Alternatives to MD recorders: Recording rehearsals?

Blast9 · 27th October 2005, 07:44 PM

Anyone using their MP3 players/recorders or cheaper 2 trk recorders for recording rehearsals?

I'm reluctant to buy another MD recorder, as they don't seem very robust, and seem error-prone: I've bust 2

So I'm gravitating towards an MP3 recorder with an external condenser:

I-river with mic and line-ins

iPod with Belkin adapter and mic

Any thoughts?

I'm gonna avoid built-in mics, unless you can persuade me otherwise!

the_binary_soul · 28th October 2005, 12:44 AM

Md players not robust? I dropped mine five feet onto a cement floor several times and it didn't seem to affect it at all. ... but either way I doubt you will find an ipod any better, since they are basically just a harddrive with a screen and harddrives are fairly sensitive to shock damage.

That said, I'm not really sure about alternatives.... I'm sure someone else has an idea

Blast9 · 28th October 2005, 10:28 AM

Seriously? 5 feet, and it survived?

the 2 I've been through suffered minor knocks really, and they both died on me (Sony and Sharp)... These were small portable "Walkman" type MD recorders, not the larger ones.

I understand you can get a "ruggedised" kit for field work, but they're really not cheap!

The main attraction of MP3 recorders is the ease of drag/drop, and no need to change the file format from ATRAC before you email the rehearsal to your bandmates... Ah the modern age!

But I take your point about MP3 player/hard disk vulnerability.. MUST BE MORE CAREFUL

petsematary · 2nd November 2005, 10:27 PM

I made a customized rubber case thingie for my MD walkman, and it works great. Like a slim leather case only rubber.

funkateer · 26th November 2005, 04:20 AM

Try

http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cg...SP-GIGATRACKER

I've been using it to record gigs, rehearsals, and my jazz improv class.

Don S · 26th November 2005, 04:54 AM

Seriously,

I've heard many complaints about MD, but never that one. Actually mine added a smile to the EQ curve upon playback. Very natural sounding although not added by me. Unless you spend mucho bux on a pro flash recorder, the MD will be your best option. I do have friends (non engineers) who like the recording they get from Ipod w/ an external mic. But that setup will run you at least $500.

Best Regards,
Don

Rand0mRoll77 · 26th November 2005, 06:41 AM

I'm suprised I haven't heard much about them here, but most of us concert tapers over at taperssection.com use Creative Nomad Jukebox 3s

THey are mp3/wav recorders with 20gb or 40gb hard drives and record in wav format via an 1/8 inch plug in stereo. You will need an external powered mic but those aren't very expensive. I use soundprofessionals.com modded AT853s into a 9v battery box and have gotten some great recordings

The microtracker is another option but it's not quite stable yet...

JB3s can be found on ebay for about 150$, creative doesn't make them anymore

bove · 11th December 2005, 06:32 PM

http://gearslutz.com/board/showthread.php3?t=40493

The M-Audio Microtrack might work well for you... no moving parts to break (even if you drop it), and although it seems lightweight, it seems more sturdy than a MD recorder.

cajonezzz · 11th December 2005, 08:17 PM

Might be overkill for you, but I've been using Garageband, or Audio Hijack Pro with either just my powerbook mic, or a external sony.
Sometimes I'll use my Firewire Solo and Maudio Ptools if the rehearsal fodder is going to make it to production.
I find that pretty much every situation I'm in for rehearsals has wifi available, and just about everyone in the band has laptops going. Pretty funny.

I did a pop tour last year and in rehearsals I counted 14 power book/ibooks open at one time. ( rehearsal studio in Burbank) I seriously thought about calling Apple for a group pic.

times have changed. The belkin voice recorder sucks btw. It someone came along with a ipod based mic/software option that would record at higher res and stereo, I'd be all over it.
don't waste your money, I already did.

PHILANDDON · 12th December 2005, 05:09 PM

How about that HHB recording mic. How cool is that!!

David Spearritt · 12th December 2005, 10:47 PM

It would be if it was connected to a decent mic.

