1st orchestral recording

[lyrictenor1]

The other night I had my first chance to do an orchestral recording. It was volunteer group that decided to play an ambitious program: Mahler Symphony 1.

I'm going to try to attach the .wav file...any feedback would be great, as I'm trying to improve the more I do this.

My signal chain was Studio Projects C4s in cardioid for the main pair (ORTF) and Studio Projects C4s in omni for the outriggers--> SP828 Pre --> Mbox 2 Pro --> PTLE 8.

The ORTF pair was placed just to the right of the conductor as he didn't want the mics right behind him. I had to screw with the mic angle a bit, so it wasn't a true ORTF.

No processing, except for a little automation to duck the L outrigger due to the bass drum hits (bass drum player wasn't there for the sound check). Because gearslutz's attachment size constraints I compressed the file to a 128 kpbs MP3.

Let me know what you think, what could be improved, etc.

Thanks in advance!

[boojum]

I'd say this is a very good recording. There seems to be some attenuation in the middle. Other than that I'd say yoou get high marks.

[lyrictenor1]

Thanks, boojum! Did you mean the mid-frequencies were attenuated or the middle of the image was attenuated?

For some reason the .mp3 of this sounds brighter than the original .wav...

[rumleymusic]

The ORTF pair was placed just to the right of the conductor as he didn't want the mics right behind him

Kind of querky.

What was the height and distance from the conductor?

[lyrictenor1]

Rumley,

here's a pic of the setup...

[tenor39]

In my experience the ORTF or X/Y main pair and the omni outriggers need to be at the same height. There is a discernable time delay offset in the recording from the differences in mic height, as well as the closeness to the instruments. As a result, the violins and cellos are down in the mix and sound very distant in comparison to the percussion and brass.

[boojum]

Looks like the ORTF should be OK. I meant there seemed to be a drop in level in the middle of the sound stage. It is a very good recording.

[lyrictenor1]

Thanks for the continued feedback, guys!

Rumley, querky in what way? Is it the image?

Tenor39, hmmmm...I'll have to probably get some taller stands for the flanks then... I'm not hearing the time delay, but perhaps that's b/c I'm fairly new to recording. I DO know that the orchestra wasn't very together overall, but I don't think that is to what you were referring...

Keep 'em coming!

[chris319]

Do you have a version without the outriggers? I can hear the phase difference, too.

In the picture the mics are quite small but your main pair look like they're pointing over the top of the orchestra rather than down at it. Next time try the omni capsules.

[lyrictenor1]

Originally Posted by chris319

Do you have a version without the outriggers? I can hear the phase difference, too.

In the picture the mics are quite small but your main pair look like they're pointing over the top of the orchestra rather than down at it. Next time try the omni capsules.

Attached is the mix from the ORTF pair. Also attached is another pic--I tried to get the main pair to point towards the first row of woodwinds.

[chris319]

In the first clip the percussion is way too strong, overpowering the strings. I suspect it is being picked up by your stage right outrigger. The second clip has better balance between percussion and strings.

In the second picture you posted it appears that the mic bodies are nearly horizontal, putting the strings off mic. From the position you have them they should be closer to a 45-degree angle to the floor, pointing down to where the music is.

Forget what I said about using the omni capsules. Looking at the polars for that mic, the pattern doesn't look well-behaved above 4 kHz.

I don't know that you need the outriggers.

[rumleymusic]

Rumley, querky in what way? Is it the image?

No not the sound, the conductor not wanting a stand behind him. But now that I see the pic, I can understand why.

[rumleymusic]

Looking at the pic and listening to the ORTF clip. I don't think you had your angle wide enough. It looks to be less than 90 degrees. Next time I would try the full 110 degrees at 17cm. It does make a big difference.

[tweedgv]

i am looking to record a small orchestra (30 instruments). can anyone help me get an idea of the size of live room id be looking for or even better, a recording studio with a big enough live room in the UK. bearing in mind Air and Abbey road are slightly out of budget.

[Rolo 46]

I record 30 pc string orch in a 100' x 50 x 40 room with pillars and a dome and a stage
Sounds a bit like the Wigmore Hall
I would like to record in St Georges, Brandon Hill ,Bristol
This is similar but has triple glazing.

Look at local victorian theatres, the old ones have excellent acoustics when empty.

[johnsound]

Do you have all the equipment to record on location? If not, will you have to rent all the kit? If you do have to rent the kit, then you may well find that the big London studios are not so expensive after all. Call and ask for quotes - you never know. You could also try Angel Studios, where there's a nice live room and whose rates are slightly less than the other two you mentioned. Otherwise, there's Henry Wood Hall and St. John's, Smith Square, although the latter can be a bit noisy at times.

Regards,

John

[Rolo 46]

Try TC1 at TVC
The beebs trying to flog it off
It sounds ok when completely empty

[JazzSax_UT]

The brass sound pretty good. Too bad the Orchestra didn't have enough strings to balance out the brass. How many violins did they have?

On a side note, I played this piece in college. Great symphony, very fun to play. I had to switch between 4 different clarinets. Eb Soprano, Bb Soprano, A Soprano and Bass Clarinet.