Overhead mics for jazz drums - Page 2

RubixGroove · 6th July 2011

I really dig on the Blondies. Most of the time you can get away with a mono OH and you have the other one in the pair to throw in front of the kit, always to taste of course.

(my gear is also not as great as most of you around here, either!

)

Accurate · 8th July 2011

Since you're on a budget I would look at spending your money on one good mic, rather than having stereo overheads and a kick drum mic. Most of the classic jazz albums were done with one mic in front of the kit looking down a bit at the snare, and it's hard to argue with the results. You can also try an omni OH over the drummer's right knee and a bit above head level if the room is good, but I prefer the front-of-kit sound. I would highly recommend checking out the Oktava tube mics, both MKL-2500 and MKL-5000 - they are dirt cheap used (250-500), sound awesome, and have lots of tube coloration. Good luck!

Jim Williams · 10th July 2011

Usually it's a pair of AKG 414 B-ULS models modifed with quality capacitors and transformers removed. Those do 2 hz, so be carefull with wind and rumble. The top end is fast and effortless. I never need top boost EQ. Toms are full and fat. I add an RE-20 on kick and I'm done.

My trick is planar pickup. I set those mics to be parallel to the floor. That way the wave hitting the capsule is at it's crest, that helps add 'punch' to the toms. Angle them and you lose that.

king2070lplaya · 11th July 2011

Jim that's awesome man. Planar setup.... I'll have to remember that.

SoundWeavers · 11th July 2011

Have you considered using a pair of ribbon mics for OH drums? My experience with ribbons is they are a lot smoother especially for cymbals and hihats. check out this video of a jazz quartet recording Peluso r14 overheads and AEA r92 front of kit. Good luck with it.

boojum · 11th July 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoundWeavers

Have you considered using a pair of ribbon mics for OH drums? My experience with ribbons is they are a lot smoother especially for cymbals and hihats. check out this video of a jazz quartet recording Peluso r14 overheads and AEA r92 front of kit. Good luck with it.

Ribbons as drum OH's is interesting. Isn't there a problem with the ribbon sagging when the ribbon mic is horizontal???

Dave C · 11th July 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Williams

.

My trick is planar pickup. I set those mics to be parallel to the floor. That way the wave hitting the capsule is at it's crest, that helps add 'punch' to the toms. Angle them and you lose that.

Can you explain this please?
Is the crest of the wave hitting the capsule, or the wave hitting the crest of the capsule?
How does this add 'punch' to the toms?

How does angling the mic change this?

I'm really curious to hear more about this please.

Thanks.

bass man · 11th July 2011

I use Neumann km 184 for years on overheads , I don't even think about it anymore its always great . Sennheiser 441 on Snare and D 112 on BD . D112 is probably not the best bass drum mic in the world but its a king when it comes to the separation with double bass in a mix .

king2070lplaya · 11th July 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by boojum

Ribbons as drum OH's is interesting. Isn't there a problem with the ribbon sagging when the ribbon mic is horizontal???

Hey Booj,

I've wondered the same thing as well, hopefully someone who KNOWS the answer will chime in.

I've used R84's horizontal on overheads before, the session lasted 12 hours and nothing bad happened to the mics. I'm pretty sure at that studio they almost always use r84s as overheads and they record drums just about every day. So theoretically, those mics should be toast by now.... But they worked fine for me.

Anyone know why this is possible without damage to the ribbon?

boojum · 11th July 2011

I ask because I have Blumlein ribbon I could try. The dealer/modifier (Busman) was concerned when I asked him and thought he would test it. I have not heard yet and was wondering what other folks' experience was with ribbons running horizontal.

Anyone else??

studer58 · 11th July 2011

I believe horizontality/verticality is more an issue concerned with overnight or long term storage, where the ribbon will tend to sag or stretch along it's longest dimension. I doubt it would be an issue for the duration of a recording session...even a long one ? You could probably email Dave Royer or Wes Dooley (AEA) to get a more definitive statement on the matter.