Blast9 · 13th December 2005, 12:33 AM

Wow guys... thanks so far for you valuable input... Guess it ain't gonna be the iPod/Belkin after all:

Neither will it be the Microtrack (too much £$£ for a glitchy product)

The HHB specs look OK, no?... Isn't a Sennheiser condensor MUCH better than any Sony or other mini-mics? Plus its an omni!

The only minus is the Automatic Gain Control... me no likee

>info< no price yet!

Creative do stuff with a line in I believe... Does the Nomad come with that? Better check it out! I'm tempted to get a battery-powered pre and use a dynamic mic + cable for better results... otherwise its my stereo Sony mic into the Creative's pre

>> Any decent battery-powered pres? <<

Blast9 · 13th December 2005, 01:04 AM

PS RE HHB... what's MPEG2?

Why on earth no MP3? Seems like the world's gone crazy for that format... and who cares if its lossy.. it ain't like its cassette quality!

Blast9 · 14th December 2005, 11:32 AM

HHB recording mic RRP around £600

PDF

OUCH! Won't be getting that in a hurry... Mind you, that's still less than 1/2 the RRP of the new Sony gadget with the coincident pair.

It looks a very comprehensive setup with variable compression for MP2 format and variable bit rate for either WAV or MP2, built-in headphone amp, usb connector either AGC or standard variable input gain

1 GB of flash memory will come down in price over the next 6 months I'm sure... so its gonna be better for someone in our boat likely to already have a mic or 2 lying around to get a stand-alone flash based recorder, get a cable/adaptor and do it that way

smarsland · 14th December 2005, 12:01 PM

i broke down...

i ordered a microtrack yesterday.

i feel wrong.

Blast9 · 14th December 2005, 12:15 PM

I feel for ya! at least you've decided! Let us know how you get on!

sleepwalker · 16th December 2005, 11:23 PM

Yup. Nomad 3, Rode NT4, Denecke AD converter. Great portable setup. Great sound. You can also record uncompressed 16/44.1 PCM.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rand0mRoll77

I'm suprised I haven't heard much about them here, but most of us concert tapers over at taperssection.com use Creative Nomad Jukebox 3s

THey are mp3/wav recorders with 20gb or 40gb hard drives and record in wav format via an 1/8 inch plug in stereo. You will need an external powered mic but those aren't very expensive. I use soundprofessionals.com modded AT853s into a 9v battery box and have gotten some great recordings

The microtracker is another option but it's not quite stable yet...

JB3s can be found on ebay for about 150$, creative doesn't make them anymore

David Spearritt · 17th December 2005, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blast9

... new Sony gadget with the coincident pair.

Except that its not a coincicent pair, but slightly spaced and spaced the wrong way. Sound from the left will hit the right mic first. Great stuff SONY.

Blast9 · 17th December 2005, 02:59 PM

Whoops....

"Great stuff SONY."

petsematary · 17th December 2005, 03:58 PM

The Marantz PMD600 with the Oade Bros. basic modification is supposed to be great. Shame they only ship to the US.

Blast9 · 11th January 2008, 03:00 PM

BUMP - Just a heads-up

This is what I've finally settled on after ages and ages

Found this blog review on the Zoom H2

What's everyone else using?

Anyone buy the Sony PCM D-1?

aaron_in_sf · 11th January 2008, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blast9

BUMP - Just a heads-up

This is what I've finally settled on after ages and ages

Found this blog review on the Zoom H2

What's everyone else using?

Anyone buy the Sony PCM D-1?

Just saw this thread, I would have rec'd the H2. The external mic path is noisy, but the interal mics (all four(!)) are quite serviceable and the ease of use factor is excellent. I'm a long-time MD and HiMD user and I find this thing quite handy... and at US$180 you can't lose. Four-channel surround in your pocket... and it mounts on my nanostand.

Re: the PCM D-1, have you seen its much-cheaper new sibling the PCM-D50? I quote (without permission) from the Naturerecordists list, where today Oryoki wrote:

"The [Marantz] PDM620 and [Sony] PCM-D50 are both very good recorders. I think they have different target audiences. The Marantz is very small and light, a great "point and shoot" recorder that can be carried in pocket or purse.

