Nagra 4 S and Nagra 4.2

[dojames]

Apple-q, does it matter if the camera is sync differently? Say if the Nagra is synced at 50 Hz, and the camera is synced at 60 Hz? I'll be using a North American camera and if I get this Nagra IV-S from the UK will I have any problems?

[Matti]

The pilot would be only a recording of the speed of the recorder during the take
and resolved to that during the transfer.
But as it's easy to change the setting why not do it

Matti

Edit: To open the recorder there are two screws to loosen on the right side and then just lift the top, it will open like a door

[dojames]

Can someone help me with this:

I'm trying to determine if a IV-S unit has the pilot synchronization track from a picture which I have attached. It's definitely not the time-code model of the IV-S.

If you can see the picture it shows that the unit has a pilot reader to the left of the modulometer. So is it definitely then a NQS-L (pilot synchronization track model), or do for some reason the NQS-LSP (no synch track) have this pilot reader too?

Thanks a lot

[Matti]

Does it have the head for neopilot? ( Between record and play heads )

Matti

[apple-q]

Originally Posted by dojames

Apple-q, does it matter if the camera is sync differently? Say if the Nagra is synced at 50 Hz, and the camera is synced at 60 Hz? I'll be using a North American camera and if I get this Nagra IV-S from the UK will I have any problems?

This has nothing to do with the camera unless you plan to use a pilot cable. But I understand that your camera is crystal sync.

Apart from switching the Frequency it the absolute value only matters if you want to resolve the Nagra to mains frequency which was usually done when transferring to mag. The mag machine woud run in sync to mains frequency and the Nagra as well. So if you recorded a 50Hz Pilot and resolved to 60Hz mains in the US your transfer would ne out of sync.

But if you resolve the Nagra to the same crystal (not mains) it would run at 100% speed so keep 100% sync.

But as Matti mentioned you can switch the frequency anyway. A UK-model will most likely have the 50Hz strobe pattern on the left roll. This to check rough sync with a 50Hz light bulb. The head will seem as if it´s more or less still when playing under a 50Hz light.
The US model will have a 60Hz strobe pattern.
But those can be exchanged of course.

[apple-q]

Originally Posted by dojames

Can someone help me with this:

I'm trying to determine if a IV-S unit has the pilot synchronization track from a picture which I have attached. It's definitely not the time-code model of the IV-S.

If you can see the picture it shows that the unit has a pilot reader to the left of the modulometer. So is it definitely then a NQS-L (pilot synchronization track model), or do for some reason the NQS-LSP (no synch track) have this pilot reader too?

Thanks a lot

Why not ask the seller for EXACT specs? We can just speculate with that photo. Does the pilot indicator come on when recording and playback?

How many heads does that Nagra have? 3 or 4? A sync nagra has an erase-head (brown on the far left), a pilot/tc head, a record head and a play head.
On a non sync nagra I guess the pilot head would be missing but I´ve never seen a nagra 4S without pilot/tc. Wouldn´t make sense on set ;-)

Here a picture of the non-sync Nagra E:

As you can see it only has 3 heads just like a regular studio multi-track open reel machine.

[dojames]

I uploaded a photo of the recording heads. Looks like the pilot recording head is there.

[philper]

Originally Posted by dojames

I uploaded a photo of the recording heads. Looks like the pilot recording head is there.

Yes, you have a sync head--the center head of the 3 silver ones.

phil p

[dojames]

Brilliant. Thanks to you all.

[charles maynes]

Originally Posted by Plush

Please take a world wide view.

It IS easy to shoot a film with a Nagra today. It is done every day in India, by far the largest film production country. It is done all over South America, in Russia, all over Asia etc. Only in the 1st. world and in Hollywood is the system up to date.

In any case, the OP pm'ed me and asked me all about the Nagras. I did tell him that my expertise is in music recording. If you want to know about Nagra, you can ask me whatever you want to know. (because you got it all wrong in your above post #62) If you want to tell me why you don't need a Nagra, then you are in the wrong thread because the OP asked about Nagra.

all the Russian crews I know are using digital-

The Nagra is a nice machine if you can deal with its limitations, but it is no longer the standard in most of the world for film production-

[Nicholas West]

I recently bought a Nagra IV S from Trew Audio. What a beautiful machine; it radiates technological beauty just sitting there not doing anything.

