Login / Register
 
advice on hanging stereo mic/pre pair for hall
New Reply
Subscribe
ersheff
Thread Starter
#1
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #1
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
advice on hanging stereo mic/pre pair for hall

Howdy.
I'm a somewhat experienced audio amateur, primarily in studio recording and not live/remote recording, that's in a technology position in the college of arts at a small state university.
We've got some money available (oh happy day!) to improve the recording setup in our main recital hall. (I should mention that recording/audio is not my main thing here, but I'm trying to help out)
Currently, we have a pair of old U87's hanging in the hall just in front of the stage in an ORTF arrangement. They go into the built-in pres on a MOTU 828 mkII.
There is a faculty member on campus that has a pair of Earthworks QTC40's and the Earthworks 1024 pre that sometimes does recordings for music faculty performances. Everyone is really happy with the sound of his product, so we naturally gravitated towards that same gear to upgrade our recital hall system.
However, I'm wondering if a hanging pair of omni mics is really the best idea.
It's a pretty live hall.
(I should also mention that we're planning to take the U87's down, have them serviced, and then use them primarily as spot mics)
I'm sure there are a million opinions on this, but I'm looking for input on another good pair to hang in ORTF.
Schoeps MK21 wide cardioid have come up as a possibility I saw in another thread.
Also, is that Earthworks pre a good option? We're looking for super clean and quiet with plenty of gain. We've got other options for "color" if needed, and that's not really what we want out of this system anyway.
Wish we had the luxury of trying out a bunch of stuff, but as I said, no one here really does this full time, and I'm just trying to help spend this surprise money on something we need.
#2
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #2
Lives for gear
 
John Willett's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Posts: 7,894

John Willett is offline
I would have suggested Sennheiser MKH 8000 series, especially of the hall can get cold and have condensation.

Also - an RF condenser does not attract dust and contaminants to the diaphragm by electrostatic action like normal condensers do - so an MKH 8000 series (8020 omni, 8040 cardioid or 8090 wide-cardioid) would be ideal if the mics are to be hung and left there.
__________________
John Willett
Sound-Link ProAudio Ltd.
Circle Sound Services

President - Fédération Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons

(and lots more - please look at my Profile)
#3
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #3
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Apr 2003
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 3,612

fifthcircle is offline
I don't always agree with John, but in this case, I agree with what he said 100%.

My 8040's have turned into one of the most often used mics that I own, especially in live spaces. The imaging- both left to right as well as front to back is second to none.

Subcardiods (ie MK21) are great (another favorite mic of mine), but in a live room, they can be problematic, allowing too much ambience into a recording. Just like with omnis.

John's comments about dust are another important one if they are going to be hung permanently. Many mics will attract dust and over time that will become an issue for maintenance as well as sound. The Sennheisers perform very well in this aspect.

--Ben
__________________
Benjamin Maas
Fifth Circle Audio
Long Beach, CA
http://www.fifthcircle.com
ersheff
Thread Starter
#4
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #4
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
Thanks so much for the advice!
I'm actually formulating an email to our salesperson at Full Compass right now with the hopes of being able to try a few things out.
Going to put the 8040's at the top of the list, with some Schoeps and Earthworks to boot.
Any pre advice?
We're most likely going with an Apogee Symphony I/O, possibly with the additional Apogee pres. Also looking at the Earthworks 1024, Schoeps VSR5, True P2, etc.
Basically a 2-4 channel super nice external pre to add to the Apogee system.
Looking for clean and low noise with plenty of gain... typical chamber music requirements!
It's kind of making my head spin because it's an area I don't know much about (I've used and heard the glory of some UA, Avalon, Vintech, but those are different, more pop/color oriented pres).

EDIT: Whoops, VERY important to add that we're looking to spend about $6500 max street for the pres and mics. So $3000 or so for the 2-4 channel pre is a soft limit.
#5
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jul 2011
Location: Stroud,Glos,UK
Posts: 2,154

Rolo 46 is online now
If they really are 'old' U87s they a well worth taking down and having a capsule clean
Good 60s U87 go for £2k ish here.

