spot mic for a classic guitar
evisto
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#1
27th February 2013
Old 27th February 2013
  #1
Gear nut
 

Thread Starter
spot mic for a classic guitar

I´m looking for a mic to spot a guitar playing classical music with cello and violin, any advice?

evisto

Last edited by evisto; 27th February 2013 at 04:38 PM.. Reason: error
#2
28th February 2013
Old 28th February 2013
  #2
Lives for gear
Dpa 4011. Schoeps cmc64. Neumann km131 or km140. Akg c481 or c414b uls.

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#3
28th February 2013
Old 28th February 2013
  #3
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Plush's Avatar
Here, I think that a ribbon mic is your friend.

It is totally pro to use an AEA R84 or a Coles 4038.

Classic pick up, classic sound. Figure 8 pattern isolates the guitar.
#4
1st March 2013
Old 1st March 2013
  #4
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Lotus 7's Avatar
Milab DC-196 (set to "cardioid") with it's horizontal axis aligned with the guitar strings. Narrow vertical pick-up angle, but typical cardioid in the horizontal plane.

Second choice, Sennheiser 8040.
#5
1st March 2013
Old 1st March 2013
  #5
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adirondack's Avatar
U89? Tlm193?
evisto
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#6
1st March 2013
Old 1st March 2013
  #6
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Thread Starter
Thanks for your advices.
I am between mkh 8040 and km 140. What's your opinión?

Evisto
#7
1st March 2013
Old 1st March 2013
  #7
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Lotus 7's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by evisto View Post
Thanks for your advices.
I am between mkh 8040 and km 140. What's your opinión?

Evisto
MKH 8040 has a cleaner top end and is 3 dB quieter.
KM 140 has a pretty red diamond badge.
#8
1st March 2013
Old 1st March 2013
  #8
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Sheikyearbouti's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plush View Post
Here, I think that a ribbon mic is your friend.

It is totally pro to use an AEA R84 or a Coles 4038.

Classic pick up, classic sound. Figure 8 pattern isolates the guitar.
I would add to this list Sennheiser MKH30 - I am diggin a lot this mic for spots. And as said above, fig 8 can help really a lot to isolate the instrument.

OP, I guess you talking about recording situations, not PA amplification?
#9
1st March 2013
Old 1st March 2013
  #9
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Mats H's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by evisto View Post
Thanks for your advices.
I am between mkh 8040 and km 140. What's your opinión?

Evisto
I like both. I've used the MKH40 for cello lately in classical pickups and KM140 for pop. The KM140 seems more articulate and accentuates the details, while the MKH40 seems more full bodied and not as forward. This is before EQ. The MKH40 is a bit quieter, which might affect your recording depending on where you record. Both are great.
#10
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #10
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When I recorded a Saffire concert way back (Australian guitar quartet, Leonard Grigoryan, Slava Grigoryan, Gareth Koch, Karin Schaupp) I turned up with a MKH30/40 MS rig and they turned up with an MKH40 each for the PA. Some kind of recommendation I guess.
#11
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #11
Gear Head
 

TLM-103 has a great sharpness to it. I love using it on classical and acoustic in general.



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#12
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #12
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king2070lplaya's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonetank View Post
TLM-103 has a great sharpness to it. I love using it on classical and acoustic in general.
!
#13
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #13
Gear Head
 

I'm using the Line Audio Design CM3 which I find fantastic on classical guitar.
#14
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #14
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Sheikyearbouti's Avatar
 

The problem with all mentioned cardioids (TLM103, mkh40, CM3, etc.) is that they will pick up hell lot from the sides, where most probably the other two instrument are going to be situated. To get less spill (ore control) you will need to move closer to the instrument - hence get not an idea sound for classical guitar. With a good fig 8 you will pick up more reverb, less spill and can pit the mic slightly further back - to me this sounds like a more desirable scenario.

The MKH30 stays very well balanced in terms of low end even at distance.
#15
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #15
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheikyearbouti View Post
The problem with all mentioned cardioids (TLM103, mkh40, CM3, etc.) is that they will pick up hell lot from the sides, where most probably the other two instrument are going to be situated. To get less spill (ore control) you will need to move closer to the instrument - hence get not an idea sound for classical guitar. With a good fig 8 you will pick up more reverb, less spill and can pit the mic slightly further back - to me this sounds like a more desirable scenario.

The MKH30 stays very well balanced in terms of low end even at distance.
That's the first reasonable argument for a mic I've heard in a long time. Very refreshing.

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evisto
Thread Starter
#16
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #16
Gear nut
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheikyearbouti View Post
The problem with all mentioned cardioids (TLM103, mkh40, CM3, etc.) is that they will pick up hell lot from the sides, where most probably the other two instrument are going to be situated. To get less spill (ore control) you will need to move closer to the instrument - hence get not an idea sound for classical guitar. With a good fig 8 you will pick up more reverb, less spill and can pit the mic slightly further back - to me this sounds like a more desirable scenario.

The MKH30 stays very well balanced in terms of low end even at distance.
I have never used a fig 8 as you say. How would I use It?

Last edited by evisto; 2nd March 2013 at 08:19 PM.. Reason: My englishIt is not good
#17
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #17
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Sheikyearbouti's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonetank View Post
That's the first reasonable argument for a mic I've heard in a long time. Very refreshing.
Thanks - if I could only had typed that without the tons of typos - sorry, sent it from my phone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by evisto View Post
I have never used a fig 8 as you say. How would I use It?
There is a lot in this section of GS on fig8s and the MKH30 in particular. Quite a few things to consider... I would highlight the fact that a lot of fig8 mics sound really thin at distance (check proximity effect). In the past I had tried unsuccessfully to spot with Schoeps MK8 - I had to apply a lot of EQ to boost the low end. But the MKH30 doesn't have this problem, regardless of how this is being achieved (again you can ready a lot about this in the Remote section - many arguments!).

The good thing about fig8s is also the quality of spill - it just sounds very good (especially single diaphragm mics).

As how to use it - have a look at the polar pattern of any fig8: you get sound from the front and the back, but attenuate a lot form the sides (obviously incl. the top and bottom). This is where you would want to have the offending sources to reduce spill.

I do this all the time - classical, rock, whatever. Last week I did 3 sessions of small classical groups and all ended up with MKH30 as spots (violin, classical guitar, harpsichord, gamba...). But also for rock I also love this technique on Toms for example.

What Plush was suggesting is to go for a ribbon. Those are also fig8 but are a different beast with a different sound - some call their sound duller, others softer. Whatever it is, they surly can be very useful for closer miking of acoustic instruments where the harshness of proximity is desired to be avoided.
evisto
Thread Starter
#18
2nd March 2013
Old 2nd March 2013
  #18
Gear nut
 

Thread Starter
And what about neumann km 120?
#19
3rd March 2013
Old 3rd March 2013
  #19
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Sheikyearbouti's Avatar
 

Never used it. The good thing about is that you can get different capsules for different applications.
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