Mounting DPA 4061s on a stand - pics

[jnorman]

hi guys -here are some pics of a couple of little setups i threw together to stand-mount my DPA 4061s. any thoughts on improving it would be appreciated.

the first setup is a piece of black plastic channel strip (sort of like what you bind small reports in), strapped onto a cheap stereo bar with velcro cables straps, and the mics are fed into the channel, held in place just by the littel windscreens at the end, with the cables held in place by the outer wrap of the cable strap.

the second setup is a piece of black plastic tubing. i cut a hole in the middle, and fed the two mics through the hole and out the ends of the tubing. tubing held onto the stereo bar with velcro straps, mics held in place by the windscreens.

[boojum]

Cuter than my setup. You engineering types are good at stuff like this. A tip of the hat to you.

[studer58]

Thats a simple, low cost and quite elegant looking stereo bar. A possible reservation I might have would be that the bar itself, being lightweight and long and hollow, could be responsible for collecting and transmitting the very sounds you are looking at recording and presenting them to the rear of the mic capsule as vibrations or acoustic impulses ? Depends a lot on the volume level and type of music you plan to record. At worst imagine pointing a hollow cylinder towards a sound source and your listening ear at the other end...this is what you are presenting to the rear of your mics. A simple experiment would disclose how much of a factor this is likely to be...simply reverse the orientation of the mics, pointing each inside the tube, play some music into the room via speakers at appropriate level and record. What the mic 'hears' should be what's entering the hollow tube via acoustic transmission. Of course if your mics are much less sensitive at the rear, then any tube-borne pickup SHOULD be marginal. However, it's an experiment you could try if interested. An alternative would be to plug the tube with some liquid silicone from a dispenser gun to damp any vibes.
Ray

[jnorman]

ray - that is a good thought about tube resonance, thanks. a black rubber grommit or similar just behind each mic might help secure it in place and prevent the tube resonance. i am still experimenting with what i want this thing to look like and have not yet refined a final design. neither of the ideas shown would be anything i woudl try to use in a concert situation, but are probabaly stable enough to play around with in the studio for testing. i was sort of hoping to stimulate some other suggestions on a better solution, in terms of ease of setup and take down, sturdiness, and if possible, some manner of control over spread length and mic direction. some fellow made his extendable by making it from telescoping antenna parts.

[Petrus]

The thru-the-tube construction could indeed introduce cavity resonances and as the tube is thicker than the mic, also directionality anomalies. 406x series miniatures are as omni as they come, basically the back side of the mic is listening the tube. How about filling the tube with polyurethane construction foam when the mics are in place? (Just kidding...). I have filled my thicker carbon tube bars with PU foam or cleaning cotton, of course without any cables in them.

For those reasons I try to keep my 4060 mics slightly clear of the 6 mm carbon tubes I use as a stereo bar. It really does not matter acoustically which way try are pointing at, more an aesthetical thing.

[Audiop]

Good points from Petrus there.


/Peter

[didier.brest]

Originally Posted by Petrus

It really does not matter acoustically which way try are pointing at, more an aesthetical thing.

It may do matter a bit because according tho DPA graphs the 4060/4061 is omni directional at least up to 8 kHz but has significant directivity at 16 and 20 kHz.

[Petrus]

Originally Posted by didier.brest

It may do matter a bit because according tho DPA graphs the 4060/4061 is omni directional at least up to 8 kHz but has significant directivity at 16 and 20 kHz.

Not so. Only a 5 dB dip at 20 kHz. 406x series is the omniest mic in the world. Even at 16 kHz it is almost perfect. The top-of-the-line DPA4003 is 15 dB down at 20 kHz and 180 degrees.

Compare graphs between 4061 and DPA4003, The 130v Studio Omni.

4061 is a perfect circle up to 16 kHz, 4003 starts to look like a cardioid already at 10 kHz. And that mic can be considered one of the best omnis there is. If that is "omni", what does it make 406x??? "Significant directivity"?????

[rumleymusic]

Direction matters with these mics only when placed close to a baffle, as in the boundary mount. Just hanging in the air, I have twisted mine every which way and have not noticed a difference.

My mount is very simple. A 3ft slim carbon fiber rod with a neodymium bar magnet (left over from my home made ribbon microphone attempt) epoxied to the center. This sticks to the end of any metal microphone stand and the mics are taped with no residue gaffers tape to the correct position. Ghetto, but effective.

[studer58]

Here is a spaced AB pair stand I made from an IKEA light stand, adapted to hold a pair of MKH 8020 mics. The first orchestral pic is a bit confusing, since above the conductor you see a trapeze bar with KM183's but on this occasion the main pair were on the IKEA bar in front of the conductor. It serves my needs because it's thin and relatively light, yet the array is sturdy enough not to topple (unless it took a direct hit from a conductor's arm perhaps !) If you look closely you'll see it in use in other settings as well.....works fine for my purposes. An earlier link (with pics) to my construction methods is here: elegant tall mic stand... by IKEA

I ended up buying 3 stands (they were on special at $10 each) and bolting 3 of the square bases together to give sufficient mass to keep it upright.

[jnorman]

hey now - here's another idea for the 4061s. instead of a t-bar type mount, how about making "bodies" for the 4061s that will work with regular mic clips? whaddaya think??

[Corran]

That's a cute idea, though at that point why don't you just go buy some Earthworks?

On a more serious note, is there any reason why you can't just use a generic butterfly clip to hold the cable right behind the capsule, and string the cable just like normal to a stereo mic bar?

[jnorman]

hi bryan - i did bid on the pair of qtc-1's that were just on ebay, but didnt win them. the butterfly clips i have are far too big (like made to hold an sm57) to grab the teeny cord on the 4061s - maybe you are talking about something else/smaller? so far, i have spent $8.12 on supplies to make the three versions shown above, so my budget is just about shot...

[hbphotoav]

I've been putting mine up with a bit of carbon fiber rod (1/8th inch... used to be a wand in a photographic softbox). It's actually in two pieces, so I can, by gaffing them together at various points, make it anywhere from .5m (18") to just over 1m (38") long. I thread it through a SabraSom shock mount, wrap the wires around the rod, use a bit of gaff on the business end to affix the element, and run up whatever stand I need. Mics, rod, and mount might weigh a couple of ounces. The cables and MicroDot/XLR connectors weigh more by far.

See a picture here:

Gefell M296 and DPA 4061 Comparo

The same SabraSom shock mount holds a RODE NT4 quite nicely, horizontally or vertically (over a drum kit). One of the best accessories I have purchased.

[Corran]

Originally Posted by jnorman

hi bryan - i did bid on the pair of qtc-1's that were just on ebay, but didnt win them. the butterfly clips i have are far too big (like made to hold an sm57) to grab the teeny cord on the 4061s - maybe you are talking about something else/smaller? so far, i have spent $8.12 on supplies to make the three versions shown above, so my budget is just about shot...

That's too bad - I would have loved for you to do a shootout between the two. How much did they end up going for?

[jnorman]

the pair of qtc-1's went for $1425 with 16 bids.