No problems with Senny 8000 mic outputs,they might drive a line in on Wagner Weekend.
ersheff
Thread Starter
#6
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #6
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolo 46 View Post
If they really are 'old' U87s they a well worth taking down and having a capsule clean
Don't worry, that's the plan.
Just had a conversation with one of the jazz instructors.
Since the big band performs in that hall, we talked about maybe throwing up the U87's in the hall instead of using whatever hanging mics we end up going with.
#7
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #7
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Apr 2003
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 3,612

fifthcircle is offline
I would choose the Forssell SMP-2 over any of the pres you have listed. The 3 dimensional, transparent yet musical representation is something I don't think I've heard anywhere else. I love Millennia, Grace and a bunch of the other transparent pres out there, but there is something special about the SMP2.

The DAV BG2 also gets a lot of press here on GS. I enjoy mine- transparent, but a little bit slower transient response than my Forssell or Grace. A slightly warmer sound that provides a very musical reproduction. You shouldn't ever get a sterlie recording with these. Build quality isn't as good as some of the others, but the sound is quite definitely top notch. Price is also right.

I also am a huge fan of the A Designs Pacifica. I use it for main pair work on classical and jazz recording on a regular basis. It has transformers which definitely have a sound, but it works really well on a variety of sources (I usually will put either Schoeps MK21 or Sennheiser 8040s through them when using it for classical work). There is a warmth to the sound with it but it is't overly fat/colored/etc... When a loud sound hit it, the little bit of transformer saturation is very pleasant and gives a certain impact to the recording.

--Ben
#8
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #8
Lives for gear
 
hbphotoav's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: NashVegas
Posts: 1,522

hbphotoav is online now
As someone who part-times acoustic capture and, thus, is budget conscious, I can agree wholeheartedly with the direction of this thread. I own and use a D.A.V. BG 8, and Sennheiser MKH8040s (along with DPA4061s, Gefell M296s and Neumann TLM193s) and, like as not, my go-to is a small array of M296 omnis spread to about 30cm with a ORTF of the Sennheisers on one mic bar. Can usually get to a very nice blend in most any situation.

My one "wish I had" at this point would be a Gordon Model 5... It's the only mic amp I've heard that would be a viable add to the BG 8 for what I usually record. Maybe when the house is paid off...

HB
__________________
Harry Butler
Photography • Videography • Audio Visual Production
www.harrybutlerphotoav.com
#9
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #9
Gear addict
 
roonsbane's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Posts: 457

roonsbane is offline
As someone who worked at a conservatory, recording in its 4 halls, 5 days a week for 8 years. Let me suggest a "real" infrastructure improvement that will give you many needed recording options. Before anything else, you should invest in servo reelers as seen here:
Welcome to Servoreeler Systems

These are remote controlled reeler systems that drop from the ceiling and allow you to change the configuration depending on the material being recorded. They come in many configurations and sizes. They have tiny cabling that is very discreet. The reels have a continuous wire of cable so the connection is always solid. We had 10 in the ceiling before I left and I believe they added 6 more after I left. We also had 2 in the ceiling in another hall.

To give it flexibility, the cables have a clip 3 feet from the bottom. This can clip on a 1 meter bar, or even 2 meter bar, giving you the ability to come up with many, many configurations. They are spaced in precise spots from the ceiling so that you have a drop as Main pair, Flanks, Wind spot and Choir spot behind, plus whatever else makes sense. We then had a pull line from the stage, connected to a V configuration string on the 1 meter bar that moved the whole rig up stage and downstage. Same thing in the wind pair location. There were 5 other pull lines for pulling mics up and down stage. There were also pull lines for left to right positioning.

We also had remote controlled grace preamps up in the ceiling just after the reelers feeding a Prism Dream A/D which was perhaps 200ft down the line in the basement control room. Flexibility is key here. Especially when the hall sometimes hosts the big band, as well as orchestra. After This upgrade, microphones and pre's are mostly just semantics if you make reasonable purchases. Meaning any competent engineer will be able to make a great recording, if the performers and hall are great.
Good luck!
Cameron
ersheff
Thread Starter
#10
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #10
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
roonsbane- Thanks so much for your input!
Changes to the hall itself are definitely part of the overall plans.
There are some weird situations right now in terms of our funding options (combination of grant, donations, college funds, etc) that require us to do different upgrades at different times. This hall actually used to have at least a curtain system on the side walls (years ago), so I'm hoping we can at least replace that.
#11
23rd October 2012
Old 23rd October 2012
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Plush's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: EARS/Chicago
Posts: 5,450

Plush is offline
In general, spend the most money on your mics. The mics should be the best ones that you can possibly afford. Then purchase a d.a.v. electronics Broadhusrst Gardens No. 2. This outstanding Decca mic preamplifier is the best available.

