Mic for Trumpet player?

[tragedybysyntax]

Okay so.. I'm bringing in a trumpet player to record on some of my tunes.... The signal will be a germanium (which i'm ordering on monday)>TG1 compressor or Distressor. I can rent either a Royer R121, Coles 4038 Neumann U67, U87. This then to go straight to protools. Going for a true but slight gritty smokey blues bar sound. Altiverb will be in the aftermath most likely because of a shity room that I have, mostly dead.

Thanks guys, just curious about past experiences, thanks.

[zarembo]

ah geez, I don't have all those other cool mics, but every time I hear the trumpet on that one record I did using a single R121 it sure sounds purdy and I'm glad I had it.

[henryrobinett]

I've had a lot of great success with the Royer. I would not use a condensor, though someone here recently said a fairly respected trumpet player uses a 414.

Trumpet generally does much better with a ribbon smoothing things out a bit. Trumpet tends to be very loud and blaring and most condensors will add a brittleness not desired in most cases. I've also used AEA R84, RCA 77dx, Peluso R-14 and an AEA 44, all with great results. All ribbons. I've sure the Coles would be great as well, but I've not used it.

[NathanEldred]

The Royer has more push in the midrange, i.e. 1-3k to my ears...the Coles has more of a rounder low end and almost what sounds like an attenuated low midrange. So which curve is more appropriate for you? Really they are both going to be fine, most any ribbon will be they'll all just be different shades.

[jslevin]

Well, it kind of seems like your goal is to have as expensive a chain as possible, so you may not be interested in my suggestions. One of my engineers is also a world-class trumpeter, and he swears by the Beyer m201, hardly ever uses anything else. Hearing the results, I can't argue with him.

Wouldn't hesitate to use the R84, as henryrobinnett says. I've also had great success with the RE-20 or SM7 and (I think) with an MD421. It would be a rare case where I'd want to use a condenser on a trumpet -- and I sure as hell wouldn't start in a room with bad acoustics.

Hey, have you thought about what the best converters would be for trumpet?

JSL

[henryrobinett]

Yes, I agree the Royer has a bit of a bump. So does the AEA. To me they are both a tad hyped in the upper mids. The Peluso isn't, so to me, it sounds more like a true ribbon. A bit darker perhaps. But ribbons take EQ really well, so you're not losing anything. ou can always add the frequencies you might feel you're missing. At least I can and do.

[NathanEldred]

Originally Posted by henryrobinett

So does the AEA. To me they are both a tad hyped in the upper mids.

I always hear the R84 as 'flat' through that midrange region, but it may be because of the offset from the more accentuated low end (as compared to the Royer).

[kingneeraj]

I have had great success recording trumpet using a Coles 4038!

[Art Johan]

Not all trumpet players are the same.
Some can produce an incredibly loud sound which the coles ribbon mic would be a terrible choice for. The aea and Royer can handler higher DBs than the coles.
Also some softer trumpet players playing in the lower registers will sound much better on a condencer mic than a ribbon.
I wouldn't reccomend a mic for you until i heard the player.
AJ

[Sounds Great]

An AKG D3600 (dual diaphragm) dynamic works really great on trumpet. thumbsup



Field Test: AKG Tri-Power Live Sound Microphones

It's a cardioid mic with greatly reduced proximity effect, achieved by using a dual-diaphragm design. The forward element covers frequencies above 500 Hz, while the rear facing element picks up the lows. Both are coupled to a phase-corrected inductive-capacitive crossover network.

[Improv]

Originally Posted by jslevin

One of my engineers is also a world-class trumpeter, and he swears by the Beyer m201, hardly ever uses anything else. Hearing the results, I can't argue with him.
JSL

Reeeeally? Very interesting, I'll have to try that... thanks!

I almost always use a Royer 122 with trumpet. Recently through the germanium it sounded perfect. The 4038 is a bit duller, but with a nice warm roundness. Better suited for flugel I would say.

[T.RayBullard]

Coles 4040...nothing better to my ears.

[PlugHead]

IME,

4038 is made for the trumpet: I haven't heard the 4040 yet (hope to!) but I always choose 4038 over Royer's or AEA - sometimes the slightly forward midrange in a few ribbon mics can often make the trumpet 'stuffy' sounding (when miced close), and if the room isn't great, you can't get the player too far away from the mic before spill becomes unmanageable, or unmusical.

Is the part to be played open, or with mute (harmon, etc.)? If muted, I'd consider the U67 or other great condenser (tube or otherwise) to catch the brilliance of the high harmonic content...

[Bob Olhsson]

A 57 placed a little away from the center of the bell can sound amazing with the right reverb.

