Tips/Suggestions for Flying Mics

[WVUtubadude]

So normally when I fly stuff, I use tie down points that are well out of reach of anyone. In a few days, I will be doing a gig where the only places to tie down are the railings of balconies on either side of the venue. These balconies are going to be in use, and there is no way to close off any of it.

I use figure eight follow through knots on 4mm accessory cable, which take some effort to undo, but they can still be undone. I was thinking about using a few stopper knots after the main knot with some tape on the main knot, but I was just curious if there are other tricks for keeping all but the most determined people from messing with it.

[rcrowley]

When I fly a cable over humans, I use cable clamps exclusively. Never knots or tape or anything else. For redundant safety, I use three of them on each end, tightened as much as you can get with a crescent wrench.

[WVUtubadude]

Originally Posted by rcrowley

When I fly a cable over humans, I use cable clamps exclusively. Never knots or tape or anything else. For redundant safety, I use three of them on each end, tightened as much as you can get with a crescent wrench.

Excellent advice.

I'll take a trip to the hardware store to see if they come small enough (or I'll buy thicker cable...5mm isnt very expensive).

Thanks!

[JEGG]

Originally Posted by WVUtubadude

In a few days, I will be doing a gig where the only places to tie down are the railings of balconies on either side of the venue. These balconies are going to be in use, and there is no way to close off any of it.

Not to make you paranoid, but audience behavior, even in the most formal and rather sedate situations, can't be trusted-and in the case of children, don't depend on parents or other adults to stop unacceptable behavior. (Not that bizarre behavior is limited to children-it definitely is not.)

The point being, I would certainly consider posting people at those tie down points-for the safety of your equipment, the people sitting under it and the ties, and-of course-your recording.

On a number occasions in the past two or three years, I've witnessed behavior that would indicate posting "guards" is mandatory. Fortunately, I wasn't the one doing the recording at those times.

That's becoming increasingly necessary with any cables or equipment with any audience access, not just flown arrays.

[WVUtubadude]

Just an update. I bought a clamp to test if it would work with the nylon accessory cord (rated for 400lb) I normally use. It worked great with finger tightening, so I'm even more confident in this setup with wrench tightening.


Thanks again!

[boojum]

OK, I am coming at this from another direction, but if it is possible to secure a boat with knots against tides, winds, currents and storms, why is it not possible to secure mics against gravity in still air the same way?

[WVUtubadude]

Originally Posted by boojum

OK, I am coming at this from another direction, but if it is possible to secure a boat with knots against tides, winds, currents and storms, why is it not possible to secure mics against gravity in still air the same way?

It is entirely possible. I am coming at this from needing something that can't be undone as easily as a knot.

[Eli Resnick]

Originally Posted by boojum

OK, I am coming at this from another direction, but if it is possible to secure a boat with knots against tides, winds, currents and storms, why is it not possible to secure mics against gravity in still air the same way?

The boat is never secured against tides. It is secured within the range of tides, so that when the tide moves it, it stays nearby. Sometimes this is achieved through floating piers that also follow the tide to allow access to a boat that may move twelve feet up and down, twice a day. And if the boat moves back and forth six feet along the dock with every wave, it stays a boat and it keeps on floating, with no harm to anyone. It's about designing to accommodate variables, not eliminate them.

The microphone that flies in still air has no material to transduce.

If you take all the people out of a recording environment who are likely to damage the recording equipment or behave in strange and unpredictable ways, you'll have to stop recording musicians.

Steel clamps on several poits around the balcony to keep the mics up in the center seem like a good measure to minimize random destruction or theft of the mics. But you'll still want good shockmounts in the middle to minimize the mics' pickup of kids fidgeting with and/or throwing things at the ropes.

[rcrowley]

Originally Posted by boojum

OK, I am coming at this from another direction, but if it is possible to secure a boat with knots against tides, winds, currents and storms, why is it not possible to secure mics against gravity in still air the same way?

Dunno about tying up ships, etc. but there are government regulations about flying stuff over the heads of cast and crew, and especially about flying things over the heads of the public (audience). In the news recently have been multiple reports of injury accidents in the Broadway (NY) show "Spider Man" and other shows due to improper or inadequate procedures or safety measures.