I say purchase 4 microphones. 2 cardioid and 2 omni. Sennheiser 8000 series are good as are the Neumann KM100 series. I especially endorse the Neumann KM 131 omni mic. (NOT diffuse field) Also the KM 140 mic is incredible.

The way to determine where to hang your microphones is to make a 1 month experiment with the mics on stands. Set up a pair on a stereo bar and move this stand around on stage and in the auditorium. Experiment with height (start at 10 feet tall) and distance from the stage. Usually one will have very good luck by positioning the stereo pair behind the conductor as a start. Then move back to include some bloom of the hall sound.

Then, when you feel you have a very useable universal mic position, that is where you duplicate that position with your hang.

The microphones are MUCH more important than the mic preamps. However, together, both being good, you will triumph in capturing a major stereo picture
__________________
Atelier HudSonic, Chicago

EARS-Chicago, Engineering And Recording Society

http://www.ears-chicago.org/
Deaf before Dishonor

http://soundcloud.com/hudson-fair
#12
24th October 2012
Old 24th October 2012
  #12
Gear addict
 
roonsbane's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Posts: 457

roonsbane is offline
Mic placement will be key. Much more important than what mic, is where you put it, accepting the absolute crap. If you believe you can find that one "magic" placement for every group regardless of music style, size, placement on stage, etc. etc, there you go. If on the other hand, you want to be ready for a wind ensemble one night, orchestra the next, jazz quartet another, jazz orchestra, percussion recitals with four different setups in each quadrant of the stage, thousands of string quartets, or A tribute to Joni Mitchell or Stevie wonder from the Contemporary Improve department with each of these groups on the same concert, then you will be prepared for a proper mic placement. Then you will give yourself a decent flexible rig. After that you can read a thousand posts on gearslutz to spend all of your money, and float your boat to give the flavor of sonic "wood" you desire. This would be doing it right.
Cameron
#13
24th October 2012
Old 24th October 2012
  #13
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jul 2011
Location: Stroud,Glos,UK
Posts: 2,154

Rolo 46 is online now
Lovely servo system with hardly any cable in sight for 6 microphones
Amazing
Is it star quad though?
Howabout safety chains ?
The thought of leaving wonderful mics hanging in dusty/humid/damp spaces terrifies me.
Ive seen ribbons come down from theatre rigs after many years
Not a pretty sight.
However with these (obviously expensive arrays) mic can be derigged with ease.
Superb for the well funded orchs,halls and Academia.
#14
24th October 2012
Old 24th October 2012
  #14
Gear addict
 
roonsbane's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Posts: 457

roonsbane is offline
It is not star quad cable, but this is not a problem, even near the famous prudential tower antenna. This is notoriously a bad spot in the city of Boston, but we never had a problem except for once or twice in eight years having to re-solder a new XLR on. This is not an easy solder by the way. It is tiny cable. You will not need safety cables. We had on many occasions as many as 6 mics on a two meter bar with two of those being U89's, with 2 of the cables doing most of the lifting and 4 others clipping on to the bar to clean up and get to the other mics. It is great for A/Bing mics, doing extremely complex hangs over the middle of orchestra's, or multiple hangs for multiple placement of groups on stage. The hall was a national historic landmark so folks could be uptight about looks. Nothing humid/ or damp about it, except for considerable dust above the 100+ year old plaster. I climbed out of that ceiling just disgusting a few times.

At the end of the night it takes just a few minutes to remove all of the mics. This is the benchmark system in a great recording hall. Boston Symphony hall, on the next street corner, and also designed by architect Edmund M. Wheelwright was getting a quote for 47 reelers last I knew. I don't know whether they were ever installed. By the way, I believe a stereo reeler system is around $5000 if I am remembering correctly.
Cameron
#15
25th October 2012
Old 25th October 2012
  #15
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Location: West Hollywood, USA
Posts: 1,608

chris319 is offline
Right under your nose:

CM3 - really THAT good?

There are other very good bang-for-the buck mics. These have variable pickup patterns (the Rode and Oktava by swapping capsules).