I bought it to transfer a very large archive of 2 track and mono tapes, many them very old, to high rez digital. One of the things they rarely talk about, but it's another way the Nagra shines, is that it is probably the gentlest and least dangerous tape transport for delicate old tapes out there. NOTHING touches the oxide during fast wind except two high precision free spinning aluminum rollers; no stationary tape guides or lifters to grind your precious oxide off as the tape goes by. The braking system is super gentle.

The quality of the wind on the takeup reel after playback is stunning; absolutely flat. And during playback there are ruby edged tape guides to get the tape by a mirror finished capstan. Amazing. This machine is a dream for a tape archivist or conservator.

[apple-q]

you are using a 4S to transfer mono full-track tapes?

not a good idea, especially when they were recorded with pilot tone.

[Nicholas West]

Who said they were recorded with a pilot tone? Who said they were full track?

[apple-q]

Originally Posted by Nicholas West

Who said they were recorded with a pilot tone? Who said they were full track?

No one. I just wanted to mention that mono full track tapes might cause trouble on a stereo-nagra.
When someone brings me a mono Nagra tape I usually assume it´s a tape recorded with a mono Nagra not a Stereo tape recorded with identical signal on 1&2. The latter I would call a Stereo-Nagra Tape with the same signal on 1&2.

So probably just a misunderstanding....

[Matti]

Full track tape on a stereo recorder doesn't cause any trouble if the playback head is properly aligned

Matti

[apple-q]

Originally Posted by Matti

Full track tape on a stereo recorder doesn't cause any trouble if the playback head is properly aligned

Matti

the pilot of the nagra 4.2 is not compatible with the 4s. thats what I meant

[Matti]

Learnt that in the seventies, sure -He hasn't any sync tapes

Matti

[hywyn]

I've got a very tired looking Nagra I just bought for a tenner! It is without a PSU and I'm not sure it even powers up with batteries, so I may be jumping the gun asking if it is possible to use this for its mic amps (also limiter, eq) by-passing tape and going directly to the line outputs?
Cheers,
Steve

[apple-q]

Originally Posted by hywyn

I've got a very tired looking Nagra I just bought for a tenner! It is without a PSU and I'm not sure it even powers up with batteries, so I may be jumping the gun asking if it is possible to use this for its mic amps (also limiter, eq) by-passing tape and going directly to the line outputs?
Cheers,
Steve

If it doesn´t power up you can not use the mic amps either.

[hywyn]

Originally Posted by apple-q

If it doesn´t power up you can not use the mic amps either.

I know. I did say I may be jumping the gun. Thanks, steve

[Rolo 46]

Nagra PSU is 35vdc
lots on the Bay
there are fuses in the battery compartment and on main board
You can use it in Test or Record
Is it Stereo?

[hywyn]

Originally Posted by Rolo 46

Nagra PSU is 35vdc
lots on the Bay
there are fuses in the battery compartment and on main board
You can use it in Test or Record
Is it Stereo?

Hi,
It's mono but has three inputs, - two stereo, one line. I knoe headphones are fed the direct signal but am not at all sure the direct signal is sent to the banana plug line outputs in test - lots of mention in the manual about feedback. Would love to know for sure. I imagine the compression could be very good on certain sources.
Thanks,
Steve

[Rolo 46]

Originally Posted by hywyn

Hi,
It's mono but has three inputs, - two stereo, one line. I knoe headphones are fed the direct signal but am not at all sure the direct signal is sent to the banana plug line outputs in test - lots of mention in the manual about feedback. Would love to know for sure. I imagine the compression could be very good on certain sources.
Thanks,
Steve

Sorry Steve
Makes no sense, its either mono or a stereo
Direct is sent to the line outs
Sounds like a mono with 'auto' on 1 and 2.
These can be used as comps with a bit of padding
Tape comp is best (limiter on)

[hywyn]

Originally Posted by Rolo 46

Sorry Steve
Makes no sense, its either mono or a stereo
Direct is sent to the line outs
Sounds like a mono with 'auto' on 1 and 2.
These can be used as comps with a bit of padding
Tape comp is best (limiter on)

Thanks for this.
Yes I made no sense writing stereo, - sorry, I meant mono mic inputs.
I thought tape compression would be the best use!
I'd like to know for sure whethef the line-outputs are fed signal during record as well as playback?
Cheers,
Steve

[ben_havoc]

Hi, Everyone,
I just recently obtained a IV-s, and I'd like to use it for stereo bouncing of my DAW mixes. Then I would record stuff back to digital.