The Sony is twice as large and 3 times as heavy, so it's more of a burden to lug around. (It's smaller than the [Nagra] ARES-PII+, however). The PCM-D50's preamp provides much more gain than the Marantz. Its built-in mics sound a little "bright" but are acceptable.

The PCM-D50 sounds very good with an external mic. The PDM620 can too if you keep the gain below maximum, thus avoiding adding noise from the preamp.

Both recorders are susceptible to noise if you're recording hand-held. Both have a way to attach a small tripod for placement on a table top.

The PCM-D50 has a 50% higher price, which is reflected in its sturdy construction, high quality buttons, pre-roll feature, higher digitization rate (24/96 vs 24/48) and LCD display that is large and legible in daylight (the PDM620 is all but illegible outdoors during the day).

None of this will help if the size of the Sony recorder means it will be left behind."

See also:

Family Oral History Using Digital Tools | Marantz PMD620 Review

aaron
--
quietamerican.org
oneminutevacation.org

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27th October 2005, 07:44 PM	#1
Blast9 Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: London Posts: 2,805	Alternatives to MD recorders: Recording rehearsals? Anyone using their MP3 players/recorders or cheaper 2 trk recorders for recording rehearsals? I'm reluctant to buy another MD recorder, as they don't seem very robust, and seem error-prone: I've bust 2 So I'm gravitating towards an MP3 recorder with an external condenser: I-river with mic and line-ins iPod with Belkin adapter and mic Any thoughts? I'm gonna avoid built-in mics, unless you can persuade me otherwise! __________________ :: my band is called protoangel My guitars: Atkin OM (sitka spruce top walnut back: sweet mids):: Atkin Small Jumbo (cedar top, rosewood back: big bottom, sparkly top):: Jap Tele with fat frets (rude and fat):: . My amps: 1973 Hiwatt DR504::Framus Dragon ... Latest purchases Kel Audio HM-2d TC Electronic Nova System, Chameleon Labs 7602 Digi 002 + PTLE, Addictive Drums

28th October 2005, 10:28 AM	#3
Blast9 Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: London Posts: 2,805	Seriously? 5 feet, and it survived? the 2 I've been through suffered minor knocks really, and they both died on me (Sony and Sharp)... These were small portable "Walkman" type MD recorders, not the larger ones. I understand you can get a "ruggedised" kit for field work, but they're really not cheap! The main attraction of MP3 recorders is the ease of drag/drop, and no need to change the file format from ATRAC before you email the rehearsal to your bandmates... Ah the modern age! But I take your point about MP3 player/hard disk vulnerability.. MUST BE MORE CAREFUL __________________ :: my band is called protoangel My guitars: Atkin OM (sitka spruce top walnut back: sweet mids):: Atkin Small Jumbo (cedar top, rosewood back: big bottom, sparkly top):: Jap Tele with fat frets (rude and fat):: . My amps: 1973 Hiwatt DR504::Framus Dragon ... Latest purchases Kel Audio HM-2d TC Electronic Nova System, Chameleon Labs 7602 Digi 002 + PTLE, Addictive Drums

2nd November 2005, 10:27 PM	#4
petsematary Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: East Coast, Sweden Posts: 1,142	I made a customized rubber case thingie for my MD walkman, and it works great. Like a slim leather case only rubber. __________________ (click to see me and my work)

26th November 2005, 04:54 AM	#6
Don S Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 699	Seriously, I've heard many complaints about MD, but never that one. Actually mine added a smile to the EQ curve upon playback. Very natural sounding although not added by me. Unless you spend mucho bux on a pro flash recorder, the MD will be your best option. I do have friends (non engineers) who like the recording they get from Ipod w/ an external mic. But that setup will run you at least $500. Best Regards, Don __________________ www.symphonicsound.com

28th October 2005, 12:44 AM	#2
the_binary_soul Gear interested Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 11	Md players not robust? I dropped mine five feet onto a cement floor several times and it didn't seem to affect it at all. ... but either way I doubt you will find an ipod any better, since they are basically just a harddrive with a screen and harddrives are fairly sensitive to shock damage. That said, I'm not really sure about alternatives.... I'm sure someone else has an idea

26th November 2005, 04:20 AM	#5
funkateer Gear interested Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 7	Try http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cg...SP-GIGATRACKER I've been using it to record gigs, rehearsals, and my jazz improv class.

