in ear monitors + ear defenders = ?

[sheltersoton]

i hve been considering buying some decent in ear monitors such as shures or similar and then putting on heavey duty defenders or DT100's (with no lead ) to get the audio seperation so i can really hear the difference when adjusting mic's with a loud drummer playing or moving mics infront of cabs etc ... any experience of this?

am i and idiot for thinking it? or will it do the job?

basically i hate the sound of dt100's, they're useless except for seperation for the drummer and lack of leakage when doing vox... i love my dt250's but i cant hear clearly in the room with a crazy drummer rattling around..

what you reckon?

[timotheus]

Before you go to crazy, go to the local hunting arms store, you can get over-the-ear hearing protection there, without an extra cord.

Once upon a time I used cheap earbuds and a pair of hunting muffs, worked alright for me until we got plexiglass and fabric cubicle partitions to create a control room and drum cage...

[DHD]

I have a pair of Shure E5C in ear monitors. Their frequency response is dodgey.

They are not like ear buds. They actually deliver sound through a tube and fit into the ear canal. They come with sleeves that block the ear canal and background sounds are reduced by quite a few dBs.

They are somewhat uncomfortable to wear for long periods and changes in the pressure of the ear canal can cause the sound to change or disappear. So be warned.

If you can demo some then definately compare them to your headphones to hear the difference and try different sleeves on them to find the comfiest fit. If you can try and returm then demo the Etymotic ones as well as the Shure.

Peace,
DHD

[dplitt]

I picked up a pair of Ultimate Ears Super.fi 5 pro's about a year ago for use with my ipod and I love them. They are bi-amped like the Shure E5 but at about half the price(around $250.00) at Guitar Center). Sometimes when I mix live and I have to mix from the side of the stage versus being out in front I will use them for in ear mixing. They have great noise cancellation (moisten the buds before placing in ear for a better seal). A friend that I mix for sometimes tried them at a gig and he liked them so much that he bought a pair and hasn't used his Shure E5's since.

heres the link

http://www.ultimateears.com/

They may may not be for everyone but I love them. Just make sure you moisten the buds a bit before placing them in your ears for a good seal otherwise they could sound a bit tinny. One more thing, the construction seems a bit fragile but looks are deceiving because they have proved to be rugged enough for me.
Good luck

[Bishbashbosh]

Originally Posted by DHD

I have a pair of Shure E5C in ear monitors. Their frequency response is dodgey.

The 'C' in E5C denotes 'consumer'
The regular E5's are still pretty much the industry standard for IEM's and are the drivers used by Ultimate Ears and other boutique IEM providers. They are pretty much the best out there.
However the E5's are much more expensive than the E5C's.

With regards to the original question.... using IEM's with ear defenders is pretty common in the UK for theatre musicians. You can run your monitoring very quietly without hearing tonnes of drums in your head!
The best defenders I've found are the 'Peltor' make, which can be found in most hire shops like HSS (which hire out things like pneumatic drills etc.)
You should be able to find a pair for under £30, and they claim to be able to reduce dB levels by 30-40 dB (perfect for spot placement of the snare mic whilst the drummer is pounding away!!)

[Crash]

The 'C' in E5C denotes 'consumer'

While that is quite true, the only difference between the pro model and consumer is the color. The internals are the same.

[MichaelPatrick]

Reviving this thread because I'm on a quest for two things:

1. Some mixing for on-the-spot "proof" CDs is required and I need max isolation because monitoring in another room isn't always possible.
2. I want to add an IEM transmitter/receiver in order to adjust mics during sound checks. Max isolation will be vital to keep from making things sound worse.

To achieve isolation I'm planning to use in-ear monitors I've had around for a long time (Shure E5C, Etymotic ER4P, or Ultimate Ears TripleFi) with some recently purchased Peltor H10A hearing protectors that I modified to reduce resonance at low-mid frequencies.

Anyone else have experience with monitoring approaches like this? What works for you?

[MichaelPatrick]

fwiw.... I recorded some chamber music today with a choir. Used the Peltor ear protectors with Shure E5C in-ear monitors and was able to mix without much problem.

[Remoteness]

David Tallacksen from WBGO uses 'in-ears' (SE530s or ER-15s) with "construction-style" protectors over them on a monthly basis at the Village Vanguard with excellent results...

