Balancing spend across: outboard, backline, monitors, computers, mic's, accoustics?

[Jules]

I've rather over spent on outboard and regret not investing in some cool backline pieces..

Anyone else?

[davemc]

Well I have a little bit of backline in the studio.
I have all my own guitar gear at the studio, 3 amps and 5 guitars. They come in handy, more the amps(soldano, Marshall and line6) then the guitars.
I also have a Maton acoustic with a great pickup in it, that is cool if I need to DI.

I brought a Ibanez Bass for around US$200, which is emergency use really, if there buzzes or the action is shit.

But the drumkit gets the most use and I think of it as a great investment. It makes pulling drum sounds so much better as my kit is tuned for my room. I have 4 snares, a pair of 13" dark hats to keep the bleed down. I brought a Pearl BLX birch kit as I find birch records best for me. I find even a lot of good players with great kits will still use my kit.
I think at least a snare or two is good bonus for a studio recording real drums.

[Jules]

What do you have by line 6? I am interested in a Vetta head.

spin

[Jay Kahrs]

I've tried to keep an even balance of that stuff. By far the most common thing used at my studio is the drum set. If you don't own one it's nice to have a few different snares and cymbals around to get different tones. I have five snares around so that base is pretty well covered. I also have a few guitar amps that people use for overdubs. Most of the time they use their own gear for basics but sometimes people want to use my stuff. It also makes it really easy for a band to come out from NYC for a few days to track. They don't have to bring anything unless they want to, but it's strongly encouraged.

The few times I've tried Line 6 gear I haven't been that impressed with it. While it's nice and all I'd rather have a box full of pedals and a few 1x10 or 1x12 combos.

[5down1up]

we have some midi gear ( jv2080 , virus , s6000 , pulse+ etc. ) . two 72 strats , gibson es135 , 2 acoustic guitars , jazzbass , marshall , vox , fender amps , fender rhodes some old fx like tape delays , vocoder . stomp boxes by fulltone , mxr , ibanez , boss , digitech etc . a old ludwig kit , some percussion , etc .

i hate the day when i decided to record music

so expensive .

i like the " real stuff " , some drums running through a fender amp ... cool sound , screaming into a guitar pickup , keyboards plugged into a wahwah etc . some cymbals running through a virus filer , sampled guitar feedbacks etc.

nowadays most of my money turns straight into recording stuff .

i was playing around with the pod last week , and it doesnt sound good at all imho . maybe for some wired stuff .
maybe i am too old fashioned . okk

[davemc]

Hi Jules,

Its an Flextone1 XL, the 100 watt one with 2*12" speakers.
Actually going to sell it, put the money towards paying off the HD system.
The line6 does not sound like the real thing, sometimes close, but if the sound that comes out of any amp makes the guitarist happy and works in the track then that all that cares.
The flextone have a annoying bug where when you hit the footswitch it takes around 200 ms to change patches, so you can change late sometimes. This is annoying to give to some players.
I played with the Vetta and it did not do this. The Cybertwin might be worth a listen to.

I will just get a boogie in the next year or so.
So a Marshall, Soldano and Boogie will cover most bases.

[mwagener]

Originally posted by davemc
I will just get a boogie in the next year or so.
So a Marshall, Soldano and Boogie will cover most bases.

if you can get your hands on it, try an ENGL "Savage 120 - special edition". A Swedish metal band turned me on to those and by now that is my main amp. I also have a Dual Recitifier, Marshall (50W plexi) and a Rivera, but the ENGL kicks butt. It has four channels with completely different sounds (no modeling).

I think you might like it.

[Jules]

Sounds v cool got a weblink for em?

[mwagener]

coming up:

http://www.engl-amps.com/engl-amps/

[alphajerk]

im currently in love with this vintage orange gt120 head and 4x12 reissue cabinet i made my friend leave at my studio. now if i can just save the $4k for a MATAMP Blue for when he wants it back. i can cover the entire gamut with this one amp and a big muff.

i also have a 65 bassman w 2x15 cabinet thats pretty brown. and a marshall 2x12 combo thats okay. i also have a marshall 2x12 ext cab... that teamed up with the bassman sounds pretty sweet.

a couple guitars, bass... and a drumkit. i really need to get some assorted snares. and a great drumkit. i would love a gretch kit.

i got guitar pedals too, some of which are pretty cool. all hte moogerfoogers, big muff 1/2, tyche octave, ibanez phaser, tube screamer, some boss pedals, 3 wahs, tc flanger/pm/chorus, um... some other stuff too.

[C.Lambrechts]

who needs backline if you have a backline company like this 20 minutes away :

http://www.kick.be/

they have everything and they're cheap.

[Dave Martin]

I tend to get guitars and such that aren't part of the regular guitarist's kit, that I want from time to time - an electric sitar, a baritone guitar, a couple of tic-tac guitars, a baby Taylor strung up a 4th, a good sounding archtop electric.

And I've got my basses if they're needed on a project, including my upright. But it's generally me playing them...