Oktava MK012 Small Diaphragm Multi-Capsule Condenser

Shure Americas | Microphones, Wireless Systems, Headphones, Earphones

R

Fixed pickup pattern:

Audio-Technica - Microphones, headphones, wireless microphone systems, noise-cancelling headphones & more : AT4021 Cardioid Condenser Microphone

Audio-Technica - Microphones, headphones, wireless microphone systems, noise-cancelling headphones & more : AT4022 Omnidirectional Condenser Microphone

I hate to see schools blow their funds on a "golden goose egg" piece of equipment, i.e. a super-high-priced mic pair or preamp and not have funds left for other important pieces of gear. The stark reality is that you're not recording the London Symphony for commercial distribution and you're not recording motion picture scores, so keep things in perspective.

Quote:
I believe a stereo reeler system is around $5000 if I am remembering correctly.
Leaving $1,500 of his stated $6,500 budget for mics and preamps.
ersheff
Thread Starter
#16
25th October 2012
Old 25th October 2012
  #16
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris319 View Post
I hate to see schools blow their funds on a "golden goose egg" piece of equipment, i.e. a super-high-priced mic pair or preamp and not have funds left for other important pieces of gear. The stark reality is that you're not recording the London Symphony for commercial distribution and you're not recording motion picture scores, so keep things in perspective.
Yes, HOWEVER, we're also buying things with a very specific allotment of funds with the intention that they last us decades (as the U87's currently hanging in the hall have). This is a big part of why we've decided to go with high-end outboard pres and mics and a high-end, relatively new Apogee system (that will likely be supported much longer than less expensive interfaces).
We'll also have this nice yet compact rig on mobile furniture so that it can be used elsewhere in the building as needed.
In addition, we are chasing other funds in order to upgrade the other aspects of the hall.
$15k won't give you much of a "total package" upgrade (sound treatment, recording equipment, installed PA), but it WILL buy a pretty damn nice recording rig. I've seen WAY too many instances on this campus where corners were cut, only to have to scramble and spend more money to fix the myriad problems that result from cheaping out in the first place.
These are YOUR tax dollars at work. Wouldn't you rather see them spent on long-lasting investments (some perhaps even made in the USA)?
ersheff
Thread Starter
#17
25th October 2012
Old 25th October 2012
  #17
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris319;8386761[url=http://www.shure.com/americas/products/microphones/ksm/ksm141-dual-pattern-instrument-microphone
Shure Americas | Microphones, Wireless Systems, Headphones, Earphones[/url]
I should also add that we have other, less expensive gear (including some Shures!) as part of "phase 2" for these upgrades. The expensive stuff will be the centerpiece of a larger system, fleshed out with more reasonably priced (but still good) equipment.
#18
25th October 2012
Old 25th October 2012
  #18
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Location: West Hollywood, USA
Posts: 1,608

chris319 is offline
Shure has been around for decades and will likely be around for decades to come. So will Audio Technica and probably Oktava and Rode. You've succumbed to the myth that the more expensive something is, the better or more durable it must be. If you want to buy a $4,000 Schoeps pair instead of a $400 Shure mic on the theory that there is a correlation between price and durability then by all means do.
ersheff
Thread Starter
#19
25th October 2012
Old 25th October 2012
  #19
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
Was not intended as a comment on durability of Shure, Rode, etc.
We have lots of Rodes and Shures and Studio Projects as well and have for a while.
Was meant more as a... hmmm... "We don't want to feel like we have to upgrade again in 5 years as the program expands and new performers and people with new ears come in. Let's go all out (as much as our budget allows)."
This is also why we're trying to acquire multiple demo units that range from $1,000-3,000. We'll try them out and even put up some of our current mics, and if the expensive ones produce little to no improvement over the cheap ones, then we'll go cheap.
I have used KSM 141's and like them. We also own some Earthworks QTC50's.
After using the Earthworks on some sources, I would have a hard time going back to the KSM 141's.
Keep in mind this is a budget that is not taking away from some other area in the college. It is earmarked specifically for this, so saving a few thousand will do us no good as we just wouldn't be able to use that few thousand elsewhere.
Anyway, it's our business how we decide to invest our resources. Multiple people are being consulted on the project, not just internet forums and reviews!
If it were my own personal money, then I would go for the $500/pair mics. But that's because I don't have access to larger funds and am not a university that hosts a digital media program with a large audio component in addition to a full music department.
#20
25th October 2012
Old 25th October 2012
  #20
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Location: West Hollywood, USA
Posts: 1,608

chris319 is offline
Quote:
it's our business how we decide to invest our resources
You came here soliciting advice and I gave it to you.
#21
25th October 2012
Old 25th October 2012
  #21
Gear maniac
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 189

matthewd is offline
Hi there

We've done a lot of installs in the UK with Servoreeler which is a very good option and may not be that expensive depending on the height of your drop. You can retract to 'service level' and take the mics off if you are worried about their longevity although we've got a lot of DPAs in rather hostile cathedral roof spaces and nothing to report so far.

