Pianos in small jazz clubs - low end?
AlexK
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#1
2nd March 2012
Old 2nd March 2012
  #1
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Pianos in small jazz clubs - low end?

Hey Guys,

Something that's been bothering me for ages is spill from the upright bass into the piano mics. In order to reduce that 'boominess' you get from the upright spilling into the mics in the piano, I have to start high-passing in the mix, which obviously takes a lot of the lower registers out of the piano.

I was thinking maybe a contact-mic on the sound board, low-passed in the mix could solve this issue, but what do you guys think? Has anybody got any tips they fancy sharing?

Cheers!
Alex
#2
2nd March 2012
Old 2nd March 2012
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I haven't had this problem myself. I always use a pair of cardioids on separate stands, one on the high strings of the piano and one on the low. They are angled to maximize rejection towards the drums/bass. Works well for me.

Might want to search Steve's "virtual gobos" tricks.
#3
2nd March 2012
Old 2nd March 2012
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I,ve tried the akg c411 on the sound board of the piano along with a card. Dynamic mic to get a little ambience. The c411 however was loaded with mids, which I actually did not notch out, but instead de-essed around 800 hz to 1500 hz. Got good results.
#4
3rd March 2012
Old 3rd March 2012
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The Earthworks PianoMic is excellent for live applications, especially if you can close the lid completely and have the FOH and/or Monitor engineer for the venue pump it through the PA.

If it's mainly an acoustic gig that you're capturing, I've been using my Sennheiser MKH8040s. I can get them in pretty tight and angle them for rejection from the bass and drums - the kit being the bigger culprit of low end bleed for me.

I've also had luck with SDCs that have a Fig. 8 pickup pattern where I'll angle the null toward the rest of the rhythm section.
#5
3rd March 2012
Old 3rd March 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cschreppel View Post
The Earthworks PianoMic is excellent for live applications, especially if you can close the lid completely and have the FOH and/or Monitor engineer for the venue pump it through the PA.

If it's mainly an acoustic gig that you're capturing, I've been using my Sennheiser MKH8040s. I can get them in pretty tight and angle them for rejection from the bass and drums - the kit being the bigger culprit of low end bleed for me.

I've also had luck with SDCs that have a Fig. 8 pickup pattern where I'll angle the null toward the rest of the rhythm section.
What he said. Another solution is DPA 406x mics tight in (I mount them to the harp with small Alnico magnets and Velcro). They're omni, so LF boost from proximity isn't an issue, and they're about as close to the strings/soundboard as you can get, which attenuates the bleed about as much as can be had if the lid's up. Experiment with placement for the sound you want.

If the lid is to be down, closed or on short stick, a bit of gaff tape adheres them to the underside of the lid (they weigh less than an ounce) and the lid becomes a boundary. Again, experiment with placement. The EarthWorks placement is a good place to start.

And, not to steal EarthWorks' fire... a carbon fiber rod and gaff tape can, for $800 and change, pretty well duplicate the placement the EW rig allows.

Let us know where you end up. More information is always better than less!

HB
#6
3rd March 2012
Old 3rd March 2012
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hbphotoav View Post
And, not to steal EarthWorks' fire... a carbon fiber rod and gaff tape can, for $800 and change, pretty well duplicate the placement the EW rig allows.

Let us know where you end up. More information is always better than less!

HB
Amen to that. DPA4060 or 61's in this config is great.
AlexK
Thread Starter
#7
3rd March 2012
Old 3rd March 2012
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Thread Starter
Fantastic, thanks for your help guys. I'll try the pianomic trick with a pair of 4060s first.

Currently, I have been using an ORTF pair of Calrec CC50s above the hammers, and Sony C48s on a stereo bar positioned in the cutout in a ~40ยบ ~15cm arrangement.
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