[boojum]

Originally Posted by rcrowley

Dunno about tying up ships, etc. but there are government regulations about flying stuff over the heads of cast and crew, and especially about flying things over the heads of the public (audience). In the news recently have been multiple reports of injury accidents in the Broadway (NY) show "Spider Man" and other shows due to improper or inadequate procedures or safety measures.

This may all be true. My argument is that if knots can hold the weight of a boat against the pull of tides and currents they just might be able to fly and secure mics. Sailors have been securing large and heavy items with lines for centuries. I thought this knowledge could be borrowed.

I have no idea what happened with Spider Man. Was it faulty knot-tying? I doubt that. If there are regulations specifying that lines and knots may not be used I did not know this.

[Foldedpath]

Sailor's knots are designed so they don't jam under tension, and for relatively easy release in an emergency. I've used sailor's knots frequently when rigging certain things under the right circumstances, but it's just not something you use when the general public has unsupervised access to the rigging. For that, you want something requiring special tools that a casual bystander won't have.

The cable crimp mentioned above is a reasonable solution, but I'd still worry about people messing with the cable... jiggling it up and down or something. Depends on the type of gig and audience, I guess. I wouldn't expect interference at a classical concert, but anything can happen with young kids, or a drunk enough crowd of adults.

[audibell]

Originally Posted by boojum

OK, I am coming at this from another direction, but if it is possible to secure a boat with knots against tides, winds, currents and storms, why is it not possible to secure mics against gravity in still air the same way?

It surely is. You have to first read, decipher and understand Ashley's Book of Knots, though. Using the correct bend for whichever way the line wraps around/over/behind the fixed object is the first decision and then practicing how to snug up the slack under tension, so that the line doesn't "render" under the load (droop or catenary) is the next bit.

When spanning across the aisle from handrails on either side, the deeper the droop, the less stress on the handrails. So a droopy looking array is actually a little safer and less likely to snap and crash than a nice taut-looking high wire. Duct tape over the bends so tiny fingers aren't entertained by twiddling during the boring bits. Wire is a different story and using cable clamps must be studied first. There are books on rigging just like there are books on stereo micing. All part of the craft.

If you need to calculate weight/stress on each leg, pm me.
WalterT

[WVUtubadude]

Here are a few shots of what I ended up doing. I backed up my normal knots with two cable clamps at each tie down point.

Thanks for the input, everyone!

[apple-q]

Originally Posted by Eli Resnick

The boat is never secured against tides. It is secured within the range of tides, so that when the tide moves it, it stays nearby. Sometimes this is achieved through floating piers that also follow the tide to allow access to a boat that may move twelve feet up and down, twice a day. And if the boat moves back and forth six feet along the dock with every wave, it stays a boat and it keeps on floating, with no harm to anyone. It's about designing to accommodate variables, not eliminate them.

Yep, the force of a car ferry against a concrete pier is nothing compared to the strain an MKH40 can put on your rope.

Sorry, couldn´t resist.

[PoxyMusic]

Originally Posted by boojum

This may all be true. My argument is that if knots can hold the weight of a boat against the pull of tides and currents they just might be able to fly and secure mics.

No problem if you are using hemp or nylon line to secure your mics, but wire cable resists traditional knots. Wire's "springiness" tends to un-knot itself whereas limp line retains it's knot shape.

[boojum]

Originally Posted by PoxyMusic

No problem if you are using hemp or nylon line to secure your mics, but wire cable resists traditional knots. Wire's "springiness" tends to un-knot itself whereas limp line retains it's knot shape.

Good point. I overlooked that.

[rcrowley]

No problem if you are using hemp or nylon line to secure your mics

But the kinds of factors (flexibility, compliance, stretch, etc.) that make those varieties desirable for tying up watercraft or farm animals or mountain climbing are not particularly desirable in a production setting. When we fly a microphone in just the right place, we don't want to come back from dinner break to discover that the line has stretched and the microphone is now 8 inches lower than when we tied it up. Or even worse, that it will continue to stretch and hit the conductor in the head by the end of the concert.