If you are state side, you can probably benefit from speaking to the horse's mouth so to speak - Claude at Servoreeler who basically IS Servoreeler. If you wanted starquad, I expect he could do it - the cable that comes standard isn't. The only issues we have had were with DPA old style compact mics where there was a portion of unbalanced cable susceptible to the odd GSM signal.

You or somebody asked about safety and the safest scenario is probably a stereo bar set up in which case if one side fails, the other kevlar reinforced cable would take the strain.

Hope you find a solution

Matt
ersheff
Thread Starter
#22
25th October 2012
Old 25th October 2012
  #22
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris319 View Post
You came here soliciting advice and I gave it to you.
Yup, sorry. You are correct.
I sounded snarky, and that was uncalled for on my part.
I was just trying to make it clear that we already have things in the range of what you've suggested, including Shure and Audio Technica mics, and we're looking for the next level above that.
And the only reason we are even aware of the level above that is because we've had the good fortune to acquire some of those products in our audio production facilities in the communication department (which is outside of the music department facilities).
Going from the built-in pres of our old 002 to a pair of Vintechs was mind blowing for those of us that had not already had that kind of experience!
Anyway, so far we've got about $15k to spend on gear, and then IN ADDITION we're applying for a grant of at least that same amount to make facility upgrades, including modular sound treatment and possibly some sort of servo system. We're going to bring in a professional outside company to have a look at that end of things and help with the design.
#23
26th October 2012
Old 26th October 2012
  #23
Gear addict
 
roonsbane's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Posts: 457

roonsbane is offline
I am remembering that after the reelers were approaching 20 years old. Claude did have to replace the rubber bands, which are more like engine belts. When we would have 2 or 3 mics, with one being a particularly heavy mic being held up by 1 reeler, some would very slowly slip down over about 15 minutes. Very gently! After the bands were changed they were very tight again for years. By the way, the mics are generally in a mic clip. The cable is attached on stereo bars of different lengths and the bars hold the mic clips. Then the mic is also attached by XLR. It is very safe. There is absolutely no way for the reeler to just let go. Expensive and heavy mics went up on the reelers with no problems.

In the three smaller halls we had an apogee MiniMe Mic pre A/D feeding a computer and simultaneous safety recorder. Then each hall had a pair of schoeps MK5's. This was easy enough to teach our student interns to record many recitals. We originally had 3 sets of KM86's which of course were beautiful mics. The problem was on solo violin recitals, noise could be a bit of an issue, so we sold them while they were worth a hell of a lot of cash and got more Schoeps.
Cameron
#24
26th October 2012
Old 26th October 2012
  #24
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Apr 2003
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 3,612

fifthcircle is offline
Those reelers are indeed really cool. I remember something like that at the Sydney Opera House when I went there years ago to record. It was incredibly easy to position mics (3 cables for each point) by moving the cables from a control pannel right on stage.

That being said, I do a similar positioning system when I hang my mics but do it manually. Requires a bit of stair climbing, but it works beautifully. I put my mic cables and pull lines though a pulley system made from climbing pulleys. They tend to be larger and easier to rig, they are strength rated and the nylon wheels on them tend to not bind on anything. Heck, most of my pulleys can handle a 4 pair cable for a decca tree. I also put it together for a couple hundred dollars with parts from Sport Challet and REI. More recently, I added bergers with eye bolts for tying my mics to theatrical pipe or truss.

As for the shure/AT vs. Schoeps argument. You of course have valid mics from all of these manufacturers, but once you use the quality stuff, it is hard to go back to the mid-level gear. If you are very sensitive to every bit of coloration to your rig (and yes, all mics- even the "transparent" ones- color), then there are places where those other mics just fall short. I'll still use them for spot mics and for certain uses like that, but you'll never see me putting up Shure or AT to replace Neumann, DPA, Schoeps or Sennheiser.

