portable field recorders comparison help

[snir_gu]

i'm intrested in purchase new field recorder for amb/sfx surround recordings.

the gear have to include the following features:

* at least 6 analog balanced inputs mic/line with quality low noise pre amps.

* sample recording resolution of at least 24@96khz for 6 ch recording simultaneously.

* option for 24@192khz recording resolution with less channels (2/4)simultaneously.


if someone have an helpfull link for comparison between the leading companies , i'll be more then glad..

thanks

[Mikkel Nielsen]

you should take a look at this one:
TASCAM

$999

Best wishes,

Mikkel

[snir_gu]

Originally Posted by Pindebraende

you should take a look at this one:
TASCAM

$999

Best wishes,

Mikkel

thanks.

i see that it's cost the same as the edirol r44 .
i work with the edirol and didn't like it's pres and entered a lot of noise to the channel , did you try the tascam pres ?

[Mikkel Nielsen]

nope. But i will seriously consider this one, when im getting a new recorder. You should be able to demo one and check out the pres.

Best wishes

Mikkel

[tilman]

I got a 702.
This could be a nice adition...

[PoxyMusic]

Originally Posted by Pindebraende

you should take a look at this one:
TASCAM

$999

Holy cow! I wonder how good it's mic pres are? Otherwise it's perfect for the price point....glad to see it has pre-record.

If the mic pres are less than great, one could get really a really nice preamp/ a to d package like the Grace Lunatec, and record those to the 7 and 8 (sdif only) channels.

[philper]

Originally Posted by tilman

I got a 702.
This could be a nice adition...

But only 2 inputs. I'm curious about the new Tascams too. Meanwhile, the SD 788T is a very well thought out machine with a lot of options. For instance, they just released a fader panel for it--8 sliders and much more (CL9).

Philip Perkins

[PoxyMusic]

Originally Posted by philper

Meanwhile, the SD 788T is a very well thought out machine with a lot of options.(CL9).
Philip Perkins

Yeah, that's the one to beat. At $5,000 though that's a lotta scratch. Still, you get what you pay for.

[jason kanter]

Originally Posted by philper

But only 2 inputs. I'm curious about the new Tascams too. Meanwhile, the SD 788T is a very well thought out machine with a lot of options. For instance, they just released a fader panel for it--8 sliders and much more (CL9).

Philip Perkins

788 is a great machine but you're limited to 48/24.

[minister]

Originally Posted by jason kanter

788 is a great machine but you're limited to 48/24.

No you're not, it records up to and including 96k. Check out the specs on their site.

However:

Things to consider when recording High Sampling Rates (above 48.048 kHz):
• Real time recording to DVDRAM is not recommended.
• Sound Devices strongly recommends using high speed UDMA CompactFlash cards.
• Limits recording to only two storage media at a time.
• Track counts are restricted to 8 tracks.
• Input Limiters are disabled.
• Input Delay is limited to 15 msec.
• EQ Settings (CL-9 only) are disabled.

For FX collection, none of that is a deal breaker, except for maybe the input limiters. And then, if you feel you need them, you can use 2 744's connected by Ethernet cable. They don't have that limitation.

[maggot]

last time I tried it there were serious issues with linking machines at 96kHz.
after a random amount of time one machine would lose sync for a fraction of a second but continue recording out of sync.

problem was worse with 3 machines but was not a problem at 192k.

SD were informed several times and have been given very detailed info but I have never heard back about a fix despite hassling them a few times.

maybe they fixed it and I didn't notice but in any case be very careful with linking machines in 96k (or one of it's pulled variants)

justin

[philper]

Originally Posted by PoxyMusic

Yeah, that's the one to beat. At $5,000 though that's a lotta scratch. Still, you get what you pay for.

Actually they are more than that: 788s are over $6k. The Tascam 8track w/ TC and trim knobs for each track and dual CFs will be around $5k, an SD 744 is $4100. While the Tascam mentioned is a good deal, the 788T is an order of magnitude deeper and more versatile.

Philip Perkins

[PoxyMusic]

Originally Posted by philper

While the Tascam mentioned is a good deal, the 788T is an order of magnitude deeper and more versatile.

Philip Perkins

To be sure. If one is doing location dialog, then there's no doubt the SD is the machine to use. For someone like me though, (recording field fx) the Tascam is pretty attractive. Many of the features of the SD are not so important to me. I've always been impressed with the SD preamps though, and when recording backgrounds that's pretty much the most important feature to me. I have a hard time thinking that Tascam could beat them.

I hate having to compromise... :(

[Ozpeter]

i see that it's cost the same as the edirol r44 .
i work with the edirol and didn't like it's pres and entered a lot of noise to the channel , did you try the tascam pres ?

The R-44 (not the R-4) preamps seem well regarded in relation to the price point. If you found them noisy, then I suspect you will not be happy with anything at that kind of price point, so the Sound Devices range (or Nagra) may be required.

