Need ideas for a difficult project

[Rick DeGraeve]

I need some help/ideas on miking this one. I've got a video joint that is asking about subcontract me to do the audio as they are filming various marching bands. This seems like a real challenge. I believe the bands will be both in parades and in formation on an athletic field. I haven't tried anything like this before but my first thought is naturally I need to stay in close proximity to the section of the band they are filming for the parade venue. Bands in formation might be a little easier. This seems like a tough one...

Has anyone done anything like this? Any thought/ideas I can work with?

Thanks for any help!

Rick

[pkautzsch]

Never done somehting like that either. Just a few thoughts.

What you want is the sound of the whole band with emphasis on the sections that are in the picture. So just a boom mic will not be enough, since that would only record what is in the picture plus a lot of undefined off-picture sound junk.

If you can, you'd maybe want to try to clip-on mic every instrument (if that's ok with the camera guy). Wireless to a multitracker.
Plus a boomed or at least camera-mounted MS (supercard/eight) or even double-MS (supercard front, eight side, card rear) setup moving with the focus of the camera.
Thus you have everything and you're able to adjust in post.
Needs a lot of clip-on mics though, and a good postpro facility, and maybe someone who operates the multitracker.

If that's too much, then maybe just a double-MS which at least allows you to control the width in a way...

Is there a PA for the bands in the stadium? You could get a split from them.

[chadly]

Originally Posted by Rick DeGraeve

I need some help/ideas on miking this one. I've got a video joint that is asking about subcontract me to do the audio as they are filming various marching bands. This seems like a real challenge. I believe the bands will be both in parades and in formation on an athletic field. I haven't tried anything like this before but my first thought is naturally I need to stay in close proximity to the section of the band they are filming for the parade venue. Bands in formation might be a little easier. This seems like a tough one...

Has anyone done anything like this? Any thought/ideas I can work with?

Thanks for any help!

Rick

For stadium work, I think the best plan of action would be to have a great stereo pair backed by a wide pair of flanking mics. You shouldn't need to accent where the camera guy is filming- bands and orchestras tend to accentuate the sections that need it in arrangment. ie. when the trumpet section is blasting (and we'll assume, be on screen) their part will be louder naturally.

Marching bands can be somewhat difficult to record in parade however. Many times, they'll stop at a given point and perform a routine- usually around the "dignitary" area or judges box. Set up there! The "band on the run" thing would be impossible.

As far as clip-on micing, the shear logistics of 140 - 200 member marching band coupled with the fact in competition (the likely place that you'll be doing this) they only perform for 15 minutes and then (BAM) a new band comes on the field, makes that approach nearly impossible. (You'd need close to 600 wireless mics, plus staff, and spectrum to achieve it.)

If there's anything I can help with, feel free to PM me.

[Jim vanBergen]

My best luck has been with directional mics on the sidelines in the stadium. You will get PLENTY of level (got compressors?) from the band, and this is how they are designed to be heard, as a marching band. Forget the idea of miking isolated instruments. If you have a solo you need to cover, get a good hyper or shotgun mic. You won't get ON the field, so you will need to stay on the sidelines- but marching bands can be blastingly loud: 110-120dbA from the sidelines.

For the marching in the street stuff, most parades that do this (Macy's, for example) use just camera mics and a wide pair of mics that cover the street. See if you're supposed to cover them AS they march, or if they march to a zone in which they play. (This is also a convenient thing, you can put up three stereo pairs and get a nice mix by flying mics over the street. )

The OTHER part of this: since it is a video, make sure the bands know that they MUST stay on their tempo because if the recording is not successful you will go to their rehearsal area and do a 2-6 mic recording (Decca or stereo pair with solo and flank mics) and fly it in. It's not so hard to do this, or even to do a rough sync to their own video, if the conductor is watching/hearing a headphone cue mix. It's not so bad. The video company is doing post, make sure they are aware you will have a lot of post work too and charge accordingly.

Hope this helps!

JvB

[pkautzsch]

Ah, we're talking THAT big bands. Then forget about clip-ons.

--and again, something was learned--

[Rick DeGraeve]

Thanks for the tips everyone. What you said makes sense. As I suspected, it would seem the athletic field setup would be the easiest.

Dealing with the dynamics of a parade will be tough. I was thinking about maybe some high overheads and mobile boom with the camera (for instance to pick up nuances like the flutter of the flags with the Flag Corps). Then either restrict or fix the camera man. Hopefully I'll get an opportunity to do a dry run.

This job probably won't materilaize 'til this summer. So I've got some time for more thinking & planning.

Thanks again!!

Rick

[smarsland]

I am a HS Band Director...fwiw

Definitely like Jim's response about main array and flanks for the field. Have someone with shotgun or parabolic (markertek?) pick up soloists because you can't get on the field. Could do clip on for soloist if the band director was ok with it - obviously can time align in post.

For parade... DO NOT allow the individual sound of one close-up mic to pick up the group. I hate when network does this... parade bands are meant to be heard from 30 feet away or more - I do not want to hear individual kids - it sounds ridiculously amateurish - even though they are kids.

s

[Rick DeGraeve]

AAARRRGHHH! I know what you mean about a single close up mike on the band!! I cringe at the holidays when all the parades are aired!

Thanks for the thoughts smarsland. I certainly think the thoughts of a HS band director are pretty valuable. I'm pretty sure we'll have the cooperation of the band directors, so I'll keep clip ons for soloists in mind! I don't have a shotgun but I probably should, again, great advice! Thanks!!

[Jim vanBergen]

I bet the video production company can loan you a shotgun mic and boom. You can have a single boom operator track any soloists on the sidelines... 90% of the time the soloists are brass players, or the rare saxophone.

Hope these thoughts have helped!