I am keepinng an eye out for a decent deal on a Whirly, a Rhodes, and a Hammond, though. And I wouldn't pass up a great deal on a Hohner Clavinet or other neat old analog keyboard stuff. (I'm trying to talk another studio in town out of their celeste, but I don't think it's gonna work...)

[Lyle Caldwell]

Jules,
Before throwing money at the Vetta or Cybertwin (both horrid), check out the THD Univalve at http://www.thdelectronics.com. An amazingly versatile REAL amp that is absolute perfect for studio use. 15W (4-5W in low voltage mode), built in Hotplate, line or instrument level out, dummy speaker load, will drive 2,4,8, or 16 Ohm cabs, and (get this) it works with almost any octal power tube (and with the Yellowjacket adapter even accepts an EL84).
So without rebiasing you can go from EL34 to 6V6 to EL84 to KT66 to you name it. By changing the two preamp tubes, you can fine tune the amount of gain offered (many like a combination of an ECC83 and an AT7, for instance). And the amp has two "channels", the Roll input (which uses one stage of the driver tube) which gives clean to slightly broken up and the Rock input (which uses both stages of the tube), which handles broken up to raging power tube distortion.
And it really sounds incredibly good (jaws drop). About $750 US.

[Jay Kahrs]

I've heard really good things about that THD amp, I might look into one soon but I really want a Marshall first. I have a Boogie Dual Rectifier which seems to be the hot amp right now. I'm glad I bought mine back in '96. Anyway, THD makes good stuff. A guitar player brought in a Bassman style amp a while ago I liked it a lot. Then again, that guy could've made a Crate sound ok.

[Lyle Caldwell]

I had a 100% modded to original spec Marshall Bluesbreaker, that was my pride and joy. I spent hours getting it "just right", including upgrading all the '90s factory components with NOS components, etc. It really sounded great.
When I put the same tubes (Ei ECC83s and Shuagang KT66s) in the Univalve and played through the Marshall 2x12 cab, it sounded nearly identical to the Marshall. So I sold the Marshall and kept the Univalve. All I lost was about 50lbs and 20W. My back and my eardrums continue to thank me.

[Jules]

Thanks Michael I have contacted the UK rep...

And Lyle I have dug the sound demos... on the site THD... Hmmm

I am digging the direction this is all going in..

I kinda 'lost my way' with my little live area and no 'own back line' I feel I need to come in from the cold WITH SOME BURNIN TUBES

pissed pissed pissed pissed pissed pissed

okk

[Jay Kahrs]

Burnin' tubes is good, but grab a nice snare or two while your at it. Drummers like that and you will too. Might I suggest a Spaun or since your in the UK maybe a Sonar?

[Jules]

Re the Engle special edition Michael.... (they have been in touch) what cab do you recomend with it...????

THD is looking cool too

MUCH chreaper!

Thanks

Jules

[Gone Fission]

Dave was right on about the oddball guitars. Things I like to throw in are 12 string (good one, not Ovation), high-strung/Nashville tuned 6, and my fave for personal consumption is a parlor guitar in a Csus2 tuning (the lows sound like god).

One World Music in Austin was converting reissue Longhorn Basses into 6 string tic-tac basses that sound better than the Dan-O Baritone model for about the same bucks. I don't know if Danelectro is even still doing those styles, so it's a shame I didn't get one.

I want the dough to look for old keys, and I really want a vibraphone!

If I were to throw one amp flavor into a studio arsenal, it'd probably be a Hiwatt Custom (the 50 is plenty loud, the 100 will find every hole in your soundproofing). Players are going to have Fender and/or Marshall (-esque) covered, but Hiwatt is a great sound to itself that can make some tracks better than the two "leading brands". Though I'm in lust with the UniValve.

Bear

[Logan]

It's handy to have some stuff when you're in the middle of nowhere like I am. I've got a 60's Martin D18 and an older Gibson J45 an 80's American standard Strat and an Eko 12 string that has a bakolite neck and sounds like a plank with strings, but it's amazing how many times you need that, er well maybe not. I've got a single 12 Marshall JCM 900 and a 70's twin and a 62' or 63 Bassman head,(can't quite make out the code on the sheet in the amp) that I'm hoping to build a 4 10 jensen cab for. I've got a bunch of older synths, a Roland D550 and D110 and a Korg M3 and a Yamaha TX816 and Tx81Z and A Yamaha KX88 controller. My Precision 62 reissue gets the most use, maybe it's a Canadian thing but there sure are a lot of crappy basses out there. I'm jonesing for a Vox AC30 but they go for stupid money and I'd like a nice maple kit and a few snares. I'm looking for some sort of software type keyboard and while I'd love a B3, I think it's going to have to be software based as well. I keep a wack of percussion stuff around and Kalimbas and that sort of stuff, keeps the girl friends busy. Take care Logan

[Jay Kahrs]

Originally posted by Gone Fission

If I were to throw one amp flavor into a studio arsenal, it'd probably be a Hiwatt Custom (the 50 is plenty loud, the 100 will find every hole in your soundproofing). Players are going to have Fender and/or Marshall (-esque) covered, but Hiwatt is a great sound to itself that can make some tracks better than the two "leading brands". Though I'm in lust with the UniValve.

