the amp sounding as close as you can to what you want, then turn on the outboard EQ and dial it in the rest of the way.

Speakers might be an issue as well. Generally speaking, I really like the Boogie cabs, but see if you can find a Marshall 1960 cab with T75's in it. I think that was the dominate speaker in thrash circles back then. They have a pretty "scooped" sound to them with some "fizz" up top.

[HSLand]

It seems that these older Mark-based amps require a lot of EQ and tweaking to get sounding good compared to other amps. I think that a room mic can benefit it too, at least on the recordings I'm referencing.

I'm going to keep fooling with it and see what I come up with...

[effitall]

I was curious about the Flemming notes and I'm sad to see them missing...However...I did find this gem from the thread that Flemming was posting in..

Condenser Mic Identification (Metallica)

There you go. The settings for the Mark IIc+, the inserted Aphex/B&B parametric, the mics and their respective channel strip EQ settings.

I stand by my guess on T75's in the cabinets even though I didn't see it confirmed in the thread. They just have "that" sound.