When I work with educational institutions, I will always recommend to purchase the best stuff you can afford. It is better to have less and have it be of the highest quality than to have a lot of stuff that you're just going to have to re-purchase. In the end, you either spend more money or you don't get the money and you have a rig that you'll never be completely happy with. Good gear never goes bad and it retains value much better if you see a need to move a different direction in a few years.

--Ben
ersheff
Thread Starter
#25
27th October 2012
Old 27th October 2012
  #25
Lives for gear
 
ersheff's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 580

Thread Starter
ersheff is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthcircle View Post
When I work with educational institutions, I will always recommend to purchase the best stuff you can afford. It is better to have less and have it be of the highest quality than to have a lot of stuff that you're just going to have to re-purchase. In the end, you either spend more money or you don't get the money and you have a rig that you'll never be completely happy with. Good gear never goes bad and it retains value much better if you see a need to move a different direction in a few years.
This is kind of the approach we're taking here.
In my limited (entering my third year in the position) experience, cheaping out has wreaked havoc all over our college. I'm speaking mostly of projects that were completed or proposed before I started there, and the fallout dealing with those issues has been maddening.
There are of course exceptions. We purchase less expensive interfaces and mics where appropriate, depending upon their use. Also, while the general attitude is to get the absolute best you can with the money available, the one area where I think that's a bad idea is computers!
That's a unique situation where there is a fairly consistent amount of money every year for computer purchases, but in general, no matter how expensive they were initially, computers are pretty worthless (from an institutional standpoint with a centralized IT department) after more than a few years. Due to OS upgrades and machines becoming unsupported or out of warranty (no money for repairs) after only 3-5 years. Here I think it makes more sense to by more midrange machines every year so that labs/faculty can get upgrades more often.
#26
27th October 2012
Old 27th October 2012
  #26
Gear maniac
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 189

matthewd is offline
Re Sydney Opera House, I've not had the pleasure but it is my understanding this is not Servoreeler. I think like a lot of places in the Pacific rim this was a manufacturer called Hyfax which is comparitively very chunky in comparison to Servoreeler. Hyfax got bought by Yamaha who did nothing with it and it disappeared from the market.

Matt
#27
18th November 2012
Old 18th November 2012
  #27
Gear nut
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 123

JazzSax_UT is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by roonsbane View Post
As someone who worked at a conservatory, recording in its 4 halls, 5 days a week for 8 years. Let me suggest a "real" infrastructure improvement that will give you many needed recording options. Before anything else, you should invest in servo reelers as seen here:
Welcome to Servoreeler Systems

These are remote controlled reeler systems that drop from the ceiling and allow you to change the configuration depending on the material being recorded. They come in many configurations and sizes. They have tiny cabling that is very discreet. The reels have a continuous wire of cable so the connection is always solid. We had 10 in the ceiling before I left and I believe they added 6 more after I left. We also had 2 in the ceiling in another hall.

To give it flexibility, the cables have a clip 3 feet from the bottom. This can clip on a 1 meter bar, or even 2 meter bar, giving you the ability to come up with many, many configurations. They are spaced in precise spots from the ceiling so that you have a drop as Main pair, Flanks, Wind spot and Choir spot behind, plus whatever else makes sense. We then had a pull line from the stage, connected to a V configuration string on the 1 meter bar that moved the whole rig up stage and downstage. Same thing in the wind pair location. There were 5 other pull lines for pulling mics up and down stage. There were also pull lines for left to right positioning.

We also had remote controlled grace preamps up in the ceiling just after the reelers feeding a Prism Dream A/D which was perhaps 200ft down the line in the basement control room. Flexibility is key here. Especially when the hall sometimes hosts the big band, as well as orchestra. After This upgrade, microphones and pre's are mostly just semantics if you make reasonable purchases. Meaning any competent engineer will be able to make a great recording, if the performers and hall are great.
Good luck!
Cameron
What a wonderful idea. I've been asked to help set up a recording solution for a private school. This might be just what I'm looking for.
Thanks!
New Reply Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook  Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter  Submit Thread to LinkedIn LinkedIn  Submit Thread to Google+ Google+ 
 
Topic:
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
leon / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music & Location Recording
11
Dange / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music & Location Recording
36
Sticky Shed / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music & Location Recording
23
newyorker42 / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music & Location Recording
8
jnorman / Remote Possibilities in Acoustic Music & Location Recording
4

Forum Jump

SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.