Hiwatt's are cool. Whenever I see one I think of The Who. While most guys have the Fender/Marshall sound together they seem to have solid state or hybrid versions. Valvestate amps are evil. That's not a Marshall!!! Get a real amp!
piss Valvestate

[mwagener]

Originally posted by Jules
Re the Engle special edition Michael.... (they have been in touch) what cab do you recomend with it...????

THD is looking cool too

MUCH chreaper!

Thanks

Jules

I have been using the ENGL vintage 30 model as the main cabinet. It has 30W speakers (duh) and pushes a lot of air with the amp peaking at 250W. For the high end part I use a stock Marshall 800 (75W speakers. not so much air) and for solos (sustain) i have a 1969 vintage Greenback Marshall (looks like crap, but sounds great).

On the last project I got to use the Royer R121s for the first time, absolutely great sound, 1/2 foot in front of the speaker and no blown ribbonsokk

Dave, excuse my ignorance but what are tic-tac guitars. What's your baritone of choice?

[Lyle Caldwell]

Michael,
I'm obviously not Dave, but a tic tac bass is a (typically) short scale bass played with a pick that gives a very clicky percussive sound (literally goes "tic tac"). Usually done with an old Danelectro, and most often used to double an acoustic bass track (which gives the lows the tic tac lacks). A mainstay of the old Nashville sound (listen to Walking After Midnight and many other Patsy Cline songs to hear one used to great effect).

[mwagener]

learn something new everyday, thanx Lyle

[alphajerk]

Originally posted by mwagener

On the last project I got to use the Royer R121s for the first time, absolutely great sound, 1/2 foot in front of the speaker and no blown ribbonsokk

micheal, i put the royer r121 right up on the grill of the orange gt120 at FULL master volume, full gain. i mean the shockmount is 1mm away from the grill. that shit is tough. although one song i did recently ends on this sustained low low note feeding back. man, it sounds funkin COOL as shit. sounds like the speaker is gonna blow up. the ribbon is so flapping but its all good.

[davemc]

Originally posted by Jay Kahrs


Hiwatt's are cool. Whenever I see one I think of The Who. While most guys have the Fender/Marshall sound together they seem to have solid state or hybrid versions. Valvestate amps are evil. That's not a Marshall!!! Get a real amp!
piss Valvestate

God yes Jay.

Then when the poor kid says he brought it new for full price and I say my JCM800 combo was cheaper. Then you get the kids say but its a marshall yell I prefer to use it then your Soldano.rollz

[mwagener]

Originally posted by alphajerk


micheal, i put the royer r121 right up on the grill of the orange gt120 at FULL master volume, full gain. i mean the shockmount is 1mm away from the grill. that shit is tough. although one song i did recently ends on this sustained low low note feeding back. man, it sounds funkin COOL as shit. sounds like the speaker is gonna blow up. the ribbon is so flapping but its all good.

before the R121s I was using the old Fostex M11RP ribbon mics (still got 6 of those). I also had a subscription to new ribbons at the timegrudge. They still work great for room mics. The R121 rocks my world. I hear the SF12 sounds great as well and has a little more high end. Makes you just want to click the GIMME button at Fletchers site over and over.

The R121s also got used on the overheads on the last session. I had to add a little EQ on the top but it sounded great. Very nice for digital recording.

[alphajerk]

michael. the R121's ARE great for guitars... they just take a full on beating with SPL. their ribbons are thicker which withstand more air but you lose a bit of top end because of it. i assume you know the turn it backwards trick? [brighter]

i just got back my B&O BM5 from stephen sank yesterday. its what the SF12 is modelled after.... i had mine modded with a 44bx NOS ribbon. supposedly much better top end. you cant push the SF12/SF1's as much as the R121 due to a thinner ribbon. supposedly you can easily change the R121 ribbon in the field... i should probably order some replacement ribbons. i think you get one re-ribbon with purchase and registration.

i have a session in 2 days [and STILL havent finished my reconstruction paint goes in tonight :eek: floor goes down tomorrow] but its only a 2 song demo. nevertheless, this B&O just sounds FAN****INTASTIC as overheads, i used it on a session right before i sent it off to be modded. i will never not use it again on overheads. i highly suggest a SF12. makes the cymbals just PERFECT. snare sound pretty fat too. i could easily do a 2 mic setup with my B&O up top and an R121 out front [if i only had another R121... unfortunately that goes on guitar]

[Jay Kahrs]

I'm really digging the Blue Baby Bottle on electric guitar. The R-121 is very cool and this is right up there, and about half the price. Very midrangy, smooth top. Kind of like a ribbon with lots of output and a really really low self noise.

I heard that Fostex is reissuing the ribbon mics. Any truth to that?

[Gone Fission]

I had convinced myself the Baby Bottle was the next mic I should get, then I read Dorsey on R.A.P. talking about how it has a noticably limited bandwidth. Does it sound like it? Do you find it to be pretty flexible or pretty application specific? Or am I being too cautious to really be a gear slut?

Bear