First multitrack location recording ever?

[OzGizmo]

History of multitrack recording - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Roland]

Originally Posted by elyr

Hi All,
I have a question for the historians out there, which is proving quite challenging to answer.

What is the first instance of multitrack live recording ever?

At first I thought it might be The Rolling Stones "got LIVE if you want it!" produced by Glyn Johns in 1965, but I suspect location recordings by RCA or Decca might have recorded in concert halls in front of a live audience. To clarify, I am NOT referring to multi-mic'ing and recording to stereo.

Any help would be greatly appreciated! Publications of any kind, including technical papers documenting this, would be fantastic.

Thanks in advance!

I suspect that Robert Fine's "mobile" studio was probably the first Multitrack recording system in that it had 3 tracks, (around 1958), however, I'm taking a guess that is not quite what you meant.

I suspect that the Rolling Stones Mobile probably did the first "live" multitrack recordings. Originally 8 track it was upgraded to 16 around 1969-1970. you mentioned Decca, however, they were known for a direct to two track approach, even for opera. Deutsche Gramophone multitracked, but not that early to my knowledge.

Hope this helps.

[Rolo 46]

Yes, Bob Fine and his 10,000 Valve Chevvy mobile had a Westrex 3 track 35mm Mag sprocket recorder and two Ampex stereos in the late 50's.
And it was indeed mobile,he brought it to the UK with his wife, to record English orchestras,aided by his wife and the great Bob Auger.
Westrex had 3 track portable mag recorders in trucks for movie recording,these ran on interlock systems with the 35mm camera,and were probably the first mobile multis in the late 40s.
Disney used multi track optical 35mm recorders for Fantasia in 1939,these were 'transportable' not portable, but could be the first location multitracks.

[boojum]

If you want to count stereo as multitrack, and I think that is fair, there is a Duke Ellington recording from the '30's where two mics were on feeding two recorders:

1932 Duke Ellington Stereo: Was It Unheard-of Experiment Or Accident? - Chicago Tribune

http://benbeck.co.uk/firsts/sound2.htm

[thunderbolt]

Originally Posted by boojum

If you want to count stereo as multitrack, and I think that is fair, there is a Duke Ellington recording from the '30's where two mics were on feeding two recorders:

1932 Duke Ellington Stereo: Was It Unheard-of Experiment Or Accident? - Chicago Tribune

First stereo sound recording

Makes me think about the Ellington Fargo, ND 1940 recording made by two amateurs who were cutting lacquer on the dance floor--remarkable recording given the limitations of 78 rpm home recording technology.

[king2070lplaya]

Originally Posted by boojum

If you want to count stereo as multitrack, and I think that is fair, there is a Duke Ellington recording from the '30's where two mics were on feeding two recorders:

1932 Duke Ellington Stereo: Was It Unheard-of Experiment Or Accident? - Chicago Tribune

http://benbeck.co.uk/firsts/sound2.htm

So cool! Thanks for posting

[elyr]

Wow, fantastic! Thanks everyone!
I have been doing some digging into the first portable recording equipment. Looks like the first portable recorder to go into production was a Magnemite, developed by sound recordist and Cornell researcher Peter Paul Kellogg. Kellogg would go on to record for Moses Asch's Folkways label. Also, the first commercial stereo records were made by Emory Cook, whose collection is now sold by Smithsonian Folkways Recordings. Pretty cool finds I think!

[Rolo 46]

That was only in America and full track mono
The Germans had transportable stereo in 43.
Kudelski had full track portable mono in 51.

[celticrogues]

Originally Posted by boojum

If you want to count stereo as multitrack, and I think that is fair, there is a Duke Ellington recording from the '30's where two mics were on feeding two recorders:

1932 Duke Ellington Stereo: Was It Unheard-of Experiment Or Accident? - Chicago Tribune

http://benbeck.co.uk/firsts/sound2.htm

That's really cool!
-Mike

[boojum]

Originally Posted by elyr

Also, the first commercial stereo records were made by Emory Cook, whose collection is now sold by Smithsonian Folkways Recordings. Pretty cool finds I think!

True, but a different principle. Two sets of mono tracks and a special adapter for your phono arm to carry the second phono cartridge half the record over. I had some, I may still have. Emory Cook was a strange bird living in Stamford, CT. One of his records was Speed the Parting Guest and was a collection of quasi musical cacaphony. The cartridge was a clip on. See here: Emory Cook binaural

And as the page notes, he was buddy-buddy with Rudy Bozak who built enormous infinite baffle speakers. Cook eventually built one in the ground by his house in Stamford which was huge and handle just the bass nots, It was a "folder horn" of cast cement.

[elyr]

Originally Posted by Rolo 46

That was only in America and full track mono
The Germans had transportable stereo in 43.
Kudelski had full track portable mono in 51.

Could you tell me a bit more about the transportable stereo that was developed in Germany?

[Rolo 46]

Excerpt of 1944 stereo tape recording with Bruckner Berliner Staatsoper and Karajan (8th Symphony) - YouTube

AEG, here is a stereo recording from '43

[elyr]

Wow, this is all great. Does anyone know of a web site or publication that has consolidated all of these recording innovations?

[JoeDeF]

Originally Posted by Rolo 46

Excerpt of 1944 stereo tape recording with Bruckner Berliner Staatsoper and Karajan (8th Symphony) - YouTube

Wow, Rolo - outstanding! Thanks for posting!

[boojum]

Originally Posted by Rolo 46

That was only in America and full track mono
The Germans had transportable stereo in 43.
Kudelski had full track portable mono in 51.

Rolo, OP asked for first multitrack location recording. America still counts as a location to some of us so that does not disqualify the Ellington recording nor was there a requirement that it be tape, with both tracks on the same tape. You are changing the rules.

[Rolo 46]

Originally Posted by boojum

Rolo, OP asked for first multitrack location recording. America still counts as a location to some of us so that does not disqualify the Ellington recording nor was there a requirement that it be tape, with both tracks on the same tape. You are changing the rules.

Sorry Sandy ,
The Ellington is just a lucky accident,two lathes running unlocked and staying just in sync ,compared to 2 tracks locked on one roll of magnetic tape and using a dedicated stereo mic feed (what array did they use ?),also doing this in the midsts of 1000 bomber raids deserves notice!
Roger

[boojum]

Originally Posted by Rolo 46

Sorry Sandy ,
The Ellington is just a lucky accident,two lathes running unlocked and staying just in sync ,compared to 2 tracks locked on one roll of magnetic tape and using a dedicated stereo mic feed (what array did they use ?),also doing this in the midsts of 1000 bomber raids deserves notice!
Roger

Roger, I don't deny that. The Germans were very clever with the technology and we all built on it. When someone was trying to explain magnetic tape to Congress one congressman said, "You mean it's just barn paint on a piece of plastic?" Well, as a matter of fact that's just what it is. LOL Bless his heart to be able to get to the nubbin of it.

But, accident or not, it seems the correct answer to OP's question. It was a bit of serendipity, and no one knew for decades. Oh, well. What else awaits us? After all, did Fleming plan penicillin or stumble onto it? If he had eaten his lunches in the cafeteria we might never have had such a wonderful medicine.

Cheers

[elyr]

Thanks again everyone, this are really interesting events you've dug up. The Ellington recording especially: it might not be the first intentional multi track, but it's certainly a valuable anecdote!