[philper]

Originally Posted by PoxyMusic

To be sure. If one is doing location dialog, then there's no doubt the SD is the machine to use. For someone like me though, (recording field fx) the Tascam is pretty attractive. Many of the features of the SD are not so important to me. I've always been impressed with the SD preamps though, and when recording backgrounds that's pretty much the most important feature to me. I have a hard time thinking that Tascam could beat them.

I hate having to compromise... :(

You can always use external preamps when you can. I have done a lot of nice recordings w/ the Tascam HDP2, using outboard SD (etc) pres.

Philip Perkins

[Gohanto]

Originally Posted by philper

You can always use external preamps when you can. I have done a lot of nice recordings w/ the Tascam HDP2, using outboard SD (etc) pres.

Philip Perkins

Now if only Tascam would release an updated HDP2 with balanced, line-level XLR inputs....

[MichaelPatrick]

Originally Posted by jason kanter

788 is a great machine but you're limited to 48/24.

Originally Posted by minister

No you're not, it records up to and including 96k. Check out the specs on their site.

They released the 788T hardware-ready for 24/96 in Apr 2008 and released the firmware to enable it in Feb 2009.

Originally Posted by PoxyMusic

At $5,000 though that's a lotta scratch.

Originally Posted by philper

Actually they are more than that: 788s are over $6k.

The HD model is $6K and the SSD model is $6.5K. I don't know if they ship HD models any more, but they're identical to the SSD version except for the disk, which is easy to upgrade.

[Baithak]

If you want a reliable longer term solution, I guess the choice boils down to either the Nagra VI or the SD 788. Both are sturdy, well designed machines. The Nagra gets a slight nod in terms of usability i.e. ease of use but the SD gets the nod for features - records 12 simultaneous tracks e.g., 8 mic/line inputs etc. There is still the debate about sound quality but you will have to judge that yourself.

The new Tascam is of course the joker in this pack. At a price of 1k, with six inputs, even if it does a decent job, it will find takers.

Here courtesy Trew Audio is a link to their non-linear recorder comparison PDF. A few things I noticed that are not correct, Sonosax has abandoned development on the 62, and the 788 track count is incorrectly stated as 8.

Trew Audio: Nonlinear Recorders

Good luck,
Baithak

Originally Posted by snir_gu

if someone have an helpfull link for comparison between the leading companies , i'll be more then glad..

thanks

[MichaelPatrick]

Originally Posted by Baithak

Here courtesy Trew Audio is a link to their non-linear recorder comparison PDF. A few things I noticed that are not correct, Sonosax has abandoned development on the 62, and the 788 track count is incorrectly stated as 8.

Trew Audio: Nonlinear Recorders

It seems that Trew article was never correct, it has several errors re the 788T probably because it was written before SD released more capable firmware. As already mentioned, it does 12 tracks @ 96K with concurrent 8 inputs. Other errors can only be attributed to sloppy work. For example, it has firewire, USB 2.0 and an onboard keyboard connector. The article says it has none of those.

[MichaelPatrick]

Originally Posted by maggot

last time I tried it there were serious issues with linking machines at 96kHz.
after a random amount of time one machine would lose sync for a fraction of a second but continue recording out of sync.

problem was worse with 3 machines but was not a problem at 192k.

SD were informed several times and have been given very detailed info but I have never heard back about a fix despite hassling them a few times.

maybe they fixed it and I didn't notice but in any case be very careful with linking machines in 96k (or one of it's pulled variants)

justin

Don't know about timecode, but audio has no problem if wordclock sync is established (i.e. not dependent on C-Link). I plan to use C-Link only to start/stop the recorders simultaneously. With wordclocks synchronized PCM sample alignment is assured.

[jason kanter]

Originally Posted by minister

No you're not, it records up to and including 96k. Check out the specs on their site.

Wow- haven't used one since '08 and didn't realize they updated it. Very good to know.

[snir_gu]

Originally Posted by PoxyMusic

To be sure. If one is doing location dialog, then there's no doubt the SD is the machine to use. For someone like me though, (recording field fx) the Tascam is pretty attractive. Many of the features of the SD are not so important to me. I've always been impressed with the SD preamps though, and when recording backgrounds that's pretty much the most important feature to me. I have a hard time thinking that Tascam could beat them.

I hate having to compromise... :(

well, i'm looking the best recorder for ambience and sfx recordings, i'm not deal with dialog recording so as you mention low noise system and quality silence pre's are the main issue for me ,
i got the rme quadmic that works nice for , maybe take it with the tascam be a good alternative to the expensive sd and nagra machins..

[snir_gu]

Originally Posted by Ozpeter

The R-44 (not the R-4) preamps seem well regarded in relation to the price point. If you found them noisy, then I suspect you will not be happy with anything at that kind of price point, so the Sound Devices range (or Nagra) may be required.

you got it right , the r-44 pre's are really bad for low level recordings, specally with 4 phantoms turned on , and the battery gone to much fast .
i use this machine with ext preamps from rme (quadmic) and it's the only way i could catch quiet recordings..
i wonder about this new tascam device, anyone have expirince with that machine..?