26th November 2005, 06:41 AM	#7
Rand0mRoll77 Gear interested Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 27	I'm suprised I haven't heard much about them here, but most of us concert tapers over at taperssection.com use Creative Nomad Jukebox 3s THey are mp3/wav recorders with 20gb or 40gb hard drives and record in wav format via an 1/8 inch plug in stereo. You will need an external powered mic but those aren't very expensive. I use soundprofessionals.com modded AT853s into a 9v battery box and have gotten some great recordings The microtracker is another option but it's not quite stable yet... JB3s can be found on ebay for about 150$, creative doesn't make them anymore

11th December 2005, 06:32 PM	#8
bove Gear maniac Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York, NY Posts: 203	http://gearslutz.com/board/showthread.php3?t=40493 The M-Audio Microtrack might work well for you... no moving parts to break (even if you drop it), and although it seems lightweight, it seems more sturdy than a MD recorder.

11th December 2005, 08:17 PM	#9
cajonezzz Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Carlsbad Ca. Posts: 1,723	Might be overkill for you, but I've been using Garageband, or Audio Hijack Pro with either just my powerbook mic, or a external sony. Sometimes I'll use my Firewire Solo and Maudio Ptools if the rehearsal fodder is going to make it to production. I find that pretty much every situation I'm in for rehearsals has wifi available, and just about everyone in the band has laptops going. Pretty funny. I did a pop tour last year and in rehearsals I counted 14 power book/ibooks open at one time. ( rehearsal studio in Burbank) I seriously thought about calling Apple for a group pic. times have changed. The belkin voice recorder sucks btw. It someone came along with a ipod based mic/software option that would record at higher res and stereo, I'd be all over it. don't waste your money, I already did. __________________ Craig Zarkos http://www.myspace.com/cajonezzz http://tybridroom.com/ z-orama TourstopLIVE! Calavera Proving Grounds (record & ride!) ----------------------------------------------------------------- Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Watch your words, for they become actions. Watch your actions, for they become habits. Watch your habits, for they become character. Watch your character, for it becomes your destiny.

12th December 2005, 05:09 PM	#10
PHILANDDON Gear maniac Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 219	How about that HHB recording mic. How cool is that!!

12th December 2005, 10:47 PM	#11
David Spearritt Gear addict Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 437	It would be if it was connected to a decent mic.

13th December 2005, 12:33 AM	#12
Blast9 Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: London Posts: 2,805	Wow guys... thanks so far for you valuable input... Guess it ain't gonna be the iPod/Belkin after all: Neither will it be the Microtrack (too much £$£ for a glitchy product) The HHB specs look OK, no?... Isn't a Sennheiser condensor MUCH better than any Sony or other mini-mics? Plus its an omni! The only minus is the Automatic Gain Control... me no likee >info< no price yet! Creative do stuff with a line in I believe... Does the Nomad come with that? Better check it out! I'm tempted to get a battery-powered pre and use a dynamic mic + cable for better results... otherwise its my stereo Sony mic into the Creative's pre >> Any decent battery-powered pres? << __________________ :: my band is called protoangel My guitars: Atkin OM (sitka spruce top walnut back: sweet mids):: Atkin Small Jumbo (cedar top, rosewood back: big bottom, sparkly top):: Jap Tele with fat frets (rude and fat):: . My amps: 1973 Hiwatt DR504::Framus Dragon ... Latest purchases Kel Audio HM-2d TC Electronic Nova System, Chameleon Labs 7602 Digi 002 + PTLE, Addictive Drums