[Gutbucket]

Field recording music gigs, I used to fit the highest isolation expanding foam earplugs I could find to my Etymotic ER4S in-ears by punching a hole for the drivers through the foam with a leather punch. Isolation was vastly improved, but low bass isolation improved even further with 'shooter-style' ear protection muffs worn over top of that.

Watch your monitoring levels to protect your hearing.

[Norrie]

Go with Future Sonics in ear monitors I swear by them!

[El Nino]

This thread is way old! Revive!

Do yourself a favor:

Elite Series ES5 Musicians' Monitor | Westone

[MichaelPatrick]

Originally Posted by El Nino

This thread is way old! Revive!

Do yourself a favor:

Elite Series ES5 Musicians' Monitor | Westone

What timing! I just got off the phone getting a quote for this model at a local audiologist. Seems like the right way to go though it's not cheap - $950USD fitted.

[Norrie]

Originally Posted by MichaelPatrick

What timing! I just got off the phone getting a quote for this model at a local audiologist. Seems like the right way to go though it's not cheap - $950USD fitted.

DOnt go with them man!!!!!

Trust me

Future Sonics

The best you can get !

[MichaelPatrick]

Originally Posted by Norrie

DOnt go with them man!!!!!

Trust me

Future Sonics

The best you can get !

Norrie, admittedly I'm persuaded so far only by reputation, user list, and company history. Westone developed the E5C for Shure, and their user list is objectively impressive. Why are you convinced Future Sonics are better?

[MichaelPatrick]

Just ordered a pair of Westone ES5. One thing nice about the Westones is how good they are supposed to be at low levels.

I was persuaded by blog comments on head-fi.org and this review sealed the deal:
https://www.editorsguild.com/FromThe...TheGuildid=176

Custom fit IEMs (25dB ANR) with over-the-ear protection (29db NRR) should provide good isolation for in-the-room mixing.

I went with these Peltor muffs:
http://www.amazon.com/Peltor-H10A-Op...3126642&sr=8-1

[Norrie]

Just as a warning Ive used peltor muffs working in construction they are very uncomfie ;(

[MichaelPatrick]

Originally Posted by Norrie

Just as a warning Ive used peltor muffs working in construction they are very uncomfie ;(

I've used mine now for several outings and they fit fine. Maybe I've got a fat head or something else that makes them work OK for me.

[Bixby]

Originally Posted by Remoteness

David Tallacksen from WBGO uses 'in-ears' (SE530s or ER-15s) with "construction-style" protectors over them on a monthly basis at the Village Vanguard with excellent results...

Just seeing this, thanks for the mention. Indeed I use Peltor muffs along with Shure SE530s. Great isolation, and the Shures are pretty good until my budget allows me to upgrade to the serious IEMs! The Peltors aren't the most comfortable and they do get fatiguing after a while due both to lack of ventilation and the pressure exerted on the head, but I've used the combo successfully everywhere from the Vanguard to the Newport Jazz Festival where I mixed live to broadcast no more than 25 feet from the side of the stage. Definitely good to take a break after an hour or so from the Peltors.

David Tallacksen

[LX3]

Any opinions on the various Ultimate Ears custom molds? They seem to have become the monitor engineer's in-ear of choice, at least here in the UK.

Quite interested in their black "In-Ear Reference" model that they recently brought out.

But I'm never sure how you're supposed to demo them, or compare them to anything else, without buying them.

[MichaelPatrick]

Originally Posted by LX3

Any opinions on the various Ultimate Ears custom molds? They seem to have become the monitor engineer's in-ear of choice, at least here in the UK.

Quite interested in their black "In-Ear Reference" model that they recently brought out.

But I'm never sure how you're supposed to demo them, or compare them to anything else, without buying them.

I have a mid-level pair of universal-fit UEs and think their midrange is a bit cold and brittle. I like Etymotics and even Shure E5C better, though I do use them sometimes for travel listening to a DVD movie player and iPod.

I'm certain the custom UEs are better; they were included in this review and earned a good score:

https://www.editorsguild.com/FromThe...TheGuildid=176

[MichaelPatrick]

Well, I got the Westone ES5s and I can definitely mix with them. They are great at all volume levels, bass and low mids are tight and full. High's are extended, natural and very detailed. They're comfortable too - I've worn them up to 3 hours at a time. They came in a pelican style waterproof case with my name attached.

Very happy