Suggestions for Hypercardiod for Indoors and Shotgun for Outdoors

[tathnos]

I'm pretty new to location recording, but I have been a live sound engineer for almost 10 years. I recently picked up a Metric Halo ULN-2 and will eventually be investing in a Sound Devices 744T or something similar for upcoming film work.

I've been contracted to do a bunch of indoor location recordings (translation voiceovers for a promo DVD) in an office building every year (I can record with my ULN-2). I don't have a choice on the location, and its reasonably quiet except for the large buildings AC. (the first time I did this, the gear was provided and was an Mbox 1 and a Groove tubes GT55 mic) I'd like to be able to kick up the quality and AC rejection.

So I'm looking for some good options for a mic, probably hypercardiod to use in the room, that I can also use as a boom mic for film which I will also be getting into, unless using one mic for both isn't a reasonable expectation. Two possibilities I've been considering (obvious price difference) are the Neumann KM185 and the Schoeps CMC641, or possibly a DPA. I have used the Schoeps CMIT 5U once briefly and liked it and heard comparative demos of it and the Neumann KMR81 i, and since I would like to get the mics as a pair to sound similar for indoor and future outdoor shooting, I was curious what people's experiences have been on here with these mics.

I'm not made of money, and I know some people say those 2 shotguns are sensitive to moisture, but I'd like to worry about quality first, and I'll probably pick up a Sennheiser MKH 60 or 8060 sometime in the future for a backup for rough situations.

Any input is greatly appreciated. thanks!

[John Willett]

Well, an MKH 8050 and 8060 will sound the same.

The 8000 series are cheaper (and many would say, better) than the 20/30/40 series.

The Schoeps SuperCMIT is very nice, but will probably cost more than the 8050 and 8060 together..

[tathnos]

I haven't actually heard the 8060 or 8050, but what little I've heard about them has been good. If you had to characterize them tonally, what would you say?

[John Willett]

Originally Posted by tathnos

I haven't actually heard the 8060 or 8050, but what little I've heard about them has been good. If you had to characterize them tonally, what would you say?

Clean and neutral.

You can read the English translation of an interview with the designers HERE. It was published originally in VDT magazine in Germany. (NB: It's a multi-page PDF)

[JEGG]

Originally Posted by tathnos

I haven't actually heard the 8060 or 8050, but what little I've heard about them has been good. If you had to characterize them tonally, what would you say?

They all have a tenor bloom and a clear HF bump a bit higher than most condensers.

They are very nice mic's.

Originally Posted by John Willett

The 8000 series are cheaper (and many would say, better) than the 20/30/40 series.

John, they've never been cheaper on this side of the pond, and that's *without* switchable LF filters, switchable pads, switchable HF compensation and pressure rings for the omni, *and* shock mounts which are all included with the earlier series and are all (expensive) add ons to the new series.

As to better, well, they are different. Nice, too, but not necessarily better.

Originally Posted by John Willett

The Schoeps SuperCMIT is very nice, but will probably cost more than the 8050 and 8060 together..

It's a significantly better mic with new technology and development costs, one might expect it to cost more.....

[John Willett]

Originally Posted by JEGG

John, they've never been cheaper on this side of the pond, and that's *without* switchable LF filters, switchable pads, switchable HF compensation and pressure rings for the omni, *and* shock mounts which are all included with the earlier series and are all (expensive) add ons to the new series.

As to better, well, they are different. Nice, too, but not necessarily better.

I don't know prices the other side of the pond, but I would have expected the percentage difference to be similar. I'm surprised it's not.

The Sennheiser shockmount for the MKH 8000 series is pretty rubbish IMHO and the Rycote is much better (and much cheaper).

And I *did* say "some people say better", not that it was better. Personally I like both and reserve judgement as to which is better (I have both and am not getting rid of the old).


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[aracu]

Originally Posted by tathnos

I haven't actually heard the 8060 or 8050, but what little I've heard about them has been good. If you had to characterize them tonally, what would you say?

Haven't heard the 8060. The 8050 is an excellent boom mic and also
a great mic for recording music close to the source, with a lovely
neutral sound.

[tathnos]

does anyone have any experience using the 8050 close for voice?

[aracu]

Originally Posted by tathnos

does anyone have any experience using the 8050 close for voice?

It's excellent for adr in a treated room, for a transparant film style which works equally well on just about any voice without drawing attention to the mic. I like a film dialogue sound in which you can forget you are listening to a voice through a microphone (different from an mkh416 for example). It's my first choice for that application and as a boom mic. However, in the studio or as a spot mic on a classical or pop singer there are better choices. I have tried it and always chose to use a different mic. For adding voiceover
narration I would also use a different mic with more character than the adr mic for a film.