13th December 2005, 01:04 AM	#13
Blast9 Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: London Posts: 2,805	PS RE HHB... what's MPEG2? Why on earth no MP3? Seems like the world's gone crazy for that format... and who cares if its lossy.. it ain't like its cassette quality! __________________ :: my band is called protoangel My guitars: Atkin OM (sitka spruce top walnut back: sweet mids):: Atkin Small Jumbo (cedar top, rosewood back: big bottom, sparkly top):: Jap Tele with fat frets (rude and fat):: . My amps: 1973 Hiwatt DR504::Framus Dragon ... Latest purchases Kel Audio HM-2d TC Electronic Nova System, Chameleon Labs 7602 Digi 002 + PTLE, Addictive Drums

14th December 2005, 11:32 AM	#14
Blast9 Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: London Posts: 2,805	HHB recording mic RRP around £600 PDF OUCH! Won't be getting that in a hurry... Mind you, that's still less than 1/2 the RRP of the new Sony gadget with the coincident pair. It looks a very comprehensive setup with variable compression for MP2 format and variable bit rate for either WAV or MP2, built-in headphone amp, usb connector either AGC or standard variable input gain 1 GB of flash memory will come down in price over the next 6 months I'm sure... so its gonna be better for someone in our boat likely to already have a mic or 2 lying around to get a stand-alone flash based recorder, get a cable/adaptor and do it that way __________________ :: my band is called protoangel My guitars: Atkin OM (sitka spruce top walnut back: sweet mids):: Atkin Small Jumbo (cedar top, rosewood back: big bottom, sparkly top):: Jap Tele with fat frets (rude and fat):: . My amps: 1973 Hiwatt DR504::Framus Dragon ... Latest purchases Kel Audio HM-2d TC Electronic Nova System, Chameleon Labs 7602 Digi 002 + PTLE, Addictive Drums

14th December 2005, 12:01 PM	#15
smarsland Gear maniac Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Fairfield, CT Posts: 248	i broke down... i ordered a microtrack yesterday. i feel wrong.

14th December 2005, 12:15 PM	#16
Blast9 Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: London Posts: 2,805	I feel for ya! at least you've decided! Let us know how you get on! __________________ :: my band is called protoangel My guitars: Atkin OM (sitka spruce top walnut back: sweet mids):: Atkin Small Jumbo (cedar top, rosewood back: big bottom, sparkly top):: Jap Tele with fat frets (rude and fat):: . My amps: 1973 Hiwatt DR504::Framus Dragon ... Latest purchases Kel Audio HM-2d TC Electronic Nova System, Chameleon Labs 7602 Digi 002 + PTLE, Addictive Drums

17th December 2005, 02:59 PM	#19
Blast9 Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: London Posts: 2,805	Whoops.... "Great stuff SONY." __________________ :: my band is called protoangel My guitars: Atkin OM (sitka spruce top walnut back: sweet mids):: Atkin Small Jumbo (cedar top, rosewood back: big bottom, sparkly top):: Jap Tele with fat frets (rude and fat):: . My amps: 1973 Hiwatt DR504::Framus Dragon ... Latest purchases Kel Audio HM-2d TC Electronic Nova System, Chameleon Labs 7602 Digi 002 + PTLE, Addictive Drums

17th December 2005, 03:58 PM	#20
petsematary Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: East Coast, Sweden Posts: 1,142	The Marantz PMD600 with the Oade Bros. basic modification is supposed to be great. Shame they only ship to the US. __________________ (click to see me and my work)

11th January 2008, 03:00 PM	#21
Blast9 Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: London Posts: 2,805	BUMP - Just a heads-up This is what I've finally settled on after ages and ages Found this blog review on the Zoom H2 What's everyone else using? Anyone buy the Sony PCM D-1? __________________ :: my band is called protoangel My guitars: Atkin OM (sitka spruce top walnut back: sweet mids):: Atkin Small Jumbo (cedar top, rosewood back: big bottom, sparkly top):: Jap Tele with fat frets (rude and fat):: . My amps: 1973 Hiwatt DR504::Framus Dragon ... Latest purchases Kel Audio HM-2d TC Electronic Nova System, Chameleon Labs 7602 Digi 002 + PTLE, Addictive Drums

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