An engineer did the basic maintenace works such as head alingment. The machine was made in 1978 so I guess the heads were replaced sometime, since they only show minor wear signs. I received it with BASF 911 tape inside (plays perfectly) and a legend on a sticker said the thing is aligned for 911 formula@7,5ips.

I have already ordered 911 RMGI from Germany but I'd like to use it @15ips w nagramaster EQ.

What parameters shall I change along with the faster speed?
What recording levels shall I read on the meters when recording audio from my DAW ("ball-park" values, obviously, for modern pop/rock)?
How best to use the limiter and the EQ options? I'd be happy if I could omit plugin compression on the 2-bus. Any other things to look out for?
Thx in advance for any advice!

[Rolo 46]

NagraMaster is 7.5 ips eq @ 15ips, so no change is required
Experiment with mod levels for saturation and leave the limiter off

[leddy]

Originally Posted by ben_havoc

Hi, Everyone,
I just recently obtained a IV-s, and I'd like to use it for stereo bouncing of my DAW mixes. Then I would record stuff back to digital.

An engineer did the basic maintenace works such as head alingment. The machine was made in 1978 so I guess the heads were replaced sometime, since they only show minor wear signs. I received it with BASF 911 tape inside (plays perfectly) and a legend on a sticker said the thing is aligned for 911 formula@7,5ips.

I have already ordered 911 RMGI from Germany but I'd like to use it @15ips w nagramaster EQ.

What parameters shall I change along with the faster speed?
What recording levels shall I read on the meters when recording audio from my DAW ("ball-park" values, obviously, for modern pop/rock)?
How best to use the limiter and the EQ options? I'd be happy if I could omit plugin compression on the 2-bus. Any other things to look out for?
Thx in advance for any advice!

Are the lucky sob who got that one on Ebay someone had a BIN for $500? Seller must have confused it with the mono ones that go for that.

Anyway, 15 ips with NM EQ is going to be very clean and have limited tape artifacts to it, if that's what you are looking for. in other words, it's not going to sound like an old Ampex. That was its selling point.

You may wish to go the other direction and use 7.5 ips and try some other tape formulations to get more tape artifacts.

I would use 15 ips NM for field recordings of piano music, etc. For my purposes (mainly jazz) I use 7.5.

[ben_havoc]

Thank both of you for the quick reply.
No, mine was gathering dust at a voice-over and movie facility for 10+ years, after which they decided to sell it. It was a good buy anyway
I'll leave the settings alone then and experiment with rec level. Shall come handy for the imminent home-mastering of my band's EP. Can't wait for the fresh tape to arrive!

[ben_havoc]

I know I must be at least funny asking elementary questions, but, alas, I need some advice. I started exporting music to the Nagra, using brand new 911 tape@15ips NM eq. The first thing I noticed after setting a sensible rec level that did not seem to wreck all the dynamics was the total lack of treble. I mean, I was prepared for SOME of it, but this one sounded like listening from behind a heavy velvet curtain - you get the point. I tried playing back the NM eq-ed recording with normal 15ips CCIR setting, and even so, the highs were missing. (7.5 did not work out either, the same missing treble but with a lot more hiss.)

Just as I started pondering about putting a tilt-style EQ before the DAC, another, rather more annoying problem surfaced. Upon playback, the music came back with a slapback echo - a beautyful one, I must admit, but I was not looking for a Space Echo

Could you provide me some points where to start looking for the mistake/error? Is it my fault or maybe the head or BIAS setting might be wrong, or could it be the EQ circuitry? THX!

[Rolo 46]

Clapped out heads?
Find a calibrated playback tape
Do a head clean and rebias