SoundWeavers · 11th July 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by boojum

Isn't there a problem with the ribbon sagging when the ribbon mic is horizontal???

Not fully horizontal but angled coz I want to control the amount of snare and hats. I also only mount mics during sessions then takedown and store so that the ribbons are vertical.

SoundWeavers · 11th July 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by studer58

I believe horizontality/verticality is more an issue concerned with overnight or long term storage, where the ribbon will tend to sag or stretch along it's longest dimension..

Yep, the AEA manual details that info re: care and storage.

6th July 2011	#31
RubixGroove Gear addict Joined: Apr 2009 Posts: 305	I really dig on the Blondies. Most of the time you can get away with a mono OH and you have the other one in the pair to throw in front of the kit, always to taste of course. (my gear is also not as great as most of you around here, either! ) __________________ ego + internetz =

8th July 2011	#32
Accurate Gear maniac Joined: Mar 2010 Location: Oakland, CA Posts: 222 3 Reviews written	Since you're on a budget I would look at spending your money on one good mic, rather than having stereo overheads and a kick drum mic. Most of the classic jazz albums were done with one mic in front of the kit looking down a bit at the snare, and it's hard to argue with the results. You can also try an omni OH over the drummer's right knee and a bit above head level if the room is good, but I prefer the front-of-kit sound. I would highly recommend checking out the Oktava tube mics, both MKL-2500 and MKL-5000 - they are dirt cheap used (250-500), sound awesome, and have lots of tube coloration. Good luck! __________________ _______________________ Accurate Recording Live and Location Recording www.AccurateRecording.com

11th July 2011	#35
SoundWeavers Lives for gear Joined: Apr 2006 Location: Makati, Phillippines Posts: 796 1 Review written	Have you considered using a pair of ribbon mics for OH drums? My experience with ribbons is they are a lot smoother especially for cymbals and hihats. check out this video of a jazz quartet recording Peluso r14 overheads and AEA r92 front of kit. Good luck with it. __________________ Gerry Recording studio in Makati, Manila Philippines my photography

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10th July 2011	#33
Jim Williams Voiding warranties Joined: Feb 2004 Location: beautiful Carlsbad, CA Posts: 10,081	Usually it's a pair of AKG 414 B-ULS models modifed with quality capacitors and transformers removed. Those do 2 hz, so be carefull with wind and rumble. The top end is fast and effortless. I never need top boost EQ. Toms are full and fat. I add an RE-20 on kick and I'm done. My trick is planar pickup. I set those mics to be parallel to the floor. That way the wave hitting the capsule is at it's crest, that helps add 'punch' to the toms. Angle them and you lose that.

11th July 2011	#34
king2070lplaya Gear addict Joined: Apr 2009 Location: Illinois Posts: 455 1 Review written	Jim that's awesome man. Planar setup.... I'll have to remember that.

11th July 2011	#38
bass man Banned Joined: Oct 2007 Location: europe Posts: 1,548	I use Neumann km 184 for years on overheads , I don't even think about it anymore its always great . Sennheiser 441 on Snare and D 112 on BD . D112 is probably not the best bass drum mic in the world but its a king when it comes to the separation with double bass in a mix .

11th July 2011	#40
boojum Lives for gear Joined: May 2007 Location: Astoria, OR, US&A Posts: 2,308 1 Review written	I ask because I have Blumlein ribbon I could try. The dealer/modifier (Busman) was concerned when I asked him and thought he would test it. I have not heard yet and was wondering what other folks' experience was with ribbons running horizontal. Anyone else??

11th July 2011	#41
studer58 Lives for gear Joined: Feb 2008 Posts: 512	I believe horizontality/verticality is more an issue concerned with overnight or long term storage, where the ribbon will tend to sag or stretch along it's longest dimension. I doubt it would be an issue for the duration of a recording session...even a long one ? You could probably email Dave Royer or Wes Dooley (AEA) to get a more definitive statement on the matter.