That is why I use steel cable exclusively. Natural/synthetic fiber line is simply not suitable for this kind of application IME. BOTH from a performance factor and from a safety factor.

[therealbigd]

As a professional rigger, I will say that whenever securing anything of any weight above an audience, you MUST use steel cable with proper clamps to secure it. Anything else contravenes LOLER regulations and you'll end up in the brown stuff if you hurt somebody.

I recommend you don't just use clamps though. You should also use a thimble. A thimble is a small metal 'horseshoe' shaped item that sits inside the loop on the rope, meaning your mallion will not wear against the surface of the rope (weakening the rope).



When making wire rope by hand, you should use clamps and thimbles to ensure the best strength of the rope.

Also, if it's a rope that you intend to keep and use again and again, I would use heatshrink to wrap around the rope and clamps at the ends, to protect them from damage.

But the kinds of factors (flexibility, compliance, stretch, etc.) that make those varieties desirable for tying up watercraft or farm animals or mountain climbing are not particularly desirable in a production setting. When we fly a microphone in just the right place, we don't want to come back from dinner break to discover that the line has stretched and the microphone is now 8 inches lower than when we tied it up. Or even worse, that it will continue to stretch and hit the conductor in the head by the end of the concert.

That is why I use steel cable exclusively. Natural/synthetic fiber line is simply not suitable for this kind of application IME. BOTH from a performance factor and from a safety factor.

If you use static rope as opposed to dynamic rope, this will not happen.

You need special types of pulley to lift steel rope since it will damage the wrong kind of pulley, so the usual drill for this kind of low-weight work is to lift using synthetic rope, then secure using steel rope.

[therealbigd]

Just to add 2 notes:

1) When flying anything over the general public, it is highly recommended you have an independent backup should the point or the rope fail.
2) I see you are flying with the ropes at horizontal. Are the fly points designed for flying vertically or horizontally (IE do the fly points point downwards or sideways?). If they point downwards, and are designed for flying vertically, and you fly horizontally, you are putting around 6 times as much load on the point as the actual weight of what you're flying. So if that's a 5kg microphone, that becomes around 30kg. You should find out in advance from the venue what the load ratings of the points are, to ensure they're not exceeded.

[rcrowley]

The venue where I fly my microphone is a gigantic "quonset hut" (Cannon Beach Oregon Elementary School Gymnasium). It has exposed wood "beams" with a cross-section of about 4 x 8 inches. I am able to run my steel aircraft cable all the way around behind the beam to make just about as secure an attachment to the building as is possible.

The first image shows the building detail in the upper edge above the boy's head. The event I work is a summer, graduate-level choral conducting workshop with a chorus of 100 voices (all choral conductors), it has nothing to do with the event in the photo which appears to be some sort of Christmas program at the school.



The second photo shows the whole choral group in a class session. The microphone is ~3 ft above the conductor/professor's head, just above the photo.

[therealbigd]

If you are attaching to wood, are you insulating your rope from the wood?

You need to, both to avoid damage to the steel and to avoid damage to the wood.

You can do this using a sandbag, rolled up around the steel. That said, my personal preference would be to wrap a spanset around the wooden joist, and use a bow shackle to connect the eye of the steel to the spanset. The spanset can be wrapped in a choke, so that as more load is applied to it, it tightens around the joist.

If doing this, you still need to employ a steel backup, although above, I pointed out that you should be using a backup anyway. The steel backup is required since if there is a fire, the fire will burn through the spanset, which it wouldn't do with steel. The fact it'll burn through the wood is irrelevant, since everything is about liability.

So, in summary:

• Use a spanset 'choker' around the wooden joist as the primary support for the steel rope.
• Use a steel 'basket' around the wooden joist, as the backup in case the primary fails. Insulate the steel from the wooden joist with a sandbag or similar.
•*Run 2 steels to the microphone - the primary and the backup, in case one fails. The backup should not be under load, but should not be so loose that it allows the microphone to fall any distance.

If it helps:

SPANSET:

STEEL BASKET

SPANSET CHOKER

BOW SHACKLE

[rcrowley]

Thanks for the info, therealbigd. Using the spansets will make it easier to rig, also.