Trumpets are loud so you need to be way back to run into troublesome room tone issues. Some of the best trumpet sounds we ever got at Motown were in a very live sounding garage next to the studio where we were cutting strings at the same time. I'd add reflectors and take up any rugs because what you don't want is the trumpeter playing too loud because the room is too dead.

[joaquin]

Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson

A 57 placed a little away from the center of the bell can sound amazing with the right reverb.

[Musiclab]

Lew Soloff likes a fet 47

[Steffmo]

Alan Rubin likes a U47...but he loved the 4038. The 4040 sounds to me like it was designed to make those that wanted a vocal oriented 4038 happy.

[tragedybysyntax]

well maybe i'll add this as well.... the same weekend i'm renting this gear, I'm doing male overdub vocals, an opera singer and a jembe drum. I really dont feel like getting the coles and the royer. I have a Groove Tubes GT55, marshall MXL2001 w/ the marshall small condenser, as well as an SM57. Peace, thanks guys.

[max cooper]

Anyone like M-160 for this?

[FatStudio]

The best trumpet I recorded was with an old B&O ribbon and a neve 1272 ,I might have had the Trakker in there too.thumbsup
About 1 meter away.

[Natural Mystic]

Like everyone has said it's hard to chooes the perfect mic without hearing the trumpet part in the acoustic enviroment it is going to be recorded in. All that aside I would recomend going with the u-67. I have done trumpet and sax recordings with good results thru an u-87 --> tg-2 --> tg-1 --> daw. I would have loved to try the u-67 in my room if one had been available. Distance is your friend with horns, but sometimes the trusted sm-57 a foot off the bell works well.

[PlugHead]

Originally Posted by max cooper

Anyone like M-160 for this?

Actually, yes. I preferred the 160 and 500NC over the Royer R-121.

However, I liked the (Sank) DX modded one best, but it was a bit noisier...

[AmekGuy]

Gefell M930. It works well on trumpet, sax, and flute.

[Greg Curtis]

I'm a pro trumpet player as my primary job and life's work, and I feel that the best answer depends on the what you want to hear. A nice vintage U67, 47, m49 will sound good only with a great sounding player, at a distance, in a great room, and not directly aimed toward the center of the bell (unless the horn is muted). Flugelhorn is really great on LDCs. A ribbon will work great closer to the bell. (Rick Baptist and Malcolm McNab (1st call tpt. players in L.A.) each has his own personal Royer, and they never leave home without it). Cheap dynamic mics are OK with average players, really close, and if the horn is not the soloist, and is going to be blended with other horns and/or strings and pushed back in the mix.

I wouldn't even think about using a Distressor in the recording chain. 1176 will work.

(I personally use a Soundelux e49 into a UA 610 into media.)

Greg

[henryrobinett]

I've done some sessions with Bobby Shew, great trumpet player. His mic of choice is an RCA77dx ribbon. He says that's his favorite. And he plays the hell out of it!

A few years ago, on a session I was both recording and playing on, I put up both the 77dx and a U67. He quietly but insistently indicated the 77. He said, "I've used them all. The U67 ain't bad, but doesn't come close to the 77. If that's all you had I'd have to use the 67. But the RCA77 is my mic! Always on session."

I was surprised he was so conversant with the names of these mics.

[stevep]

Beyer M500 ribbon, sen 421 , 57 , RE20 , No compression or very little going to tape

[Improv]

Originally Posted by Greg Curtis

I'm a pro trumpet player as my primary job and life's work

I wouldn't even think about using a Distressor in the recording chain. 1176 will work.

(I personally use a Soundelux e49 into a UA 610 into media.)

Greg

Nice chain, though I'm curious why on the 1176 and dfegad on the distressor? Is it tone or speed or leveling you're looking for when tracking?

[henryrobinett]

Personally I hate the Distressor. It totally messes up the tone, to me. This mid range honk I hear, always with it. Maybe it works better on electric guitar and certain context drums, but for general acoustic work, yikes. Only my opinion and I'm definitely in the minority here over the Distressor.

[bongo]

I just recorded Randy Brecker. I put up a 67 and a 121 next to each other. When I did the session we listened to the 67. When it came time to mix, I used the Royer. Neither sucked but any mic probably would sound good with him!

[Jim Easton]

Originally Posted by bongo

I just recorded Randy Brecker. I put up a 67 and a 121 next to each other. When I did the session we listened to the 67. When it came time to mix, I used the Royer. Neither sucked but any mic probably would sound good with him!

What was the session like?
What pre did the trick with 121? I love his tone, what will be the cd title?

Have you recorded Mike as well?

Would you please share his mic and pre too please?

thanks-!!